Is it reasonable to tell DC that "most people don't enjoy going to work"?

[raisinsarenottheonlyfruit]

DP thinks most people would rather be doing something other than their job and it's not unreasonable so say this to DD, aged 9.

I feel that the aim is to find a job you enjoy doing, and although it's true that loads of us are in jobs we don't particularly enjoy, at 9 years old, the world is still DD's oyster and we should be encouraging her to follow her interests in the hope she will find a career she enjoys, not giving her the idea that work is shit.

I think it's fine that DD knows the reality that many people have to do jobs they don't like to get money, but I think giving her the idea that work in general is something most people don't want to do isn't a good message for a 9 year old.

AIBU?

Generally I like my job, but there are still aspects of it I really dislike.

There's a fine balance between encouraging children and filling them with expectations that are too high. Equally there is a balance (for your MH and happiness) as an adult between dragging yourself through a job thats not right for you to pay the bills, pursuing a hobby and calling it being a #bossbabe, and just cracking on with the crap stuff because sometimes we all have to do shit we don't want to do.

Its a tricky one to explain to children.

Generally I like my job, but there are still aspects of it I really dislike.

There's a fine balance between encouraging children and filling them with expectations that are too high. Equally there is a balance (for your MH and happiness) as an adult between dragging yourself through a job thats not right for you to pay the bills, pursuing a hobby and calling it being a #bossbabe, and just cracking on with the crap stuff because sometimes we all have to do shit we don't want to do.

Its a tricky one to explain to children.

He's right that many people have jobs they dislike, for a whole range of reasons, and I think he's right to tell your children that in the context of a warning. Many people recieved bad advice or disregarded good advice as teens and ended up in the wrong jobs.

I, for instance, will be pointing out jobs to my children that need sought after skills, have good benefits, WFH options, good pay, bonuses, good career development, rather than the thankless public service job I do that seemed a great idea when I was applying to university. I'm an introvert and would be more suited to something less public facing.

So many people talk about working hard to ‘get’ a particular job, but that’s just the beginning - what about working hard so that you gain the knowledge and skills to do your job well? What about curiosity, which propels people to be learners all their lives, so that they can go for promotion, retrain, specialise?

Competence at literacy, maths, computing, interpersonal communication, teamwork, organisation etc will come from hard work at lots of things a young person does, including their school work and their extracurricular clubs and hobbies.

Then whatever job a young person does get/can get, they will find lots of aspects of it easier, and therefore have a more enjoyable working life. Being good at something should be a pleasure in itself.

I think it's reasonable to explain that there's a choice between having a job you like and not being able to afford very much, and having a job you hate, and being able to buy nice things.

I probably wouldn't go any further than that.

I would be considered a high earner by many people on MN, but the flipside is that I spend a lot of money each month on therapy because I hate my job so much. Overall, I'm still financially better off, but mentally, I'm not in a good place.

God, I can't wait until retirement.

I would say that's quite a harmful and victim blaming narrative. There are plenty of unhappy people in highly desirable and competitive jobs. Suicide rates are high in veterinary and dentistry. And no one "deserves" to do anything they want. It's completely unrealistic and going to lead to huge dissatisfaction. Not to mention it's disrespectful to those doing the lower paid but essential jobs in our society. Perhaps a job as e.g. a delivery driver or a cleaner isn't anyone's career dream but it doesn't follow that people doing it are undeserving because of bad choices (or that they dislike their work).

Education and hard work gives choices so that you can change if you don't like your job. But all jobs include tedious bits and you might have to slog away at something for a few years to get where you want.

Telling children, especially girls to find work they love is one of the biggest piles of shit parents can dish out.

It also often reinforces the gender pay gap, as it tends to be girls who are told to find a job they love, boys aren’t often told the same.

Women and girls should be encouraged to find a job that’s financially rewarding to enable them to be Independant

Do you really tell your little prince/ princess stuff like this? That they deserve better than other people and that they won’t be unhappy if they “do the right thing” and get a good career? How bizarrely toxic, snobby and patently untrue.

