To think menopause cannot be used as an excuse?

[Woodpeckerupatree]

Maybe this will be me in ten years’ time. Who knows? But my menopausal boss is driving me mad! There is so much at work to protect those going through the menopause, this policy, that policy etc. but what about us poor buggers working for someone who is menopausal? The constant forgetting things, forgetting she’s told us to do stuff, forgetting she’s told us not to do stuff and then being blamed for not doing whatever she remembers as right. It’s soul destroying. We used to get on well but now it’s like walking on egg shells. I can’t take much more! There’s also the coming in late constantly because she says she can’t sleep, leaving me and other underlings to cover above our grade… I could find another job but feel like I shouldn’t be forced out because of this!

Hmmm! Interesting! Having been through the menopause I can totally get her situation, but also understand how awkward it might be for you. Do you know if she's taking HRT or getting any help with her menopause? Could you speak to her directly about it, or would that be a no, no, where you work? Otherwise, perhaps speak to HR about it, and ask if they can speak to her, as she's clearly suffering, but so are you.

…it’s probably not a picnic for her either.

Like you said, this could very well be you in a year. Maybe have a little sympathy. The menopause can be absolute hell on earth for a lot of women. I’m pretty sure she’s not enjoying it either.

NGL if I could afford to leave work I would.
Some of these symptoms are distressing and the brain fog/memory issues are very real! I don’t manage anyone btw, & work in an office alone, but I am struggling. You do have my sympathy though, it must be tough having an actual boss behaving in that way but imagine how she feels!

www.peoplemanagement.co.uk/article/1754967/one-10-women-quit-job-menopause-symptoms-survey-reveals

That’s the thing. I know she’s struggling. She told be herself that her family have told her she’s a nightmare but she laughed it off and said she wasn’t too bad. She is! But won’t/can’t see it. I’m not unsympathetic, I’ve seen my mum and aunt suffer over the years. But - the way she treats us, talks down to us, is snappy and grumpy as if we’re toddlers? It’s just wrong. And she can turn it on and off like a tap, so the big bosses come in and she’s all smiles, with us, her team, she’s her true self.

It will be you one day. Look for practical ways round it - I’m sure she’s quite distressed by the brain fog too. Use some sort of internal messaging do everyone can refer back to it ?

And she can turn it on and off like a tap, so the big bosses come in and she’s all smiles, with us, her team, she’s her true self.

That’s not okay. You wouldn’t get away with it for any other reason including pregnancy, which also isn’t a barrel of laughs for a lot of women.

It’s not an excuse, it’s a reason! I’m sick and tired of anything affecting a woman being swept under the carpet, whether it’s co-workers saying “it’s not an illness” to anyone affected by pregnancy issues to the changes caused by the menopause. You can bet your bottom dollar if it was men who had periods, got pregnant and went through the menopause that every policy and adjustment would be made as a matter of course.

I have considerable sympathy. Your boss needs to manage her own condition. She must know that it is causing problems.

The menopause sob sisters will be weighing in soon to give you a kicking, but my view, as a 51 year old woman, is that whilst employers can be sympathetic they can’t be expected to arrange the business around one or more employees’ menopause symptoms.

My view is coloured by my dislike of the menopause narrative that we’re increasing fed. Which is that women over the age of 45 need careful handling, the poor dears. Don’t give them anything difficult to do, they’ll cry! Don’t expect them to remember anything, they’ll have brain fog! Peddled by flint eyed chancers like Davina McCall, ever keen to monetise something like this.

Unless you go down the official route this will never change report it
shes more likely to get support than a disciplinary

Maybe instead of complaining about her on MN, you can ask her for a 1 to 1 meeting and tell her your opinion while offering solutions and help.

Oh I totally understand!!! My last boss went through the menopause and it was absolute hell. I totally understand that it was hell for her too (and I'm no where near the menopause personally so couldn't appreciate it totally) but in my opinion if you're a people manager you need to put in place coping strategies and workarounds - you can't let your personal health impact people you manage.

It's not good that she can put the effort in for the senior bosses and turn on the charm, but not for the people she manages.

If she's unable to cope in her role or do it efficiently because of her health then it's a business issue which needs to be managed by her managers, it's not fair on you all and it's on them to sort it.

