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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Vanilla sex life

155 replies

julesob81 · 02/01/2023 00:28

I've been with my now wife for 13 years, married for 8. I love her and we have a young child.

I used to love our love life and feel we used to be more adventurous in bed, varying the experience on most occasions. Over the last few years I feel that anything to do with sex has become a chore for her. We've spoken about it and I've said I would like to try different things and ask her what she wants (I never get an answer!!!) she always says yes she'll try what I want (and no it's nothing dodgy!) but it never happens and we end up having predictable vanilla sex whenever we're lucky enough to have it.

AIBU in wanting something more in the experience and also AIBU in just feeling that she's not that into me anymore but just hanging in there for our child, who we both adore and want the best for?

OP posts:
yorkshirepudsx · 02/01/2023 09:52

Imthegingerbreadwoman · 02/01/2023 09:45

I'm assuming vanilla means, straight forward bit of foreplay, into missionary or whatever choice. And that's it. But this can be absolutely fine if done lovingly and time spent. You don't need to be doing gymnastics or need toys.

Ah yes the gymnastics would be a strong no from me 🤣 i once told my partner if he wanted me to try weird positions he would have to ring 999 when I dislocate my hip/hips 🤣

FloydPepper · 02/01/2023 09:54

yorkshirepudsx · 02/01/2023 09:35

Honestly hormones are horrible!! I think it should be taught about in schools!

I have an illness that affects my hormones, causes severe period pains (I've had surgery and allsorts to try and help symptoms!) and it can leave me feeling seriously exhausted and genuinely depressed sometimes! I've gone through phases of not wanting to be here & feeling like I'm genuinely going insane!

I know that there are men that got through testosterone issues too and it can have a huge impact on their day to day life and mental health,

it's not spoken about enough but it needs to be (for men and women!)

It can and does have an impact for men but for us I think it’s much more longer term, much slower, and not as volatile.

lower testosterone as we get older is an issue, but we don’t have the huge peaks and troughs on a monthly basis. That does mean it can sneak up on you as it’s so gradual though.

tiredmama23 · 02/01/2023 09:58

Imthegingerbreadwoman · 02/01/2023 08:22

Op, even though you say you do 50 / 50. Women's clocks need extra rest. We are on a 28 day hormone cycle whereas you are on a 24 hour hormone cycle. Women are tired as fuck!

tabooau.co/blogs/blog/a-comparison-of-the-female-vs-male-hormonal-cycle-spoiler-alert-women-have-it-worse

Have a read of this.

I literally have a week of the month when I feel good and Ok! And the rest of the time I feel exhausted. I eat well, I exercise, I don't get enough sleep though and it buggers me up! I think men need to understand women's cycles better to understand we can't always spring into action!

I can only be bothered with what you mentioned on my ovulation week! And we aren't trying for a baby. It's just nature's way!

I have 4 dc. I know my body and cycle very well!

Give her more time to relax, a but more sleep and some nice kind words. Flowers occasionally etc and she might feel more up for it!

I can totally relate! Men really need to understand that a lot of women only feel good and sexy for a small proportion of the month. They get the benefit of a constant supply of testosterone - we get the crappy ups and down and fluctuations of oestrogen and progesterone that can make us feel like shit!

I have 2 windows of every month where I feel attractive and I want sex with DH. I do try at other times but it's much, much harder for me to feel "into it". Luckily DH is very understanding of this.

tiredmama23 · 02/01/2023 10:02

Oh and I will also add that DH splits the household and childcare load with me 50/50 (we both work), and if he didn't, my twice a month of feeling sexy and wanting to be intimate with him would fizzle to never! So that part for me is hugely important. Essentially, a man who willingly shares the burden of everyday life and isn't a lazy fucker is an important part of the turn on!

kingtamponthefurred · 02/01/2023 10:08

I'd suggest stop watching porn and stop expecting marital sex to be like porn. It usually isn't.

yorkshirepudsx · 02/01/2023 10:12

Oh yeah Floydpepper it's insane.

I studied hormones in university and wrote dissertations on it. Many women actually suffer in silence and are purely ignored by GP's too when it comes to it, I've lived through the frustration of having no help myself. Or alot of GP's just push women to go onto the contraceptive pill and ignore any possibility of an underlying cause. Then there's alot of younger women who don't even seek help because they've witnessed older women get fobbed off.
And I truly believe that men (and women) should be educated on it all from a younger age.

Honestly - if any of you have the time, have a look online at the different graphs that show hormone levels at each stage of a woman's life, not just the menstrual cycle, but with starting periods, the menopause, pregnancy, post natal period, then have a look at the graphs for these hormones when an underlying illness is thrown in the mix (endometriosis, PCOS, thyroid issues etc)

The postnatal period for example - very very very ignored by society. People make such a fuss and give so much sympathy to a pregnant mother, and a mother during labour - but this almost vanishes once the baby is born and sympathy and understanding is just thrown out of the window.
It can take on average a healthy woman 2 years for her hormone levels to go back to 'normal' after giving birth, now if you've got a woman who has something underlying and isn't aware, this could take years and years, or in some cases, their hormones never return to normal.

