"Take Back Control of our borders"

[verdantverdure]

AIBU to think the Brexiteer rallying cry of "Take Back Control of our borders" did not lead me to expect net migration at record levels, asylum seekers in small boats at record levels, and suspect diseased meat in Britain due to a lack of border checks seven years after the vote.

You?

YANBU This was not what I understood by the phrase "take back control of our borders"

YABU I know what I voted for, and it was exactly this. Diseased meat YUM!

unhinged ranting

For goodness sake.

Do feel free to provide evidence that 99% of people don't care any more.

To suggest that anyone who does still want to discuss the reason for and impact of the situation has mental health issues or counselling requirements is ridiculous and offensive. I'm not aware, by the way, of any counselling CPD focused on counselling people through Brexit. If it were necessary someone would undoubtedly have offered this allegedly necessary training by now.

The fact is for 95% of people it doesn’t affect them being inside or outside the EU. Makes no difference whatsoever. So either the moaners have too much time on their hands or MH issues

I don’t know anyone that even talks about this anymore.

Generally speaking, the only people I know who don't talk about it anymore are the people who voted for it as they now realise they were conned. The same people who were incredibly vocal in their support for Brexit seem strangely reluctant to make clear what the benefits are or discuss why we are materially poorer as a country. I will keep on discussing it as it has had a profound impact on family members and on the industry I work in. I will happily continue to be a 'remoaner' and point out the utter folly Brexit has become and the increasingly deluded stance its supporters cling on to.

I know LOTS of people who "still" talk about this. And yes, some of them are farmer who voted in favour of leave and now realise that they have been screwed over. Judging by the below, they are not alone:-

Asking people to not talk about this is kind of...

"Hey look your house is on fire!!"
"Yeah? Well I looked at it yesterday, and it wasn't, so I am not going to look today"
"But... your house is burning down!"
"Yeah - I made a decision and I am sticking with it!"

I came to the uk when I was five and DH came when he was 21. We left last year, the main reason being the Brexit vote. Am so thankful to have a passport which enabled me to easily leave. DT’s have graduate jobs - DS in Amsterdam and DD works for the EU in Brussels.

DH is a GP - the practice has now closed as the other GP’s were locums from EU countries and have also now left the UK. There are no GP’s in the uk to replace them

The UK is on a downward spiral

And again, do feel free to provide us with any evidence to prove this fact.

You won't because you can't.

It seems that public opinion has become more pronounced. I wonder why a party doesn’t use it to get votes at a GE.

I don’t hear people saying talk about it much anymore but I’m pretty sure most around me voted remain, in figures remain vote was high.

And you seem to have a lot of time on your hands to devote to a thread you could only summon up a yawn to initially.

The assertion that if people still care about it they have mental health issues is offensive.

Most of my friends and colleagues discuss it from time to time, too. It seems as though every few days, some new thing crops up that's more expensive/difficult/complicated thanks to Brexit.

Only the other day, my MIL was moaning about asylum seekers arriving by boat, so I pointed out that we no longer had the right to return them to the first safe EU country, like we did before Brexit.

🎶We don't talk about Brexit, no, no, no.

We don't talk about Brexit, but... 🎶

“Regardless, the fact remains that Brexit is dead. The only thing left to do is the political equivalent of disposing of the body.."

If it was dead it would be easy to overturn at next GE

For some reason it’s not wanted but no one will change much.

All the remainer noise, editorial, polling and commentary has lead nowhere. Why is that I wonder

Probably because no one wants to lose the Brexit voter.

Goodness @Blessedwithsunshine - that's twice now that you've suggested people who have differing opinions to you must have mental health issues. Like when a man tries to put down a woman who disagrees with him by asking if she's due on her period. Any credibility your views may have had becomes null and void once you start throwing out these kind of things.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who finds that assertion objectionable.

@ilovesooty & @RoseThornside

There's no rational, logical argument to continue allowing Brexit to damage our country in the ways that it is.

It's not as if "I think Brexit is quite good really" is something anyone could say with a straight face.

