To have risked severely offending this friend by being truthful here?

[ColinRobinsonsfamiliar]

long awaited night out with great close group of friends. About 8 of us.
Planned a couple of months ago and finally got a date good for us all.8pm table booked.
The group is older, all with either grown up kids or older kids of our own.
One though has a toddler. She doesn’t get out at all really except with us.
She was telling me the other day that her (god damned useless/areshole) “D” H suggested she bring the toddler along to the meal as it’s been a while since some of us haven’t seen said toddler for a few months and must be missing him terribly.
It’s a bit of an issue normal as this friend tends to dominate things by insisting on passing round endless pictures of toddler and insisting we each look at the various films & pictures of the child.
I was really taken aback by this suggestion and said that I really really think it’s an adults only evening and would toddler not be in bed by 8pm? To which She said she would keep toddler awake so we could all see him for the meal.
To which I said that with all due respect, some of the group would not come if she brought the child along as it would change the dynamic of the evening that we had all been looking forward to for so long.
She just couldn’t understand where I was coming from at all, I couldn’t understand her pov at all either.
Believe me, 8 out of 8 of the others would not come if she brought the child cute as he is. They would cancel.
How would you have worded this??

Toddler on a night out, absolute no no, from both perspectives. Awful for the adults and probably even more so for a small tired, bored child. I love children and babies but it's just not appropriate and you were right to tell her the honest truth

Yes have a plan to obstruct his controlling and domineering ways.

Why not see if someone can offer to pick her up to avoid this?

Her child's father is useless and won't mind his child for one night. Poor woman, but yanbu

YANBU. The only time my best friend and I ever fell out was when she and her 3-year old son came to stay, and it turned out she had promised him he could stay up until she and I went to bed. Of course the child was knackered and grizzly and grumpy and ruining our evening, so we all had to go to bed because SHE’D PROMISED HIM he could stay up. The next day I said how unreasonable it was to promise young children things that weren’t in their best interests without considering anyone else’s feelings and she went berserk. Never criticise a mother, I learnt from that episode, and I hope she learned that her child may be the centre of her universe but not to assume anyone else feels the same fascination and adoration for them.

She sounds totally bonkers.

I'd have just said "sorry, kids are not allowed. This is an adults only meal out. We are having a break from the kids."

Is it actually that her husband won't look after the toddler?

I think you’re right to say it’s an adults only evening, and your wording sounds fine.

I wouldn’t be thrilled about having a toddler join a lunchtime meal, but an evening one, when the toddler’s overtired sounds much worse.

Some parents do have massive blind spots about how interested other people are in their children.
I’ve known one or two parents like this, who assume everyone they know finds their children just as adorable and fascinating as they do, and genuinely seem to think that everyone else loves non-stop photos and videos and stories about their children. It can get very very tiresome.

I would not have worded this any differently from how you did. The only way to deal with CF requests like this is an unqualified no that they can’t challenge to “misinterpret” as a yes. You started polite with the “won’t toddler be in bed” and when she came back with her insane suggestion to keep toddler up for hours, you shut it down.

He games. Just disappears for whole evenings and days off work to the loft, closes the door and games. Leaving her to it.
She has severe chronic health conditions.
He does nothing. Zero. Absolutely nothing around the house or to help her at all ever.
The most selfish, self centred arse I have ever had the misfortune to meet.

She invited a couple of us round for coffee one day and he was off. For some unknown reason he wouldn’t leave the living room. (Only room we could sit) and because we were talking, he turned up the Simpsons so loud we couldn’t hear each other. He couldn’t hear the Simpsons over our talking apparently.
She didn’t say a word just smiled and began watching the Simpsons with him… we left shortly after.

Utter utter areshole.

No one is this clueless. And you clearly don't like the dh. I suspect there's a lot more going on here and she's suggesting this ans pretending she thinks it's a good idea because most likely her dh is refusing to look after the toddler/she doesn't trust him with the toddler.

I assume there's a story behind you hating him?

If he does drop her and bring the child in just say “oh hello toddler, it’s way past your bedtime. Daddy needs to take you home to bed -goodnight” then turn and chat to a fellow grown up or something, he should get the message.

I am really surprised by these responses!

Agree with you OP that a toddler should be at home in bed at 8pm and that having a child around on a night out really changes (and spoils) the dynamic.