It's really difficult when health impacts someone's ability to work. It's right that there are protections in place, and collegues are sympathetic, but there often does seem to be a lack of protection for everyone else who is impacted. I have the opposite situation, I manage a lady at this stage of life and the forgetfulness is particularly frustrating and can reflect poorly on me. I also work with someone whose anxiety means they haven't been able to deliver a significant part of their job for several years now, and colleagues are just expected to pick up the slack in addition to their own workloads. I really feel for both of them in their situations, but when there's no end in sight it's can put a lot of pressure on colleagues

It will be you one day.

You can’t say that. Yes, the OP will go through menopause, but she won’t necessarily exhibit behaviours like that, so it won’t ‘be her’ one day. Said as a peri-menopausal woman.

OP - I would approach HR if you have one, and make sure you record, and either share or file, all directives.

@Cluelessasacucumber - this is exactly it! It’s the constant low level expectation that we (or I, as the most senior of the underlines, as it were) will cover and catch her and stay late to make up for her failings. I know she can’t help it (objectively) but I’m at the stage where I almost want her to fail because I’m so so sick of it. And that’s not me or nice at all.

*underlings

Peddled by flint eyed chancers like Davina McCall, ever keen to monetise something like this.

😂

I'm grateful that more is known about it now but it's really becoming a 'thing' and I don't think it does women any favours - it's just another stick for the men to beat us with isn't it, something else that implies we cant cope.

Maybe take her aside and offer some concrete strategies. For example, to help her keep track you could email her stuff. 'As per our convo, I am awaiting your decision on xx before I can proceed with xxx.

As for her mood swings it might be wise to grey rock her. But if it's affecting your mental health or ability to do your job flag it up as compassionately as you can to HR.

My previously very together manager is similar and as a team we recognise it and support her. She is a very fit, active and proactive 58 year old. She has always been supportive of us through various life issues and health problems and we are of her. The difference in our case seems to be mutual respect. Despite her being a very private person, and uncomfortable with the 'human' part of the job in some ways, we absolutely know we can talk to her and she has always had our back.

Come back when you go through it yourself.

Probably not but if this behaviour I'd different, then it sounds genuine so maybe give her a break. Although she should write things down if she's forgetting things, and that's no excuse to come in late etc so what she can mitigate, she should

Agreed, it’s another box to pigeon hole us in.

in my opinion if you're a people manager you need to put in place coping strategies and workarounds - you can't let your personal health impact people you manage.

I agree, you don't deny it's happening - if you know the menopause is affecting you, you deal with it. So if you forget things, you make lists and tick things off. You make requests by email/instant message so you know you've done them.

OP I would suggest that you also document when she has asked you to do something, so she knows she'd done it (I mean if she asks you verbally, note it). You can't prove a negative but you can say "well I always note down when you ask me to do something, so this time you didn't ask me".

It's not good that she can put the effort in for the senior bosses and turn on the charm, but not for the people she manages and I'd tell her you've noticed this and it isn't acceptable. That is very different from menopausal symptoms.

You kind of are being U and kind of not.

What concerns me greatly is the current "trend" of putting everything down to menopause (or, the new in-word, peri-menopause)

Like @Iamthewombat I'm uncomfortable with celebrities literally making a living and acquiring pseudo -scientific-guru status out of it. I find it concerning that women trust a TV presenter more than a doctor AND more than their own bodies.

Some of the threads I've seen on here are utterly ludicrous. "my big toe hurts, could it be peri?" "I got told off at work for fucking something up, but I'm peri" "I cried at a documentary about dead kittens, it's the peri"

None of which does women, in or out of the workplace, in menopause, any favours whatsoever.

Yes, historically, there has been a put up and shut up attitude to it, and a lack of knowledge. But we're at the tipping point and in danger of going over.

Women who need medical intervention because of menopause should get it. Women still unable to do their jobs professionally despite that intervention should get out of the kitchen. The narrative is in danger of doing far more harm to women in the workplace than good.

OP- take your concerns to HR. You have the right to have a professional and efficient line manager, whatever her hormones are doing.

I'm post menopause by the way.