To think how I discipline my dog is no-one else’s business?

[1Childand1Dog87]

I have a 3 year old dog, had him ever since he was a puppy. I am quite strict with him - he isn’t allowed to jump up at people, he isn’t allowed to approach other dogs without the owner’s permission, he is sent to his bed when the family eat so he doesn’t beg for food, he is told no when he touches something he shouldn’t like the children’s toys etc - and occasionally if I have had to tell him more than once about something (he has a habit of getting distracted when guests are over) then he goes to his bed for some time out etc.

Because of this, he is generally a really well behaved dog and I’ve never really had any issues with him apart from if he gets distracted and overwhelmed with loads of people or loads going on, he can struggle to concentrate on what is being said to him - but that is something that is a work in progress. In a normal environment he is very good at listening, etc.

The issues I have had however are with family members making comments every time I do put these boundaries into place - because basically they think he should be able to just do whatever he wants to do. Like an example from earlier today - his behaviour has been all over the place the last few days from being quite overwhelmed with Christmas and busy households - this is normal for him and will settle back down when everything else quietens down. He had something in his mouth that he shouldn’t have done and could have easily caused an issue to himself had he swallowed it - I told him to drop it a couple of times and he didn’t - so I VERY lightly tapped him on the nose and he dropped it straight away and went back to playing with his toys. I very rarely do that unless it’s something he needs to let go of right that second for his own sake and safety and he isn’t listening to verbal commands because of distractions etc rather than trying to drag it out of his mouth. But my family said I should have just left him and he might have dropped it eventually etc.

One family member has a similar dog and she lets him get away with murder and then constantly moans about it - he doesn’t let her sleep and rules the household basically - and yet she criticises me for actually having rules and boundaries with my dog.

Any advice for how I handle this situation?

@Inextremis I remember one time when one of my kids was really young and they reached towards a hot drink someone was holding - it happened so quick I very quickly and gently tapped their hand away from the cup - had it been something that wasn’t an immediate threat and she had properly and reliably understood the word no (she was toddler stage) then it wouldn’t have happened - but it certainly didn’t cause her any harm or damage (she didn’t even cry, just gave me a funny look) but it stopped a potentially serious burn from happening which would have been a lot worse - but I’m sure people will equate that to being a horrible parent and beating my child every day too 🤷‍♀️

Our spaniel whenever the grandchildren come round goes crazy, he adores them but gets overload with all the excitement of little people. I do put him away for his own peace sometimes.

Christmas is a crazy time for pets. The cat disappears as soon as humans arrive. Especially little ones

You need to work on the ‘drop’ command, your dog is 3 years old and should know this command by now. Personally I would never tap a dog on its nose, however, you appear to find it acceptable and are trying to justify your actions. A lot of what you’ve said in your OP suggests your dog isn’t as perfectly trained as you think.

I very rarely do that unless it’s something he needs to let go of right that second for his own sake and safety and he isn’t listening to verbal commands

So this isn’t a one off is it? He should know to drop an item by age 3. We have working labs and spaniels and they drop items easily when you train them. We’ve also never had to put any dog in ‘time out’, they’re not children for goodness sake.

There’s no need to be ‘strict’ with dogs if they’re properly trained with kindness from a young age, especially working breeds and training takes a LOT of work.

Also, @Ginsloth speaks sense - one of the few posters on this thread to do so :)

@justasking111 when he is in a calm environment and there is little distractions around he listens really well but as soon as things get busy etc it’s like all sense just goes out the window! Plus it’s the first Christmas we’ve had with everyone around because of COVID etc so it was definitely a bit overwhelming for him, so that’s a lesson in itself for next year and how to handle the plans etc!

Inextremis No, I own a collie and a terrier and for the past 3 years I've fostered rescue dogs.

I'm frustrated that half the poor souls I end up having are the result of shitty dog training techniques and idiot owners.

Having had a puppy that ended up having open stomach surgery from swallowing a drawing pin, I completely understand your actions OP. Recovering from a serious op would be far more painful than a tap on the nose. Our dog had snuffled it before any of us had the chance to do anything about it, but if giving him a tap on the nose had encouraged him to spit it out I would have done this in a heartbeat.

Nope - sorry don’t agree with your actions.

How you discipline your dog is other people's business if there is abuse going on.

However, from the lovely rosy picture you've painted of your exemplary training, on the face of it on a normal day I don't think there is any abuse going on.

What is key is this "tap". It was, you say, the lightest of taps... and I don't agree with pps who seem to say that dogs' noses are so tender that the lightest of taps would hurt. Mine loves to be scratched right there, with quite a bit of pressure, and if you don't scratch hard enough she leans in for more. So sensitive yes, but a light finger tap won't hurt really.

Yet... the tap was enough to elicit a comment. So someone thought that how you disciplined your dog was their business.

I must say I'm on the fence here. What we need is to know the Newtons measurement of this tap. If my DD had picked up a tack I would have been over like a shot and would have gently opened her mouth to get it out. She would have thought it was all a splendid game, but she would have given up the tack immediately.