So all there is is the slogans like "Brexit is done" (as if that's final and we're not a democracy any more so we just have to sit and watch our country spiral ever lower.)

And rudeness and inappropriateness.

But none of that is much of a match for reality.

Brexit is dead.

It's not resting, or pining for the fjords.

It's just been nailed firmly onto its perch. But that won't fool most people for long.

You've got to admire Starmer though. He's playing this beautifully. I can hardly fault him.

Really? I don’t see that. I mean I get posters keep saying it yet there it is parties wanting the Brexit voter at the next GE. They don’t really care if Remainers are angry, it’s the Brexit voter they don’t want to lose.

I was hoping for the next GE as an opportunity to reverse in some way. High poll lead, open goal.

The clamouring for the Brexit vote by Labour looks like remain is dead. They have been out for too long to be brave, over a decade, so a cowardly fudge for the Brexit vote it is.

It won’t go in the manifesto and five years is a long time.

Current version of Labour doesn’t bring me much joy but a bolder take I could have looked forward to. It’s a shame. Even Blair had a bit on this the other day.

It’s weird that people say ‘Brexit is dead’ when even the opposition are dancing around regurgitating the Take Back Control line.

But in the real world it wouldn’t work like that. We can’t just undo the thing now and simply rejoin, public opinion behind it or not. We would have to become accepted as members, and that won’t be simple. So it’s not actually on offer.

Secondly it would open up the whole debate/fight again. We’ve had years of that now. The prospect of years more is not an election winner. That doesn’t mean you can’t work in the right direction though. That’s about all anyone can offer but it won’t happen until you’ve got this govt/s gone, too many lunatics and they’re just fighting between themselves and reality, and here we are. It’s almost looking like we might have a 5th(!!) PM if this one goes. It’s ducking diabolical.

The ‘real world’ is trying to get votes to win a GE

People keep posting charts re dissatisfaction with Brexit. A statement opposing SM or CU two years before GE and a re use of Brexit line is a clear intention to not lose the Brexit voter.

Remainers may be angry but they’re going to mostly vote Labour anyway. Labour want to win even more after so many defeats - and if it means catering to Brexit so be it.

People keep posting charts re dissatisfaction with Brexit

Yes, but that doesn’t translate into simply undoing it, because thats not the reality of it, that’s what I mean. It’s a years and possibly decades thing. You can’t just stick that as an election pledge unless your names David Cameron of course

Why not?

How long would it take to join SM or CU?

It doesn’t have to be full on rejoin in EU

All the commentary I’ve heard on this suggests it’s a political decision not practical barrier

Since MPs on both sides are not willing to go there as they don’t want to lose the Brexit voter I haven’t heard much on why. I googled, a few things came up including this

‘This does not mean opening a debate about rejoining the EU. That ship sailed some time ago. But there is a new possibility. The EU has held out an olive branch: to join a grouping of European countries that don’t want to be part of the EU but do want to benefit from its single market and many collaborative bodies.’

It’s The Guardian and yes remain bias but it seems outside politics people are asking the same question.

All they have to do is renegotiate the Brexit deal @Lonelycrab. If Gibraltar can be part of Schengen we can be in the EFTA.

During the referendum campaign Brexiteers said we'd still be in Erasmus, Horizon, Reach, Europol, the Kite Mark, the Single Market and the Customs Union and probably more that I have forgotten so the first steps will be to renegotiate the deal so we realign. We can do that easily because the Leave campaign lied so much. We could have a Norway type deal any time we like.

Then we need greater cooperation and a pan Europe plan over things like semi conductors, future pandemics, energy, Defence, Russia, China...

Then the debate will be rule takers versus rule makers, and if we want a say we have to rejoin.

Then all we need is a referendum.

Back in for the 10th anniversary of the referendum? If not before.

How long would it take to join SM or CU?

I don’t know. How long do you think it would take?

@MarshaBradyo is right.

So long as they keep telling the Brexit fanatics that it's still Brexit and we're not rejoining the EU, most won't care about the details.