However, I would always avoid telling a friend that her child wasn’t welcome. Maybe my friendship group is really different to yours, but I would just never under any circumstances tell a friend that a member of her family was not welcome. The way some people are talking sounds like a scene from East Enders where everyone ‘calls everyone out’ loudly and to their face the whole time.

Your friend obviously has DH problems and/or is besotted with her child. People never, ever accept being told this to their face. They have to come to that conclusion by themselves.

Tell her you love her toddler but:
-Her toddler wouldn’t enjoy it
-You were all looking forward to seeing her by herself
-You all think she needs a night off from her DH and toddler
-you were planning on discussing a family day out when you meet up for the evening. You’d like all the various kids and DHs to get together soon during the day so you’ll see the toddler soon but not that evening
etc etc.

There are lots of ways to put her off bringing her toddler without the drama llama stuff.

YANBU, but I think you could have handled this more diplomatically. It's harsh to say no one will want you there if you have your child.

What she her DH is suggesting would be expected in Spain. People go out and eat and drink and attend parties with their kids from the off. It's considered strange to leave them tbh.

Also this woman is your friend. Okay she's being v OTT but we've all had our PFB. I personally was very conscious of trying not to talk about mum life and kids too much as most of my friends didn't have kids then, but tbh it was a really struggle because frankly, with 2 under 2 I really didn't have much else going on for a while.

Also sounds like friend's husband is trying to wiggle out of staying in with kid, so I wouldn't judge your mate too harshly. You never know what's going on. You said yourself you're her only group to see atm. Early motherhood can be very lonely, especially if you're doing it at a different time to your friends.

Sounds like deadbeat Dad is controlling. He does not want his partner to go out and knows that by bring toddler or popping in with toddler will eventually lead to her not being invited.

Yep.
But quite honestly, since she seems very thick skinned, if it’s looking like she’ll bring the child anyway or her husband might pull this trick, I’d be tempted to disinvite her this time and say you look forward to catching up another time when she’s free to come on her own.

Couldn't someone offer to pick her up on their way through?

I would hate to have a toddler at a meal and would say no too. But it does sound as if the real problem is the friends controlling arsehole of a husband.

Sounds like her husband has refused to babysit so she has no choice but to bring her child. If as you say she doesn't have many other friends, I do feel sorry for her as this may be her only opportunity to socialise. I do understand that it's annoying having a toddler at a dinner but given the circumstances of the useless husband, I'd feel sorry for my friend and let her bring the child

I’d have pointed out that ‘kids are like farts….you can just about stand your own’

You worded it well, @ColinRobinsonsfamiliar did your friend understand at the end of the conversation that her toddler would definitely not be coming?

If the 'd'h does bring the toddler in to the restaurant I think you all need to either be blunt and say 'Hi and goodbye, time for us to enjoy our evening, just us' or completely ignore him and the toddler and chat amongst yourselves, very difficult to do that though.

Is there any way you can see her on her own and talk to her about how adult occasions are for adults and you want to spend time with her not her toddler, that she is your friend and not her toddler? It's hard I know but I think you need to be clear with her what the expectations and boundaries are.

“What she her DH is suggesting would be expected in Spain”

wonder when the last time the dh took his kid out on a night out with his mates??

Even if it’s out of your way, pick her up. Lie that your DH has to drop something to a friend who lives near you and you thought he could bring you and you’ll collect her on way. Stop her dh have the excuse to be an arse.

however sounds like he’s trying to isolate her from friends - don’t let him.

I usually pick up said friend but unfortunately end up stuck in the car outside her house, last time it was nearly 2 hours having to look at endless pictures of toddler and family on dropping her home after the meal.
On picking her up she is always always late gesturing me to come into the house and wait meaning I’m sat with the toddler while she gets ready and the shouts the husband down for 20 minutes to “take over from Colin” so she can leave.
It’s the same thing every single time.
This time I can’t.

Yep.

The only way around this stuff is go to the bingo. Can get a meal, a drink and a chance of winning some coin. No kids allowed.

Been there.

How would you have worded this??

"What do you mean - bring him along? The table's booked for 8pm, he'll be tucked up in bed by then, at home with dad won't he?"

Any pushback - "You know as well as everyone else how long this adults-only dinner has taken to plan. Leave DC at home with his dad & don't be silly."

I bet he is emotionally abusive to her. Without a doubt.