Women experience baby blues and a lot of women go through postnatal mental health disorders (not just depression, there's OCD, anxiety - and then there's intrusive thoughts which are horrific), health professionals are very quick to push a mother into contraception as soon as baby is born - but a lot of health professionals don't explain to the mother the hormonal side of things. I am lucky to have an amazing GP - I ended up sat crying in her office when I was 6 months postpartum with my first. I felt like I was going insane. I didn't want anybody anywhere near me, I didn't want to leave my baby's side (id have him in his Moses basket in the bathroom with me when I was having a bath and allsorts) - I was convinced my partner hated me, and I just constantly felt this urge to run away. And as for my sex drive - it was non existent.
And I felt really lonely. My partner (he's much more understanding now) just kept brushing it off, and I even found that other mothers weren't so understanding either.
I had my hormones tested regularly for a few months and it became apparent - that they were not changing, they remained low after giving birth, and that's why I felt the ways that I did - the sex drive part was totally understandable, I didn't have the hormone levels to encourage me to want to have sex, so I had to start hormone therapy in order to get myself back on track.

So I say this as a person that has experienced it (and known that I did, many don't know!) that if your partner (whether a man or woman!) is struggling in the bedroom department, or in any other aspect of their life - be patient, encourage them to seek help and push the health system with them. It's really really really tough.

Mellymoon · 02/01/2023 10:20

Maybe her confidence needs boosting.

BasicDad · 02/01/2023 10:29

Outside of the standard MNet man hate, you've received some good advice here.

The women's cycle one is very relevant. Read up about luteal and follicular cycles. You'll notice it goes way beyond sexy feelings and has a big impact on everything.

I've seen posters mention 50/50 household load. I'd go beyond that and "aim" to get 80% done. Not as a way to earn sex, but just because shit needs to get done and you're leading the way. It'll create harmony and safety like someone has her back. I'd say this is even more important during her luteal phase and first few days of period.

Regards the sex. All women are going to be different. Many do fall into the responsive desire category and you need to lead the way to build the desire (which starts way before the act). Subtle flirting, teasing, being fun, happy, getting all the stuff done, creates a good environment for your partner to relax in. If she is post ovulation, then cuddles and comfort...and if there's no sex, don't be hurt (or at least show it) about it. Take rejection like a man, it's no biggy, get on with life, all is still well and you're happy.

It's hard being a man. But it's 100%+ harder being a woman. Even more so in modern times.

tiredmama23 · 02/01/2023 10:30

@yorkshirepudsx

Fascinating post. I can relate to the absolute hell of the postnatal period and how invisible and misunderstood I felt. It was horrendous. I'd be interested to read your dissertation!

Choconut · 02/01/2023 10:33

Why don't you change things up during sex? It sounds like you're bringing it up outside the bedroom and then expecting her to instigate it in the bedroom. I'd start with massage - always good when you're tired, you could get a vibrating massager than could migrate to other areas if things get more heated - just be fully prepared that it might stop at just massage! If she's agreeable though you could massage her back and bum and then massage her with one hand and yourself with the other - no effort required from her but lots of intimacy and something a bit different for you.

I would guess she's happy with the status quo so you're the one who needs to think of things that will appeal to her and keep you happy and make the effort to put them in place. I don't think buying her flowers or presents is the answer, it's just about making it more fun for you (and her) without putting extra work and expectation on her.

tiredmama23 · 02/01/2023 10:44

It can take on average a healthy woman 2 years for her hormone levels to go back to 'normal' after giving birth

Wow. I didn't know this. My DD is 20 months old and I've only just recently these past few months started to feel my old self return. That makes a LOT of sense now!

honeylulu · 02/01/2023 10:52

Reading with interest. I know you didn't use the word "intimacy" ( I think) but your post called to mind all the other threads where men complain of "lack of intimacy" where I always think they mean the opposite. Intimacy is a deep personal and emotional connection, not necessarily sexual but for many women intimacy is key to wanting and having good sex.

Unfortunately most of the time men say they want more intimacy they don't mean that - it's just a polite way of saying "I want more access to her genitals". Wanting more sex or "more exciting sex" is a world away from wanting and developing/nurturing true intimacy with someone. For me, if I feel that a man is desiring ME rather than just desiring use of my body, that is a huge turn on. However a side effect is that it creates a desire in me for more sex and sometimes more adventurous sex, and that doesnt happen in a perfunctory way, but just kind of evolves.

I agree with the other stuff posters have written - appreciate the tiredness, the chore sharing, the mental load, the hormones. But really think about LOVING your wife and acting like you do. Look into her eyes, kiss her and hug her, tell her you love her and love being with her (when sex isn't on the table).

Finally, I have to say that whilst greater intimacy increases my desire, passion, enthusiasm etc, the "vanilla" stuff still works best for me. Toys and dressing up and doggy position I've tried but it all seems a bit style over substance, unstimulating and lacking in intimacy. Mutual masturbation sounds good though ... But I'd say that's something people (especially women) feel self conscious about and that's one of the things that building intimacy might help. The first time my husband and I masturbated in front of each other I did feel self conscious at first but it ended up being one of the most intensely intimate experiences of our relationship. I would still hate the idea of being "loomed at" with a lovehoney toy though. (Sorry that made me laugh!)