I don't disagree but who's going to staff the nurseries and old people's homes that allow all these women to work? There's something hugely wrong with our society when the most vital work is the most poorly rewarded.

I'm childless, no partner, some friends and family but we don't see each other every day/week.
If I didn't have work my life would be meaningless and work means I can own my own home so have stability and security and pets.
If I was rich and didn't have to work but with the same circumstances as above I think I would work part time just to have some company (yoga classes aren't my thing).

Of course it’s reasonable to think most people would rather be doing something else than work if they had the choice. Most people, given enough money, would quit their jobs and take up hobbies or volunteering or travel or spend more time with friends and family. I often love my job (teacher) and am rewarded and fulfilled by it but I also often find parts of it stressful, boring, overwhelming and frustrating. I hate having to get out of bed early when the alarm goes off 5 days a week, hate feeling like I never have enough time to do the things I’d like to be doing, hate the fact I can’t get on top of self care and housework and appointments because I feel my job takes up all my time and energy so by the weekend I just want to crash and switch my brain off. I would quit my job tomorrow if I had enough money to do so and would instead look to volunteer with kids, become a part time TA or otherwise seek the fulfilling parts of my job without the levels of stress and commitment work requires of me now.

I don’t know many people who would continue with their jobs if they suddenly came into millions, apart from maybe the entrepreneurs and business tycoons who are focused on infinitely increasing their wealth. For most of us in regular employment though work is a means to gain the money we need to live and have the money to do the things we enjoy. I really don’t think there’s anything wrong with saying that to a child, it’s reality.

Do you really tell your little prince/ princess stuff like this? That they deserve better than other people and that they won’t be unhappy if they “do the right thing” and get a good career? How bizarrely toxic, snobby and patently untrue.

they do deserve and will be better. Menial work is not something that would be considered.

High achieving Asian immigrant family here.

We have high expectations and make it clear. Grandparents told us they did these jobs as they were uneducated and had no choice in the matter.

More is expected from us.

I’d say it’s reasonable to tell a child that. Not at nine though - that’s too young. Let her imagine she’ll be a dancer or a singer for a few more years. I’m all for comforting fantasy over horrible reality.

I’ve had several jobs in my life and didn’t enjoy any of them. I don’t want to work. I want a big house in the Lake District with a large Zen garden and nothing to do all day. I don’t like people much, so certainly wouldn’t miss my colleagues. Actually, one of the worst things about working are colleagues who love their job. Extroverts love offices. They love the gossip and flirting and ‘water cooler moments’. For introverts like me, however, offices are torture. I wouldn’t miss working one tiny bit. I would spend my days reading, caring for rescue dogs, going for long hikes, etc. There is no job that appeals to me. I suppose if I’d had the talent I’d have enjoyed writing books. But the world doesn’t need yet another mediocre novel.

As for people generally, I’d say the majority dislike their job and would rather be doing something else. A minority absolutely hate their job, but do it to pay the bills. Also, the housing in this country is so awful that if you don’t work and save you end up in a dump next to a noisy ‘problem family’.

Still, there is quite a large minority who love what they do. Maybe your daughter will be one of the lucky ones.

One of the best things about working is that you enjoy your time off more - the Ying and the Yang I suppose. Having no purpose and nothing to do isn’t really much fun either.

Yanbu. I think it is a good idea to teach children to aspire to have a job that they largely enjoy /find fulfilling.

I'm honest with my 9 year old about the trade-off that often exists between rewarding work and well paid work.

You can love your job and find it financially rewarding though. I earn plenty and also enjoy my job and find it fulfilling and intellectually satisfying. I know I am lucky. But these jobs exist.

And I most certainly encourage my son to find a job he finds interesting too.

Interesting and enjoyable does not need to mean poorly paid.

And I most certainly encourage my son to find a job he finds interesting too.

Interesting and enjoyable does not need to mean poorly paid.

It's somewhere in between isn't it? On the whole YANBU - the happiest people I know put a good bit of thought into choosing jobs that suited them, but it's fair to say that if you have limited options or got stuck in a bad choice due to commitments etc then it's something you have to do for money.

