To think trans women don't belong in womens prisons for women

[NeedToChangeName]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-64444530

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The longer this is kept in the public eye, the more politicians will know that it's a concern

Private Eye was spot on this week about La Sturgeon. She has realised that her views were unpopular, she has to transition and now believes that sending transwomen to female prisons is creating risk to other women - and one woman in particular ie. her.

No, your barrel is being scraped because all you can do is screech about spaces and how your rights are being eroded but not actually give any examples of how your rights are being eroded. People in prison should be safe and protected. No one is disagreeing with that.

'screech'

'I'll just skip all the responses to my ludicrous question and go straight to sexist hyperbole, thanks'

It is a waste of time - I’ve been trying to get some sense out of them for two days. I bet they don’t put these views on their Facebook or LinkedIn for all to see.

What do you mean?

That women on here who state you can’t change sex and males shouldn’t be in female prisons should somehow hide that?

It’s not controversial

It is a waste of time - I’ve been trying to get some sense out of them for two days. I bet they don’t put these views on their Facebook or LinkedIn for all to see.

What, that you can't change sex and that single sex spaces matter? I don't see why people would be ashamed of scientific literacy and basic safeguarding principles. Care to elaborate?

@Clarabell77 if anyone has been screeching it's you. You've had far more measured, informative responses than quite frankly you've deserved and you've responded by stropping.

You have made it clear you disagree, but not how.

Resolve the conflict in rights without retreating to any variant of "well, I'm alright, Jacqueline".

Should female prisons be made mixed sex? Yes or no. Pick one.

Really.... you are continuing with one of the worst 'attempts' that I have seen on this board for a long time.

The 'because it is not happening to you, you cannot fight for other women' approach.

And you actually think that you look like you have some kind of moral superiority on this thread. I am rarely completely flummoxed by someone's total lack of self awareness.

I would consider that you have had people answer where rights are eroded, but you are not able to comprehend those answers because of your own barriers to comprehension.

Fucked up parameters rarely lead to understanding.

.

I recommend that if you want answers to any question other than something about women's prisons, go start your own thread and stop derailing this one.

The 'start a new thread' button is just above the page numbers on the top. Have at it.

Make sure that you use that very same wording too. You know the one that tells women that they cannot fight collectively for women's and girl's rights! You know.... on a parent's forum with many feminists.

Make sure you tell parents that they cannot fight for their child's rights. Because it doesn't impact on the parent just the child.

I reckon you will get plenty of posts. I encourage you to do it exactly as you have done it here.

I am sure that NowDoYouBelieve will support you.

No one is trying to make female prisons mixed sex, so I’ve no idea why that is your question.

If the question is “should trans women be in women’s prisons” then my answer would be that it depends on the individual circumstances. That’s in line with current law and it’s up to the prison service to assess those circumstances and place accordingly. If I was to say no they shouldn’t I would be going against the equality act.

No one is trying to make female prisons mixed sex, so I’ve no idea why that is your question.

Any male housed in a female prison by nature makes it mixed sex.

That you cannot see the logic of this shows that you are unable to comprehend basic science and you are incredibly dishonest.

Just own that you are happy for prisons that are supposed to be single sex for female people, to be mixed sex. I doubt there are any readers of this thread who will find your falsehoods credible.

TW are not females so unless the answer is an absolute flat 'no' then you are trying to make female prisons mixed sex. You can try and gaslight all you want but people do know what female means and it has nothing to do with identity.

See this person? Placed in a women's prison, thus making it mixed sex.

He didn't put himself in there- he doesn't have that much agency. He was placed there, just like all the males who have been put in traditionally female-only prisons.

So clearly lots of people are trying to make female prisons mixed-sex, aren't they?

People in prison should be safe and protected. No one is disagreeing with that.

As should 'people' i.e., women, and indeed children, in single sex spaces and services or do you think it was perfectly reasonable for a man on charges of rape to attend a beauty course and for the women there (mostly young) to have to strip off in front him and to be accused of transphobia if they didn't? Women and children are also entitled to privacy and dignity or do you disagree with that as well?

The answer is simple - NO males, however they identify, whatever they have done to themselves physically, cosmetically or chemically whether or not they have a piece of paper (that is an item of fiction) to access single sex female only spaces, services and sports.

If these men don't want to be with the other members of their sex class than they need to put forward alternative options that do not involve using females spaces.

FGS, your second paragraph completely contradicts your first.

No one is trying to make female prisons mixed sex....?

Sweetie, the moment a male prisoner is there, it's mixed sex. You cannot have a male in a female space without it becoming mixed sex.

There is no good you implying that male people with TQ+ identities are female: literally the one single required characteristic of a transwoman is that they are biologically male. And you know this, as in the next breath you say transwomen should only be admitted to a female space on a case by case basis.

Because they are male.

As for 'you can't give examples of how your spaces are being affected' -

fgs you might identify as there being no examples, the board and this thread is littered with them. Dolotowski's victims. The women who had Bryson dumped on them. The women of WiSpa. Baroness Nicholson working on the case of the NHS hospital ward rape - she has said she is looking at a range of cases and think they will number over 50 to approaching 100. The women who are losing out on awards and fair sport. The teenaged girls not using the toilets.

All of the above being why I have personally reached the point of writing to my MP and anyone else I can to demand that no male people of any identity at all are permitted into single sex female spaces. The answers to those people's needs will have to be found without removing those spaces from females and just seeing females as a therapeutic resource who don't matter so long as male people are nurtured. Especially apparently the violent rapist ones.

I agree. Somebody on Question Time last night said that the person was held in solitary in the womens prison so no women prisoners were at risk. Somebody else said why can't they be held in solitary in a mens prison. Which I think is fair comment I think.

Why are references to Young Earth Creationists against Talk Guidelines?

It is.

And the question then arises: if the prisoner is in solitary in the male estate as too vulnerable to other men, and in solitary in the female estate as too dangerous to women, then surely a TQ+ specialist unit would work better.

Unless the solitary part is solely because the prisoner is too dangerous to associate with anyone at all, in which case it doesn't matter where they're placed.

FGS, your second paragraph completely contradicts your first

yes it does

i had to read it a fee times to make sure i wasn’t mistaken