To have cried over DS behaviour?

[BargainBlunt]

DS is 3.5.

Nursery have called in the local authority to provide advice/support on DS. They aren't saying much more, just that there are concerns. I have spoken to GP who is v. dismissive, I completed forms but have since been told by HV I was given out of date forms by GP so now have to wait for them to have rejected and then can 'do other forms but little chance of being seen for 2 years or so", HV tells me not to bother as "it's not autism but anxiety" due to 'trauma' (she thinks covid plus moving house means trauma is causing the behavioural issues). Family and DH tell me there is nothing going on...just need to be firmer, DS takes the piss out of me cos he can etc.

Anyway, just tried to take DS for a haircut. A special kids place with cars. Spent all week talking about it, showing him videos, reading books. He was excited about going this morning. I even booked a double appointment to allow for all the tears and refusal.

DS tried to wreck the place. He licked the walls. He tried to lick the receptionist's face in a kind of mania. He climbed on top of strangers. He ran out into the street and road numerous times. He lay down in the street. Wouldn't let me near him. The hairdresser tried to corner him at one point and he screamed like a wild animal. We gave up after 40 mins. He then tried to run into random houses on the way home. Hid in a bush.

I cried in the car and called DH. DH told me I was making it all a bigger deal than it needed to be

"Stop over thinking everything"

I honestly feel like I'm gaslit. We keep having episodes like that and DH, GP, MiL, HV keep telling me it's just 'some kids'. Nursery staff seem to think something going on for DS too but everyone close to me thinks I'm being dramatic.

DH said me crying was making it all worse.

DS apologised in the car. Said he was scared. Kept saying "hair cup ouchy" and "sorry mummy". Which did make me feel awful. Should I not let him see me upset?

Hairdresser at one point said "poor boy has got his hair all in his eyes. you need to get that sorted mum" while I was trying to pin him down so he wouldn't tear the posters off the wall.

I mean....it's upsetting isn't it? I feel like everyone is saying basically this is normal mum stuff and I'm just not coping.

Am I being OTT? Do I just need to get my shit together? Is parenting a 3 year old boy really just this hard? I am finding it really hard to not tearful and DH is getting frustrated with me.

As a start, I would suggest that your DH takes him for a haircut. It would give him an insight, and he may be different with dad. Otherwise get a home hairdresser visit.

Meeting arranged with school, get them to invite senco. Just for suggestions about what support to put in for him. Pin them down, they should have enough expertise to put in things to help him.
Then both you and nursery are singing from the same hymn sheet.
Get DH to come along to this meeting.

Get GP to refer for speech and language therapy. My son had hearing/speech problems which made him very angry, frustrated and fearful.

Finally, he sounds so lovely, bless him. And you sound as if you are doing an amazing job

Hang in there, and fight his corner!

You're talking as if we know he has ASD - none of us have even met him.

Rather than buying clippers for now I’d just leave his hair it isn’t a priority. Revisit it in a few months (or years) loads of little boys have longer hair.

I’d concentrate on what matters, getting him assessed and working out how to get more settled. Does your husband spend time with him alone? If he thinks it’s so easy I’d make damn sure he gets his chance.

I'd suspect that the "poor boy" comment was more a misguided attempt to get him to want his hair cut than a judgement of OP.

Cut it at home. I did that for ds, who hated a hair cut. I used to put him in front of a DVD (Big Cook Little Cook was his choice) and with a bowl of raisins to eat.

Only thing was he hated it so much I used to wait until it was about chin length then cut really short. One time he turned and the scissors caught him slightly and he wouldn't let me near him for a week to finish the job. So he had half was chin length and half was really short.
It took me until he was teenage before I could persuade him to give the barbers a chance, but now he goes by choice. He does have ASD as well.

I would ask if he can have a referral to speech therapy and/or a peadiatrician through his nursery. This will get the ball rolling and the GP won't be able to be dismissive after an official speech therapy report is sent to them. Hopefully it sounds like the nursery might be on board with this plan, but there will be a waiting list. My child was referred to speech therapy through nursery so I know it can be done.

Next time I would try and have a mobile hairdresser come to your house and explain the situation beforehand. Clippers might be better than scissors as the haircut will be over more quickly, although your child might not like the noise. Give him a phone or tablet to watch while he's getting his haircut might help as well.

I'm sorry that you feel so unsupported by your family. It might be that they are in denial, not ready to accept that your child may not be neuro typical. You sound like a really good mum who understands her child.

