To say no - relatives child

[littlepercy]

I'm feeling pretty awful about this so wanted to get some opinions.

My SIL and her husband are a mess and always have been. They have recently had their 4 year old daughter removed from them for reasons I won't go into here. They are hoping to get her back living with them eventually but when that will be who knows (if ever).

SIL is DHs only sibling and therefore DN is his only niece too. His parents are elderly and cannot help. We are being asked to take DN indefinitely to avoid more permenant foster care.

We have 2 DC together, a DS who is 3 and a DD who is 6. I am a SAHM and DH works full time.

We technically have the room here but I don't think this is something I could cope with, I'd be essentially on my own dealing with this as DH would be at work. Understandably DN is showing troubling behaviour too due to all the upheaval.

DH feeling under pressure from his sister and feels awful saying no but understands as it's me who'd be expected to do most stuff day to day then it's really down to me.

Do not let a child into the care system. It is one young child who can be saved. I and my siblings are lucky because we never ended up in the care system. It would have destroyed us. Despite how bad it was at home.

This ☝️

A child being orphaned is one thing- but her parents are both alive.

Surely the onus is on the parents of the little girl to turn their lives around and win her back? Rather than people on the internet guilt tripping the OP into taking on another child.
The OP isn’t at fault here, she didn’t bring this situation on. The awful sister in law is to blame.

The OP clearly and understandably isn’t on board with it anyway, she’s as much as said so. And many people have given valid reason s why this may not work.

Saying stupid comments like “ I’d take my niece in a heartbeat “ doesn’t help and clearly they’ve never been in the OPs situation.
This isn’t an episode of The Waltons, where everyone lives happily ever after.

I have much sympathy with this poor child.

But I also have sympathy for the OPs other two children.

Totally depends on the circumstances.

my DN absolutely had to have his own room before the SW would agree, and that was despite the fact he wanted to share with DS (same age, close mates)

However, we are childfree by choice but there is absolutely no way I could see our nieces and nephews go into foster care when I could give them a secure and safe home

As you don't already have small children in the home it would be easier for you. OP needs to take the wellbeing and quite possibly physical safety (from the child's father) of her children into account.

I could never not take in a family child

In your position I would prioritise my own children and say no.

This.

Yes indeed. Many people on here seem to overlook this !

It is so, so, so easy for people to think of their own untraumatised young relatives and say 'oh of course I'd have them.' This is not that situation. This child has been through goodness knows what, witnessed goodness knows what, and the effects on her young life will be with her forever. It's easy to think 'aww she's only 4' but 4 years is a long time when you're experiencing an horrific upbringing.

My two foster kids were 5 and 6 when they came to me. We had bed wetting, daily soiling, fighting with other kids at school and in parks etc, constant bad behaviour at school (climbing on tables, throwing stones at windows, shouting at teachers among other things), the older one had to be physically passed to a teacher every morning, running when in open spaces (not running away, just running with no concept of where the road was), the older one had clearly had to give in to the younger one constantly and so when he realised that actually he was allowed his turn at our house we had many arguments over whose turn it was to press the traffic light, have the blue cup, sit next to the window on the bus etc. They were also really good at making themselves be sick so I was constantly having to pick them up from school. I couldn't turn my back for a second or they would be fighting, or something would be broken. They were always touching everything in shops. Constant lies. If they went to any holiday clubs there was always a bad report about their behaviour. And these were 'easy' kids compared to some who come into care.

But if I'd had a 3 year old of my own with me and suddenly had to chase my foster child across a beach so he didn't get lost/drowned what would I have done with the 3 year old? How could I explain when she called someone at nursery a 'stupid little fucker' that this was what my foster child considered normal to say to another child? How would I get my kids to school on time when I had to take my foster child to their school because they're not allowed to move schools while there's a chance they might go back to mum? How do I comfort my 3 year old who has only known kindness when they're cornered, screamed at and scratched down their face because they'd picked up a toy my foster child suddenly wanted?

It would be a massive, massive upheaval for your kids and personally I wouldn't do it when also having children of similar ages in the house. It's not fair on any of them. This little girl deserves a home where she's the youngest, not where she has to fight for her place as the middle child of three. And I would like to think the majority of foster carers are lovely. Yes there are always some who I wouldn't want to send a child to, but most are great at caring for and advocating for the child in their care. And her staying in foster care wouldn't necessarily mean she's shunted around several homes. My two are still with me as teenagers. Certain issues have resolved while others have developed! But they are very much a part of our family.

I hope your life never goes in a direction where you realise what a naive statement this is.

That poor, sweet, unwanted little girl. If only we could wave a magic wand and magic her into a lovely stable family far away from those who have let her down and who should have protected her.

I know what I would do. Only you can decide what you do.