But it’s a gradual process. What started with my pup as a food treat for staying on the ground, reduced to a “yes” (which he knows is a praise due to previous games to teach him this), and over time now I just treat or say yes in a specific situation that I know he finds hard to keep calm and controlled in, for example when welcoming lots of people into our home. I also would focus on one thing at a time for a few weeks, so it wasn’t rewards all over the place for anything and everything.
Not all dogs are the same, you’re right. I was sharing a method that worked for me on the advice of a dog trainer, as what the OP has been doing is well-meaning but clearly not as effective as she’d like. I’m not suggesting that for the rest of the dog’s life he gets a treat everytime he stays on the ground, they do learn over time.
You’re definitely right in that you have to get to know your dog. Our boy is 2 and is still very over excited around other dogs and we are working on that. We find distraction, and like you say getting his eye contact, with the “look at me” command helps him to regain his composure. Still not perfect on that, especially when another dog is off lead and comes bounding over!

The tapping on the nose I don't agree with. What you do is use a high value treat as a bribe. If he has something he shouldn't have then use a tiny piece of cooked meat or cheese or something you know he'll do anything for, something high value to him which he will gladly drop the other item for without any argument. It's much easier and avoids any conflict because the dog doesn't want to give it up. To be honest if he's still a 'work in progress ' after 3 years and your having to get physical to get him to obey you then maybe that's a sign your methods aren't working. My dog often gets things he knows he shouldn't and I get them back off him in seconds with no tapping on the nose or dramas. He gives them up willingly because I produce something else even tastier that he will do anything for. It has to be something that is of higher value to him than the item he shouldn't have. It's not ideal but it works.

I agree with the point about distracting rather than hitting - offer something else and take away the thing you don't want him to have.

There are better and more humane ways to teach a dog to
drop something the first time
you ask so that you don’t need to
use punitive methods. I usually use Chirag Patel’s method although there are other positive ways.

@Pocketfullofdogtreats if it hadn’t of been something so dangerous that’s what I would have done - or used the drop command effectively - I have already explained that I don’t use this as a training technique and it happened out of panic - I have already said that before and it’s getting tiring repeating myself because people either don’t read or pay attention to PP

@1Childand1Dog87 I too was with you til you said you hit dog on nose.

My dog {and past dogs} have been very well trained/well mannered, but hitting ''Tapping'' is hitting should not be done.

You seem to think you are a good dog owner, actually I think you are cruel and really not as good as you think you are. You think your dog is well behaved, I think he has had all his personality bullied out of him. I was pretty shocked that you send your dog to bed! Dogs don’t understand that, dogs don’t understand punishment. Your training seems to be about punishment not training. And no you shouldn’t hit your dog, do you really need to be told that. I am not surprised your family are concerned about your dog.

You should be training your dog better and without punishment. My dogs aren’t the smartest of breeds but the drop command is one of the most important commands we have, it was taught early, it never fails and it doesn’t involve hitting.

Seriously, I used to touch my dog on the nose when she wouldn't drop something I was reminding her what I wanted her to fo same as touching her paw for shake and her bottom for sit

Our working dogs are completely disinterested in other dogs. But little people AHH they like to play, they drop or hand over treats.

I had a spaniel who would leak a little in excitement whenever visitors they knew arrived.

I've a spaniel who will howl when the parties over and silence descends.

We lost a friends two year old once found him curled up with the Labrador in the dogs bed both fast asleep.

Sensory overload is something children and dogs have in common.

then he goes to his bed for some time out

What do you mean by a time out?

It’s great to hear about someone training their dog and not letting it do whatever it wants but you sound very intense and controlling and the way you speak about your dog sounds like you treat the dog like a human.

If you see very well trained dogs, they are not being constantly controlled by their owners.
Your dog isn’t well behaved if you need to keep on at it.
They are given short, clear instructions so they can understand.

My dog isn’t perfect but I don’t need to even say the command and she’ll sit or lie down just by what I do with my hands and the energy I give off.
If I said “sit,sit,sit,sit,sit” she probably wouldn’t understand what I was asking if her.

Well done for trying hard at raising a well behaved dog but do pull back and loosen the reins a bit.

@Aprilx thank you for your input 🥰

Sure there are better ways to train a dog to drop something that they shouldn’t have and I don’t agree with physical punishment as a rule. However when you’re in a situation where the dog could swallow something extremely harmful to their health in a second, there isn’t always time to source a high value treat as a distraction. A light tap on the nose should never be used as a general training method or punishment for an animal, but if it’s a potential life threatening situation or one that could cause the animal serious harm then it’s the lesser of two evils.

I have had to remove items from dog's mouths on several occasions, {Stick jammed between carnassials/choking on oldskool hide chew {very dangerous things} and they have to trust you to enable you to look/reach inside their mouths so you can remove stuck item without them panicking.

Some folks would have a conniption if they ever witnessed someone carrying out the Heimlich manoeuvre 😁😁

You are very welcome and I hope you will reflect on the miserable life you are giving this dog.

@toocold54 an example of when I send him to bed isn’t always about punishment - for example he finds it hard to settle with strangers in the house like he will just pace and pace up and down not knowing what to do with himself - so I put him in his bed in another room with something to keep him occupied and it settles him down.

Sometimes especially if we are having a busy day with people over - you can tell he is absolutely worn out but can’t sleep because of the distractions of everyone being there - so I put him in his bed away from everyone - and he is usually asleep by the time I’ve left the room.

sometimes I need to do that for his own sake and his own good