To not feel safe in changing rooms anymore?

[WandaWomblesaurus]

nypost.com/2023/01/14/sighting-of-trans-womans-penis-in-ymca-locker-room-sparks-tears/

Another story about an inappropriate man in a woman's changing room - is this what we are going to see more of in the UK now too? Having been both flashed and sexually assaulted in a public place, this chills me to the bone. Men who get a thrill out of exposing themselves to women will use any opportunity to do so. To think that they won't abuse women's spaces is to be wilfully and dangerously naive.

YANBU - Not unreasonable to think that flashing is flashing regardless of self ID and magical feelings.

YABU - Be kind to men etc etc

Odd you equate this to ‘being kind’

I'm merely being a sensible human being, thankfully no one I know IRL has these outdated and regressive views. Times are changing, people on here might want to start accepting that

Yanbu, trans women are male and belong in the male or a third unisex space, female spaces should remain that.

And if you asked whether people with penises should be in female single sex spaces I reckon a majority would say no - a lot of people don't realise that a majority of men that identify and dress up as women (90%) keep their penises and also non binary males would likely have a penis.

No they aren’t.

TW are biologically men and if they have a penis, they belong in the mens changing room.

If that’s how they identify that’s how they should be treated.

Many countries have mixed changing and have done for donkeys years, this is nothing ‘new’

YANBU.

If that’s how they identify that’s how they should be treated.

Nope, they don't just get to wake up one day, say they're a woman and start invading womens spaces.

What utter nonsense!

Limesoda, materially how are TW women?

YANBU.

Humans cannot change sex. Women do not have penises.

Primark porn website - says it all really . Sickening.

LampLamp · Today 15:12

Limesoda, materially how are TW women?

She's already said that, if they say they are, then they are. I'm imaging that she speaks like Rik, out of The Young Ones!

I don't want to see any body's penis, full stop when going about my daily business.

Women do not have a penis, therefore when I am in a women's changing room I expect it to be a penis free zone.

Why is it always women who are expected to acquiesce? Why do we have to give up our safe spaces, our sports, our music categories, or security?

Love that biological fact is now being referred to as outdated and regressive 😂

Times are changing yes, more people are becoming aware of the nonsense that is gender ideology, when they weren't before.

The people subscribing to the Emperor's New Clothes narrative are making themselves look very silly indeed.

For transparency I am a guy, though no mention was made as to whether men could comment…
There are points for and against you being unreasonable…

What does the data show? Not what you have experienced or what friends have. But the actual number of times this happens in a year? You can only really judge whether an emotion is reasonable based on how realistic the threat is. If it is 1% that is one thing, if it is 80% that is another.

Feelings do not mean facts. I can “feel” threatened but it does not mean I AM threatened. Again. it all comes down to how realistic the fear is. There is a huge issue with confirmation bias in all areas of life. We think we are at risk and therefore any (even remote) suggestion that we are at risk is expanded in our heads.

Would it be reasonable to be fearful of people based on race, ethnicity, sexuality etc? Is there a free pass for fearing all men?

That said, it makes sense why if you have had an experience that you may be fearful. If I were attacked by someone of a specific background, then I may be wary of that group in the future. Ironically, I was attacked by a person of another race once. If I were to say “I am fearful of X type of person” I would be called racist. But it does seem okay to say “I am fearful that men will attack me”. Its rather curious and shows a complete blind spot.

It is also interesting how we think that men will just randomly attack in changing rooms. If they are going to do it they will do it in areas where there are much less cameras (not in the actual rooms but in the shop just outside the changing rooms) like parks, streets etc. Men, as a rule, don’t need to say “I am a woman” to attack women. It is a red herring really.

As a man I don’t believe most men get “turned on” by woman getting changed. It isn’t exactly something people fantasise about from my experience. I’ve got many male friends who can’t even imagine spying on women in changing rooms, they are often there to shock horror get changed! I’ve also got many female friends, none of which report that they have ever had this experience.
In short, it may be reasonable if you have experienced something unpleasant AND it is easy to generalise and see risk everywhere. And I say this a male who was sexually assaulted by a male in a bar.

YANBU. To help protect women and children, please sign and share:

www.mumsnet.com/talk/petitions_noticeboard/4668426-petition-update-the-equality-act-to-make-clear-the-characteristic-sex-is-biological-sex?page=1

Ooh yes, now we have the posters who can’t fathom opinions outside of their own so accuse others of trolling

Next it will be the posters who think everyone who isn’t anti trans is a man

@Soubriquet "No they aren’t.
TW are biologically men and if they have a penis, they belong in the mens changing room."

If they have had a full transition and now have a vagina is that ok?

Again, the use of the term “anti trans” and the word “hysteria”

It isn't anti trans or transphobic to want biological males to stay out of womens spaces.
Trans women are NOT women, they are biological males.

Transwomen deserve rights and protection, but NOT at the expense of women.

The only hysteria I see is from some trans people who get violent or threaten rape, etc when women say no.

As for the ageism element, post menopause when they no longer give any fucks, older women tell it like it is and see through the bullshit.
(which is why they are often subject to this kind of negative regard from men. Including trans women.)

@Limesodas mixed sex changing rooms have secured cubicles. My local leisure centre have a changing village, floor to ceiling lockable cubicles/showers and no communal changing space except the larger family changing cubicles.

Anyone getting naked outside of a cubicle would be asked to leave.

Single sex changing rooms are often communal changing, for example the Nuffield gym near me has women and men's changing rooms which are big open spaces. If a TIM goes into the women's changing room then every woman there will be forced into the position of getting naked in front of a male they don't know, seeing the genitals of a male they don't know or refusing to use the facility.

Can you see why many women would feel aggrieved by that?

Until every single man can control their urges which make them want to scare, attack and rape women, they can fucking well keep their peni in a separate room to women.

And of course I know NAM are like that but until they act like the majority of decent men, they can all fuck off.

YANBU. I feel the same about toilets. I went to a small independent cinema with my partner recently and after the film the toilets were gender neutral so we both went in. I was really surprised that they were just regular toilet cubicles and not individual self contained cubicles with sinks etc to allow privacy. We were the only people in there and I kept thinking how a young girl might feel if she came in alone to find a bloke in there, or how I’d feel if I was alone and a man entered. It really is getting scary. The place used to be a library and definitely used to have male and female facilities once, but they have got rid of the separation. The same also happened at an upmarket restaurant in London.

And this has happened here:

May 2011
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1385889/Joel-Hardman-wore-female-rubber-mask-wig-spy-women-public-toilets.html

Sept 2012
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2209304/Mark-Lazarus-Cross-dressing-sex-attacker-obsessed-skirts-tried-rape-woman-71-Teignmouth-Devon.html

Feb 2019 - further predatory behaviour after the other recorded incident. Both in women's spaces
www.thecourier.co.uk/fp/news/fife/832849/warning-as-transgender-sex-offender-placed-in-womens-hostel/