Push for an assessment. Your DSs behaviour does not sound nuerotypical. In addition his speech seems to be a bit delayed and could benefit from the help of a speech therapist.
Lots of kids have these issues. Keep pushing for support. Good luck. It is hard

Both behaviour and language sound like causes for concern. Hopefully you can get some expert help and advice soon - hopefully the nursery calling someone in will be a quicker route than the GP. Ask for the new forms from the GP - it's ridiculous if you have to wait for the wrong ones to get to the top of the queue before doing that.

If you have any meetings with the nursery, take DH; he will hopefully realise that they have lots of experience, and be prepared to take on board what they say.

Stuff the haircut for now - use hairclips or something if the hair is in his way (or a headband, footballer style). My DD flatly refused to have her hair cut at 3, and I didn't push it. I did get her to agree that she would have it cut when she was 4; I had her booked in for the day after her birthday, and fortunately she was fine then! If you try that, still be prepared for the possibility that it's still no. (Thinking about it, I can quite see why a child might expect that taking scissors to part of their anatomy would be bound to hurt. I wonder whether there's a way to clear that hurdle, if they're not prepared to take anyone else's word for it that it doesn't.)

Ignoring the wider issues. But a suggestion for today's mountain.

Have you considered a mobile hair dresser who can come to your home? It may be less overwhelming to have that kind of environment.

My late mother was a trained hairdresser and worked (in a secondary non-hairdressing job) with a lady who's son was ND. There weren't even the lacking resources we have now, back then. Within 6 months of helping her friends son, she had over 20 ND clients who she would work with in their homes.

" years to be seen? That's beyond outrageous- but sadly, getting more and more common.

@BargainBlunt Hi 👋,
Autism mum here and I think you should post this in one of the SEND topics, like SN Chat.

Your DS, whatever a diagnosis would say, has very obvious sensory difficulties at the moment. Overwhelmed with hair cuts, noise, people, etc and the HV was wrong to bluntly tell you not to bother referring him for an assessment.

Meep the referral in place but before anything else, i would contact the Specialist Support Services for your area - go to your county’ main website and look up children’s services and go from there.
They can provide really good advice on how to proceed and may signpost you to groups/workshops/assessment services etc.

Unlike family members and your unsympathetic HV, they will be a specific service for SEND and will help you even without a diagnosis.

But for more specific SEND replies, maybe post on the above topic.

Sending empathy OP.
My son's behaviour was less extreme than you describe, but I always felt there was something unusual going on. I was told by others that it was all perfectly normal and so didn't seek help for him (or myself), but felt ashamed that I wasn't coping and felt isolated. He is much older now and has continued to struggle and I've slowly come to the belief that he probably has ADHD, but is masking at school, so school are not supporting my efforts to have him assessed.

It sounds like the nursery may be onboard with thinking that your son might need additional support. This is gold - as others have said, get in touch with them and insist on a meeting with whoever is responsible for special educational needs to request an assessment.

I'd strongly recommend researching autism and ADHD to get a sense of the kind of behaviours that indicate these conditions. It was only when I did that that I had the realisation that it's likely to be ADHD for my son.

When you've read up on the conditions, you might then find it easier to write a list of what you observe in your son, using the kind of language/jargon that is used in that field. That should help you when discussing it with the nursery and other professionals - plus in talking about it with your husband.

In theory, if the nursery is onboard with submitting a request for assessment for him, you shouldn't need to go through the GP. My GP simply told me that the request had to come through the school anyway.

I also found that once I came to the understanding that he was likely to be neurodiverse, I was able to approach his behaviour in a kinder, more tolerant way, instead of pushing him to do things he wasn't equipped for. You might find it helpful to research tips and tools for approaching different situations with neurodiverse kids.

Oh god, I feel your pain.
my youngest is now 12 but we had a similar experience when he was about 2, maybe 3.

1. ask the hairdresser or barber to come your house.
2. My son's nursery flagged up issues. Believe them.
3. My husband was awful about this. He accused me of wanting our son to have issues. He said ‘I don’t want my son to be labelled’.
4. you know in your gut, this isn’t quite normal/right.
5. I can recommend Alison Pope. Google her.

I’m giving you a virtual handhold. But on the bright side, my son has an EHCP now, goes to an absolute fantastic mainstream school with learning support.

Send your husband with him for his next hair cut, your husband needs to be spending some one on one time with him so he can experience what you are saying. How much time does he spend with other people?

I can imagine how lonely it feels for you, but you are completely justified, but you need to push and fight for anything these days sadly :( could you afford a private assessment?

