For me to be a SAHM my DH would have to earn.....

[CPHB2021]

Following on from a thread of 'if you knew all would be ok, I would...' and a resounding about said 'leave work and be a SAHP' I would absolutely LOVE to do this and by scraping the barrel, we probably could but we'd have little to no disposable income. I would only leave if I was able to still take my children to do things, meet friends for coffee etc. Go abroad once a year still. Have some money in savings. I often wonder HOW some of the mums at school don't work, we are technically 'above average' income which seem LUDICROUS given that we use almost all of it, every month! We live in the SE and I think our outgoings must be quite high! How much would one person have to earn for you to leave work?

Wow I am always amazed at some of the salaries on mumsnet.

Me leaving work turned out to be a bit of career suicide as I developed a health condition as well.

However. We managed and I still would go back and spend the 0-5 years with the kids. It was incredible experience and would have missed so much for me personally. In our area its quite unusual for a mum to work full time but there are a few. I might have felt differently if I lived somewhere more wealthy perhaps.

@4thonthe4th do you have a partner and if so do they work? What’s their reason to work and why are they not a SAHP?
Also to say that SAHMs don’t spend all their time cleaning is quite contradictory to most of the SAHM threads on here.

I don’t know any man that says he needs a job for self esteem, social interaction and having something outside the home. If they did, of course that would be equally as sad. I think our lives should have so much more to them.
Men don't need to say it. There is an expectation that men will go out to work. Nobody questions their motivation for working once they have children.

Women are asked this question regularly.

I don’t judge anyone for enjoying their job. I do find it genuinely sad that they do it because they don’t have anything else.

But nobody is saying they do it because they have nothing else.
It's not as black and white as that is it?

Work is very important to me but that doesn't mean I don't have friends and doesn't mean I don't enjoy being with my child. It's okay to want a variety of activities in your life which can include work.

However, you are looking at this through rose tinted glasses and ignoring the fact that for many women maternity leave and being a SAHP can be very isolating. Not all areas have a plethora of groups and activities or groups of other SAHPs to socialise with. For some people work might provide that social interaction and that's okay.

The poster is being goady it’s clearly hit a nerve. Apparently all the stay at home mums she knows have cleaners and don’t actually have kids at home, so I’m not sure if no kids at home how they are sahmS…😂

That’s brilliant. The poster I actually responded to said work was for social interaction and to have a life outside the home. Other pps have said they were bored and lonely. Do you not think it’s healthy to have more to life than a job?

Who are you to judge though? And clearly if someone has a family then they do have more in their life than a job but that job might be fulfilling are really important role, such as social interaction. People are complex and often have their needs met from a variety of sources. Why is that a bad thing?

For many people work is so much more than just a process of earning money. It can be an excellent form of social interaction, it can build your self esteem and it can feel good to have an identity that is more than being a mum. Again, I have to question why that is automatically a bad thing.

To match our current take-home salary, DH would need to be on a minimum of 90k a year. Funnily enough this is actually slightly less than what we gross currently, but I have a student loan and he doesn't, so obviously we would benefit in that sense if he was the sole earner.

Would I want to be a SAHM? No. Fair play to all the women who do it but I don't have it in me. I need the additional mental stimulation of what my job gives me and I need an identity separate from being a mum. I found my mat leave quite hard and was quite looking forward to going back to work in the end! It doesn't mean I don't love my DD any less, but I know she gets a much better nurturing environment with the childminder than I could give her every day.

Also, as much as I love my DH, he would never want to work hard enough to get a 90k salary. He is content in what he does, with his current level of autonomy, at approximately 37k a year. It's a cushty job with a great pension (public sector) so I can't blame him.

My partner is on roughly 25k and I'm a sahm. we get by just fine but we're in an incredible position where our house is paid for and we don't have a rent or mortgage. If I got a job we would be worse off as we have two under 3s and childcare is insane. So we have to make do for now. We don't get to save but we don't struggle for food or anything so I count us as extremely blessed

I think it's all so very personal.

I have never been a "hobby" person, I find my work very satisfying, there isn't really a hobby or other thing that would scratch that itch for me. I fully intend to continue working in retirement - just freelance/very part time. I don't think that is pathetic or sad, I feel very fortunate that I enjoy something that also pays well.

But I totally get that if you have lots of hobbies and pastimes that aren't paid work, you're in a different place and I don't think that is a bad thing either.

I do think women are socialised in the main to think of their jobs as additional or optional - I think that can lead to bad outcomes for some women.

@4thonthe4th

I don’t know any man that says he needs a job for self esteem, social interaction and having something outside the home. If they did, of course that would be equally as sad. I think our lives should have so much more to them.
I don’t judge anyone for enjoying their job. I do find it genuinely sad that they do it because they don’t have anything else.

Let's just unpick this a bit because I think your assumptions are unhelpful to a lot of women. Of course men don't say they need a job for self esteem or social interaction, because it's expected that men will work so no one questions it. Men aren't expected justify wanting to work, so they don't.

No one would ask a mother of small children: "why do you feel the need to have children?" Not everyone wants children but no one thinks its weird, unorthodox or "sad" that they do want to.

The reason why people question women working is precisely because at various points in our history it has been seen as unnecessary and undesirable for women to work and even today there are barriers to women working. As I'm sure you know.