Crackof · 02/01/2023 10:57

"Standard MN man hate"

Yeah, no. What absolute bs. What ABSOLUTE bs.

Calling bs on someone's bs isn't hate either, for the record.

FloydPepper · 02/01/2023 11:01

BasicDad · 02/01/2023 10:29

Outside of the standard MNet man hate, you've received some good advice here.

The women's cycle one is very relevant. Read up about luteal and follicular cycles. You'll notice it goes way beyond sexy feelings and has a big impact on everything.

I've seen posters mention 50/50 household load. I'd go beyond that and "aim" to get 80% done. Not as a way to earn sex, but just because shit needs to get done and you're leading the way. It'll create harmony and safety like someone has her back. I'd say this is even more important during her luteal phase and first few days of period.

Regards the sex. All women are going to be different. Many do fall into the responsive desire category and you need to lead the way to build the desire (which starts way before the act). Subtle flirting, teasing, being fun, happy, getting all the stuff done, creates a good environment for your partner to relax in. If she is post ovulation, then cuddles and comfort...and if there's no sex, don't be hurt (or at least show it) about it. Take rejection like a man, it's no biggy, get on with life, all is still well and you're happy.

It's hard being a man. But it's 100%+ harder being a woman. Even more so in modern times.

You’ll get stick for mentioning “standard man hate”…

bloodyhellbernard · 02/01/2023 11:02

There are a couple of websites called omgyes.com and yesyesyes.org that are specifically dedicated to women's pleasure. I think you have to pay for them. They give quite precise instructions about how to increase orgasm etc. so if you are interested in mixing things up, might this be a stepping stone? Make the sex you do have amazing so that the general level of sexiness in your marriage goes up.

I can imagine that making comments about the unsatisfactory nature of your sex life would be quite upsetting and pressurizing, particularly as you are actually managing to have a sex life with quite a young child in the house, which isn't a given.

OrlandointheWilderness · 02/01/2023 11:06

The endocrine system is a vicious bigger that cocks up your entire life IMO! I have a ma on e relative who has massively suffered too, he has very low testosterone and additional hormone issues and they have given him some awful symptoms.

GiveMeAllDaSheeze · 02/01/2023 11:11

I think I agree that watching porn is not a good idea because you will only be frustrated as real life sex is nothing like porn and it's setting you up for unrealistic expectations. You might feel like it's giving you an outlet or a pressure valve relief but in the medium and long term it will impact your sexual and love life.

Nudity · 02/01/2023 11:11

Cuddle and kiss with no boob grabbing, no innuendos, no lower region touching, no trying to slip a hand in her undies, kiss her head, stroke her hair, compliment her and don’t expect this to lead to sex.
When you do have sex, don’t be selfish and make sure she’s having an orgasm every time.
Don’t pester for sex….it’s a giant turn off.

inquisitorgeneral · 02/01/2023 11:16

It sounds like she is either not interested in what you're describing or she expects you to instigate. Hard to judge when I have no idea what you mean by non-vanilla. If it's stuff like pegging or cross-dressing, I can sympathise with her because I wouldn't be into that either.

CovertImage · 02/01/2023 11:29

This reply has been withdrawn

This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request

BasicDad · 02/01/2023 11:32

@FloydPepper it's the same every time. Was hoping OP would filter it out and focus on the good advice, of which there is plenty.

PearPickingPorky · 02/01/2023 11:53

"Vanilla sex life" sounds like a really derogatory way to refer to not-porn-like sex.

What is the purpose of the toys? Assuming the idea is that you will use one on her, then if she's not particularly enthused about the idea (which obviously she isn't) then what exactly is the benefit of using them?

GiveMeAllDaSheeze · 02/01/2023 11:57

I think it would be helpful if op could explain what he means by vanilla sex because I'm assuming it's anal, rimming, BDSM stuff as they tend to use the term vanilla sex.

Jazz12 · 02/01/2023 12:12

OP, are you doing anything adventurous, new and exciting OUTSIDE the bedroom with her. Like surprise her with flowers unexpectedly. A tender kiss when things get stressful or overwhelming, an offer of a little bit of “me time”, dream with her (a dream holiday or a dream home), have deep meaningful conversations with her (what kind of future do you see for your DD?)?

she needs to connect with you AND STAY CONNECTED at a deeper level. That takes a bit of TLC.

On the other side, is she feeling loved and respected in your relationship? Do you stand up for her ? (Mentioning since this broke my marriage)

OMG12 · 02/01/2023 12:21

I’m with you, I have tried so often to spice things up- my DH is boring in bed, leaves me totally unsatisfied. I’ve started so many conversations, left it alone to see what happens. Totally with DH now for practical reasons and for DS. For me withholding sex and making no effort to meet half way even is emotional abuse, it’s left me with self esteem issues.

I’ve given up on him now, I don’t think we could ever get it back. I have zero respect for him. He’s had a couple of affairs so he obviously has some sexual need.

if you can leave-it won’t get any better.

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