Your DH is in utter denial and your DS sounds almost surely to have SEN. Pay for a private Ed psych to look at him. None of that sounds neurotypical.

Your HV should NOT be diagnosing your son. I am cross for you.

What have the LA said? What kind of support did they call in?
The nursery think he's anxious and traumatised. Until you get to the bottom of the trauma then haircuts aren't that important and suddenly making him spend more time with his dad and less time with you (his primary care giver) is only going to add to his distress.
If he has SEN, then the boards here will give good advice.
But my point is a DC who is traumatised or has attachment issues is going to need a different response from one with ADHD.
Speak to the nursery. Speak to the LA. Ask both for referrals to specialist support including any local groups.
Oh and YANBU to have cried. It sounds very stressful.

So sorry to hear this op. You are right he is terrified and sounds like he had a panic attack. He is very insightful for his age to be able to describe why he did that and how he was feeling and he obviously trusts you to be able to speak about it. He needs an assessment and to make sure his environment is calm and suits his needs, not the needs of the adults around him including dismissive family members and professional as that can be unhelpful and make it worse by pinning kids down and traumatising them.
I hope you don’t have to wait too long for the right referrals. Keep sticking up for yourself and him op.

sorry I meant the HV thinks he's anxious and traumatised.

What you will find OP is that nobody will say 'the A word' until he is diagnosed. But they will skate around it by using phrases like 'lack of social communication' 'sensory issues' 'self directed play'

It's immensely frustrating but they're covering their arses by not calling it what it probably is - autism.

Oh OP it is so tough. I have two sons and my youngest has a diagnosis of autism and was completely unmanageable as a toddler, a complete holy terror. He was diagnosed at 3 and a half. Similar issues but less speech than your son.

My HV was useless, and they can't diagnose any issues or tell you it's not autism, as it could well be.
My son's nursery also got the early years senco involved and that sounds similar to what you are experiencing with someone from the LA coming in.

Many of us SEN parents have been told we need to be firmer with our kids, etc it's a load of crap. Ignore and just get through each day one day at a time.

You need to make sure the GP has made a referral to paediatrics for a developmental assessment and the nursery should be able to refer to speech therapy for you. If the nursery have flagged up issues thats good and means a support plan can be put in place for nursery.

I read this and recognised so much about my child's behaviour at that age - he was diagnosed with autism at 4 years old. I'm not trying to do an arm chair diagnosis, far from it...but you KNOW your child, and know what's best for them.

I know how hard it is when you're surrounded by people trying to tell you to doubt yourself, but trust that gut instinct.

Sending you a hug and a hand hold x

My DS was very similar at that age and tried to run off one time on the way to the hairdressers. He still needs a kindle now to regulate there as he doesn't like it still. He's 7 now with asd and sensory issues. His language has come on so much but he was similar to your DS at 4. Now his issues are more to do with knowing when to pause in a conversation and being very blunt. Hebus a fantastic child now he's being supported properly.
Your HV cannot diagnose and has no business giving her view. My HV missed all signs at 2 year check and, even at 3, he wasn't diagnosed because he made eye contact and smiled at a friendly play worker!! Finally, he was diagnosed the following year. You can apply for an EHCP yourself and nursery / school should be doing assess plan do cycles that you can use as evidence.

That sounds exactly like my DS at that age. He has severe autism and learning difficulties. Going anywhere with him would have me in floods of tears. It was very difficult to cope. I feel for you so much.

Keep pushing for help from all available sources. You really do need it.

You are in a hard place right now but things can and hopefully will get better (from experience).

Your son is telling you in lots of ways that things are very wrong, he is even able to tell you in words which is great. It does sound, like a PP says, that there are sensory, language, emotional regulation issues and difficulty with new things. It may be ASD or something else.

If it is ASD there are many different presentations and you would do well to start learning about it as there are very different parenting strategies depending on the child. We worked backwards, trying different strategies until we found one that worked, then we pursued diagnosis with that knowledge.

Some children need social stories, lots of routine, preparation but some don't and it is in fact counter-productive e.g. with a PDA presentation (see the PDA society for more info.) those things may cause major anxiety.

It is a shame that your DH and family are not on board but that is very common. You need to fight very hard right now for all the referrals you need and don't be fobbed off or told to 'watch and wait' as it does sound like you need help now.

Ha he is, not Hebus!! Oh and he has anxiety too due to demand avoidance (PDA) not trauma, and asd itself can cause anxiety as its impossible to recognise what comes next in a situation unless you've been in it before. So that's why social stories etc work well often. Keep a diary of all the things that happen and all the adjustments you make day to day.