You assume that when women work they do so because "they don't have anything else". Why do you assume that? I see this statement parroted around these boards so much, the assumption that work is a substitute for some lack inside and that people who do so only do it because there is something wrong elsewhere in their lives.

No one ever accuses a man of taking a job to fill the abyss within. They assume that men work mostly for money but also for interest, intellectual stimulation, social interaction, status, all sorts of other ancillary but perfectly valid reasons.

You clearly have never stopped to question the reasons why a man would work, but you do for women. Why is that?

I'm genuinely not trying to pick a fight: there are a lot of fairly unhelpful attacks on SAHMs on these boards and people are high-handed and nasty.

But attacking women for wanting to work is a profoundly negative and damaging thing to do. Our right to work is an absolutely pivotal step in protecting us from poverty and financial abuse. You're totally within your rights to defend women who choose to stay at home but please don't imply that women who want to work are damaged or misguided.

I think it's all so very personal.

I have never been a "hobby" person, I find my work very satisfying, there isn't really a hobby or other thing that would scratch that itch for me. I fully intend to continue working in retirement - just freelance/very part time. I don't think that is pathetic or sad, I feel very fortunate that I enjoy something that also pays well.

But I totally get that if you have lots of hobbies and pastimes that aren't paid work, you're in a different place and I don't think that is a bad thing

My husband felt huge pressure during the time I was a SAHM (less than 3 years). All the financial responsibility was on him
Lot of resentment on both sides
Our 2nd was a terrible sleeper and our first was still getting up at night so we'd have to do one each. Both knackered then he'd have a fairly long commute to work every day and I'd be with the kids all day and couldn't nap because I had a toddler. It was tough. We both thought the other one had the easier time of it
I have friends and family who both mutually agreed for the woman to stay at home with the kids but then the man constantly throws it back at them that they earn the money, thinking they do nothing all day. Not having equal access to money. Woman scrimping for everything and the man driving an amazing gas guzzling car and playing golf every weekend
Now kids are older they are both working but the woman part time and low pay as has to work around the kids/school etc as man can't possible help as they have very important job. Still being criticised as not earning enough. Will carry on forever as pension will be low etc
Never realise that they've only been able to increase their pay because the wife/partner has literally done everything around the house and everything with the kids to allow them to do so

We lived off my income while DH did his PhD then swopped to living off his income while I combined being at home with the DCs and doing an OU degree.

We had never had a "double income" lifestyle, so there was no problem there. I took the kids to the library, swimming lessons, baby French classes (waste of time!), we went to the park with friends, we visited the grandparents or friends by way of holidays.

The kids wore hand-me-downs / gifts from grandparents.

It delayed us moving up the property ladder, and meant we didn't have savings, but they were very happy years.

I don't think we'll ever be in a position where I could be a SAHM. My husband earns about £35k and I'm on £20k. Realistically after this maternity leave I may be able to look for something part time but at the moment it's not even on my radar with the cost of everything going up.

This thread has been very helpful - I didn’t know DH should be paying into a pension for me and he is now going to do that. Thanks everyone discussing pensions!

I wouldn't want to. I enjoy my job and I'm shit with money. so don't want it to be a scarce resource.

Can you share what you do with your time as SAHM to give us a better idea?

I always find it really sad that these threads descend into bickering about womens roles. It’s always the same and always obvious that there’s ‘issues’ on both sides of the fence. Just because for one person there’s a focus on work and another wants to focus on another aspect of life doesn’t mean that one is right and the other is wrong. There’s billions of people living lives very differently; you just have to make the choices you want for your life. The comments on threads with SAHM vs working are always full of bitchy judgements. I find it really sad that it’s still the case for women even now x

@sjxoxo totally agree. Women can be women's worst enemy. The world would be very boring if we all wanted to do the same thing.

You absolutely should look at children as a financial risk, and indeed, a financial liability. Because they are.

It is very naïve and short-sighted not to. "You shouldn't have (so many) kids if you can't afford them is a message regularly spouted, both on here and in the wider media.

Exposing yourself to financial risk does not make you a better parent or mean you love your children more.

For heaven’s sake, the context on Mn is endless threads annually from women trapped in miserable or abusive relationships because they have stepped out of the world of work, are deskilled, have lost their confidence and, regardless of whether or not they have access to household income, have lost the sense of themselves as economically self-reliant and capable of supporting themselves and their children.

Even if you are someone who is personally fulfilled by picking up after your children, soft play and housework, and doesn’t understand why anyone would consider their work fulfilling, even if you are currently happily married, it’s madness to link your economic life to your romantic/sexual partnership.

@Alarae lets not fall into the trap of equating hard work with high salaries. I live in an area with a huge number of IT jobs - they work hard but not exceptionally so, and they get paid way more than £90k.

As a public sector worker who works far longer hours than my IT sector partner it grates when people assume you get paid more the harder you work.

Given that husband pays into my pension, I'd say 70-80k.

Definitely.

I earn almost 80k and I wouldn't say I have a particularly gruelling job - requires brain power but isn't hugely pressured in terms of hours and very flexible

I think it's very different if you have plenty of friends and family who also don't work to be social with.

I also would prefer not to work, but not everyone finds making friends easy.

You are right there.

I come from a culture where it's the norm for wives not to work, therefore all of my friends and family are available. I can imagine it would be very lonely if this were not the case.