Family comes first surely ?

[Pinkchenille]

4 years ago my friend started a cleaning business. My mum was looking for a cleaner so I gave her my friends number . After 18 months or so she started to clean for my mums ndn too.

My mum has always had the opinion that if you want something you work for it so isn’t very forthcoming with helping out when I’ve struggled but my youngest is now in full time school so I wanted to work but I’ve not been able to for years due to some medical issues . I said to my mum would she consider letting me be her cleaner and as she has that kind of work ethic opinion mentioned above she was happy to do this as she would be helping me out but I wouldn’t be doing nothing in return.

she gave her cleaner (my friend) notice and I’ve now been cleaning for her a few weeks . Her ndn is one of her best friends as they’ve lived there for over 30 years and she had been talking to her and ndn has now given notice and asked me will i clean for her too (she’s aware of my medical issues and knows this will make throngs easier for me I’ve known her years and it was her suggestion)

My friend (well I’m not sure if she is anymore) has accused me of poaching her clients !!! But I’m not . They had given notice and yes I asked my mum but i didn’t approach her ndn. She’s says I shouldn’t have asked my mum but it’s my mum and surely family comes first especially given my circumstances 😞

OP has poached their friend's clients but they said very early on in the thread they had autism and so of course their responses/thought processes around how it would affect their friend are going to differ from someone NT. Give them a break!

Inform the DSS, in case your aggrieved ex-friend does, just to make sure it doesn't affect your benefits.

Are you trying to say all autistic people are alike or that you represent 100% of them so therefore you are somehow superior?

I think you should claim UC, stop getting cash in hand payments from your Mum and ndn, apologise to your friend and get them to give her the jobs back.

Also in future try to graciously accept what a large large majority of people are trying to tell you, rather than keep making excuses. Sometimes its better to just swallow your pride and admit you've acted unreasonably.

I hope you aren't saying (as you appear to be) that people with autism don't understand how friendship works and can't appreciate the impact of their own actions.
Because that would be pretty offensive.

I would never do this to a friend. It is just morally wrong. How do you know tour friend is not relying on the money from these two jobs? You could have advertised and found your own clients. If I was the friend in this scenario and you had treated me this way I would report you for benefit fraud.

*Starting work need not be a relevant change of circumstances. Has anything changed? Have symptoms eased or has some medication been found that has made a difference? "

@thebigwangtheory no again I state starting work is NOT something you have to report if you are getting PIP. Only changes to your health/ disability! If you are using a source then at least read it first. The above quote is taken from your link.

You're supposed to report it so that THEY can decide if there is a relevant change. It's not for you to decide. Going out to do a cleaning is job is very likely to need a reassessment, because it obviuously mirrors a lot of home tasks that you're probably telling them you need help with.

A change in circumstances refers to a change in your health, medication,condition etc etc, as far as PIP goes.

IF the OP has claimed they can't clean and tidy their own home, can't push a vacuum around or wipe paintwork down, and then goes to do just that in her mothers house and neighbours house because in fact she CAN do them (safely, reliably/repeatedly, in a sensible timeframe).. then that would be a fraudulent claim.

If she can force herself to do them but its not safe, takes ages, makes her ill/causes her pain etc etc.. and she chooses to do that, that isn't a change in her health circumstances and no, she doesn't have to tell them.

A CoC will also take MONTHS to be reviewed and assessed, she may well find if she tries that actually she really can't force herself to do it at all in which case, all this is rather a moot point.

Can you imagine the paperwork the DWP would have on top of that which they alread cannot manage and are YEARS behind in dealing with people (still waiting for a CoC... I've now been assessed, 19 months I waited... ill probably wait another two for a decision!)... if people submitted a CoC because they've decided to have a crack at either a/something different but lies within their capablities as already assessed or b/something they're fairly sure will be shitty and painful and risky to do but they're fucking desperate for the money.

Do you want to live in a country where disabled people have to work as long as they physically can attempt it, no matter how painful or bad for their health it is?

I don't like in the UK, we have a much more sensible system of benefits that is more generous and easier to get.
But if you're getting PIP, you need to inform them if you start work and let them decide if you need to be reassessed. That's the rules.

Lol WTF! If I were to start a business, my family would come to ME. That’s not poaching, that’s how families work.

Poached your mums neighbour? Hmm probably yes, but your mum? No !

Alright Cathy Newman

Can't believe people are being so unpleasant to the OP on this thread! She's clearly facing a lot of challenges, both social and health wise and is doing what she can to support her family.
Yes of course family comes first and while what you've done is annoying and your friend has every right to be annoyed with you, when it really comes down to it I think most of us would put food on the table for our children rather than keep a friend happy.
The best course of action would seem to be to explain to your friend that you are in dire straits, that you see no other way of getting money, that you understand she's really annoyed, and apologise to her. Then it's up to her how she responds.