And of course even dream jobs have trade offs and bits you may hate

I’m clear with my kids that finding work you enjoy is really important. That doesn’t mean every moment is ecstasy, but I never (ok, rarely) dread going to work. Part of that is studying hard and giving yourself as many options as possible.

I grew up with two parents who looked down on the jobs that they themselves did. They thought their own jobs were stupid and also that it was an outrage that anyone should have to do what they viewed as a crap job like be a cleaner - the fact that this was necessary was a sign of our shit society.

For whatever reasons they were not able to really pursue what interested them nor were they able to take a pride in the work that they did do - I earn money for my family, I am a good team player - and all the other ways work can make you feel proud of yourself. Instead they only looked on work as a burden and frankly an unfair outrage that they should have to do it.

I hope I am raising my kids to respect their own work and value it - whatever it is. If I meet someone who is a cleaner I don't consider them to have a crap humiliating job, I think of someone who has their own business, works hard and helps people as well as probably keeping themselves pretty fit.

I think work requires the tolerance of lots of difficult feelings. When at the start of your career you have to tolerate the need to be at the beginning, to listen, and learn, and be patient to develop experience.

When its a cold January day you have to tolerate the fact that you would rather stay in bed.

When work is stressful and demanding you have to manage all those anxieties.

But at the same time if you can manage all that and really have a grown up attitude to work rather than an adolescent one, it can really be a vehicle for creativity and agency in your life.

I'll add too that to some degree it is where you are on your attitude to work that colours your experience of it, rather than what the job is.

In my work I am a mentor for juniors. Some of them who have a difficult time will tell me that this profession is wrong for them, they don't like it, it is not a good fit. To some extent that may be true, but I can also see that what they struggle with is being junior, having to accept being the novice, and having to take time to learn. They want to be senior straight away. If they change profession I can see that some of the same issues will continue for them.

I think there’s a lot of truth in this, sadly.

My parents were very snobbish about work and it was really important to them that we got jobs that sounded impressive at dinner parties and they looked down on people who were focused on making money.

I think there was an implicit assumption in this that my sister and I would both get married to a highly paid bloke who would do the breadwinning, allowing us to do “interesting” things like making documentaries and publishing obscure books that were only read by academics etc.

I’m glad they encouraged us to look for jobs we enjoyed but it also set us up with very unrealistic expectations. The reality of these jobs is they are mainly lifestyle careers for people with independent income, either from their spouses or family. It’s incredibly hard to develop a secure career as a documentary filmmaker or freelance writer.

The ability to make enough money to support yourself is probably the single most important life skill a woman needs if she is avoid dependence on a man. If a job is challenging and engaging as well then so much the better but it’s all about money.

It's great to encourage children to pursue and nurture their interests and passions, especially if they could lead to a happy career later on.

However, I think it's also positive and good to try and caveat it with a bit a of reality. Not everyone will end up being successful at their passions and a realistic plan B must be in place in case that happens.

I think we're seeing some of the effects of failing to teach children realistic expectations and goals at the moment in the younger generation of adults as they join the job market. Many are dropping out of it because they're disillusioned. Some will be disillusioned because they've not been given realistic expectations throughout their lives and thus, end up sorely disappointed when they're confronted with the reality.

A lot of people end up in jobs that they can simply tolerate and they pay the bills, and that is okay. For me, I've gone from wanting to pursue that dream career to just wanting a job that provides me with flexibility, a stable and steady income, and that I can tolerate.

It's about preparing children for the real world, I think. I think if we focus solely on encouraging children to follow their dreams they could end up very disappointed adults. If we balance the approach, I think there could be less disappointment and more people prepared to take on the world as it is.

One of the key things that is important, I think, is teaching children the value of work. That it's not just about paying the bills but also about developing self-confidence and competence, building friendships and skills that can translate into their social life as well. If children grow up understanding how valuable a good work ethic is-whatever they end up doing, they will be able to find something positive in it.