You will get paid as a family and friends foster cater and you will have support from social workers, you will also be able to ask for things such as money for trips and clothes, extra furniture etc and there are a large number of groups for people who are in situations like yours, the parents contact would be arranged by social workers so they wouldn’t be turning up at random times and they could even use a contact centre if you didn’t want them in your home, message me if you need more info

Where as my siblings were destroyed by not being taken into care. As the youngest by a way I’m the only one that has a functioning healthy life (one alcoholic, one dead from drugs at 25 and one has had 6 children removed).

Foster parents who can deal with trauma and can deal with parents trying to interfere can be vastly better than a well-meaning but ineffective relative.

it’s nowhere near as black and white as people are making out. A broken placement with the Op would do a lot of damage to all 3 children involved.

You will should get paid as a family and friends foster cater and you will should have support from social workers, you will should also be able to ask for things such as money for trips and clothes, extra furniture etc and there are a large number of groups for people who are in situations like yours, the parents contact would be arranged by social workers so they wouldn’t shouldn’t be turning up at random times and they could even use a contact centre if you didn’t want them in your home, message me if you need more info

Pretending that all social work departments and social workers will stick to their promises is setting the OP up for massive let down and failure

What a great post, you sound lovely! I’m sure they are very lucky to have you in their lives.Seriously.

If only people on here actually stopped and thought about this properly, rather than just saying off the cuff what they would do.
The reality of the situation is very different.

People also don’t realise how some foster parents are well equipped and supported to look after troubled children.

YANBU You are entitled to feel the way you do and to put your family unit first. It’s an awful situation though. I don’t want to make your dilemma feel worse, but in the interest of you thinking through all the facts, bear in mind that children rarely remain in one foster home, they usually have many throughout the course of their childhood. Also, speaking as someone who worked in child protection for many years, I feel it’s important to say that not all foster carers are lovely people. Some do it just for the money and some don’t treat their foster children well. Your Niece may be lucky, but she may not be. She might be showing some disruptive behaviour now due to all the chaos she’s experienced, but she is very young, so in a stable home, this should settle.

Great book for anyone parenting traumatised children and there is a free facebook group too

Not your responsibility.

Don’t do it.

A friend of mine did this and now has legal guardianship of her niece. She was child free before hand so didn't have other children to consider in it all.

She has said that if has been very difficult at times for a few different reasons.
-facilitating access with little girls mum
-navigating niece's understanding of living with her, calling her mum, understanding who her biological mum is

• navigating the many times her biological mum cancels access - effect on niece, having to find alternative activities to help ease the blow when mum cancels.
• living a stones throw away from biological mum.
• going through all the legal side.

It's been tough going but she's glad she did it.

Ultimately you have to do what is best for your family, it's too big of an undertaking to take on with misgivings.

I've been in a similar situation (different as child's parent died). I took them in. I won't lie and say it was all plain sailing and easy however we are all really happy!

One piece of advice I would give you OP is that if you decide to take your niece in you have to be 100% committed to the idea. Otherwise you just won't make it through the transition period or subsequent bumpy patches without somehow resenting the child which they simply don't deserve - they are already at a disadvantage in life through no fault of their own.

It's just not about caring for the child what about the parents and maintaing / facilitating contact. They might not respect the rules and cause issues for you and your children.
Then there will be meetings with Ss .maybe other appointments the child might require. The child may have suffered trauma as a result of her parents care which can have a massive impact you all.
If you don't want to do it don't be pressurised by Ss etc I was called callous when I refused to take SIL grandson with sen but I had my own children some with sen and I knew I it would not be fair on my children or myself.

Remember it's not just about taking on a child you might feel duty bound to help, you will also be taking on her parents, now in the immediate crisis and throughout her childhood - navigating their contact with her, she may well have significant emotional, behavioural needs linked to her early trauma and you would need to be 100% committed, it's more than making physical space in your home.

Say no if you are not sure. I am a social worker who has seen people desperately struggling with this dilemma and in my opinion family placements only have a strong potential to work as a long term arrangement where there is a clear love/connection with the child, determination to make it work and a set up whereby contact with parents can be managed fairly amicably.

I was peripherally involved in a similar scenario. The DB refused to take the child who ended up being adopted. The DB already had 2 older DC who would have been hugely affected, they said they really didn’t have space or money, but mostly the care order would have required contact and ultimately they said they couldn’t deal with the birth mother. I was pretty horrified at the time, but tears on (and now with my own DC) totally understand why the DB said no. You need to do what works for you and your family.

@Catlady2021

If there were highly trained foster carers on standby waiting to look after children in this position, giving them stable homes then perhaps foster care would be a good option but alas there's not, children are being placed in with other foster children after social workers have begged the cater to tag just one more, they are being placed out of area, they are being placed in children's homes and most of all they are being shipped from one home to another as foster carers, often older than ideal, are overwhelmed