I don't understand the debate tbh.

You did poach her clients, the fact she's your mum is irrelevant. That's just the facts of what happened. Were you wrong to do so? That's the actual question. I think most people would choose feeding their children over a friend's hurt feelings to be honest, so whilst you definitely poached them I also don't blame you for doing so. And I don't blame your mum and ndn for wanting to support you (though I do think your mum has a weird attitude that she won't help her unwell daughter without some physical labour first...)

But at the same time, you can hardly be surprised that your friend is upset. It was very obviously going to cause hurt feelings. Sometimes we are faced with tough choices, and we have to do things that hurt people's feelings when it's something like having money to feed our children and heat their home on the line. That's life unfortunately, but you can't try and stop people from being upset by things that negatively affect them.

You should certainly declare your earnings so it doesn't come back to bite you later. Please look into UC too.

I don't think you've done anything wrong OP but I also think the other cleaner is also right to be a bit annoyed.

Regardless of numbers of clients, your friend is earning less than they were before as a direct result of you taking on board two of her clients. Now think about losing say £50 a week from your earnings because a friend had directly taken a job that you had, you'd be pretty annoyed too, right?

You didn't do anything particularly wrong, this is one of those circumstances though that was always going to piss someone off.

Some, actually most, of these replies are just nuts.

For goodness sake, OP is doing a bit of cleaning for her own mum and a couple hours for her mums elderly neighbour and getting a few quid in hand for it. Less than £1000 a year. Because times are tough and they need food and electric. Not so she can spend weekends on her luxury yacht in the med. She's hardly starting a billion pound company and avoiding paying hundreds in tax! Have none of you never ever done a simple job for a friend or neighbour and been chucked a could of quid for it? Or hired a mate to do something and paid a little less 'for cash'?.

Gain a little perspective.

Honestly, yes of course it should be 'declared', but shes hardly going to bankrupt the country doing a couple hours cleaning for 2 elderly people, one of whom is her mother and the other her mothers friend. It may well not affect her benefits anyway. Well, it shouldn't. Surely its better for OP to be out doing something and keeping her off the bread line than sitting at home doing nothing. If she turns it into an actual 'business' thats different. But for less than £100 a month, shes hardly retiring anytime soon.

If I knew someone who had a host of medical issues and was doing a couple of hours a week cleaning for a friend or relative in order to be able to put food on the table, no way would I report them. Its such a small amount, but makes a big difference to OP. If that someone was cleaning everyday and running a business while claiming benefits, thats a totally totally different scenario!

As for poaching clients. Again, its OPs mother! Would you seriously not give some cleaning work to your own child over a stranger if your child needed the money to survive? Same for the family friend next door. OP didn't poach clients, your friend is being ridiculous OP, although I can see she may be a bit annoyed at losing the work. If you were actually starting a business up, I can see her point, but you are not so shes being ridiculous.

I hope the cleaning works out for you. And I'm sure its doing you a world of good just getting out of the house, and helping to pay the family bills.

If I had a reliable cleaner I would treat them with respect and at least give them notice, not just drop them and swap them to benefit my daughter.

Of course you’ve poached her clients!

Now my mum isn’t perfect, by any stretch, but she’d NEVER make me clean her house if she was in a position to just give me money, for the sake of seeing me ‘work for something’. She’s give me the clothes off her back if it’s the last thing she had, even if I spent my days sat on my arse.

It literally said in the opening OP that they gave her notice 🙄

You did poach her clients, the fact she's your mum is irrelevant

Of course it's not irrelevant. I don't really believe the people on this thread think that.

Anyway as I said above, if the friend is a decent cleaner she'll already have new clients. Cleaners are supposedly hard to come by (I am too working class to have "staff" so don't have one).

I don't disagree, but that's a different point.

The OP was not unreasonable. But neither is her friend.

@lieselotte why is it not poaching if it's her mum? I clearly said that I didn't blame OP for doing so, but it's undeniable that OP's mum was once the friend's client, and is now OP's client after OP asked her to swap to her. That's poaching 🤷‍♀️

I cant believe this thread is still going over 2 clients.
The clients could've been poached by anyone.

They could have been, but they weren't. They were poached by a friend who didn't even have the grace to acknowledge it was less than polite, let alone say sorry.

The OP is entirely unreasonable for the way she went about it, more than actually doing it. She didn't have to be such a dick about it.

Just let it go. It's business.
In the grand scheme of the year it's pennies. The other person needs to find more clients, and sell themselves.