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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To ask what exactly Clarkson

897 replies

Nogbreaks · 19/12/2022 08:26

Feels Meghan has done to him to justify the vitriol and misogyny of that article he wrote where he’d like to see her naked and assaulted?

I mean WTF? How in earth did a major publication think that it was fine to publish his little sexual fantasy about hurting a woman like that?

I’m no fan of the Royals in any form, and could care less about their infighting, but why are we surprised that there is so much violence against women and girls when this kind of article by an influential man is seen as okay to write?
Where’s his description of a naked, vulnerable Harry being assaulted??

OP posts:
LowbrowVictoriana · 19/12/2022 10:12

ToastingToes · 19/12/2022 09:19

He's still entitled to his opinion and entitled to share it.
You don't have to like it or agree with it, but he's still entitled to it.

Show quote history

(someone) is "entitled" to their opinion.

Are they really? This is one of my most hated phrases. And that's all it is: a phrase, a cliché... it's not a right, nor is it protected in law.

You may think whatever you like, but expressing, say, explicitly hateful or racist "opinions "is not your "right" and may have legal consequences. That is apart from the morally reprehensible nature of such views on which grounds they should be challenged.
Had Clarkson been chatting to mates in the pub, his "opinion" would have been his to make; publishing his wish for violence and degradation on a woman he's never met and who has done no one any harm in a national newspaper is completely unacceptable, should not be his entitlement; and those who defend it must be pretty morally dubious themselves.

Dotjones · 19/12/2022 10:12

electricmoccasins · 19/12/2022 10:02

I don’t understand the ‘…but it’s a scene from GoT’ defence.

At Easter, will it be okay for a journalist to write that MM should be stripped, whipped and crucified? And then say, it’s okay, it’s just a reference to Jesus Christ’s sufferings. Just because there is a cultural touchstone for something, doesn’t mean it’s okay to apply it.

And as PPs have says, this didn’t start with GoT. This goes back to the Middle Ages and before. Woman paraded, humiliated, drowned, burned as witches for not fitting in with expected female stereotypes. The trope of the ‘unquiet’ woman who needs to be punished is as old as the hills.

I think the "defence" is that Game of Thrones is a fictional TV programme and the suggestion that Meghan should be forced to walk naked through the streets with shit being thrown at her is clearly not to be taken literally.

The proposal of an absurd or extreme form of action as a reaction to a person's behaviour or event is a common method of humourously ridiculing the situation whilst poking fun at oneself.

See the case of Paul Chambers, who joked on Twitter that he was going to blow up Robin Hood Airport a few years ago, his conviction was overturned on appeal after a campaign by the likes of Stephen Fry and Al Murray the Pub Landlord. The point was, an extreme reaction like this was so clearly over the top nobody with any sense would take it seriously.

As Al Murray the Pub Landlord pointed out at the time, it might be a shit joke, but you shouldn't punish people for making a "threat" when the threat isn't actually a threat, just a shit joke.

That's all Clarkson is doing here, following his usual style of humour. It's not to be taken seriously.

In any case, humour is subjective. Clarkson's style is well-known and shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone. If you dislike his style, don't read his columns, and if you dislike rubbish, don't read the Sun.

oakleaffy · 19/12/2022 10:13

I’m no fan of M&H , and find them self important , spoilt and entitled, but Clarkson ( Didn’t know him , had to Google who he was) really has gone too far.
Completely vile, like a scatological sexual perversion, where he hopes a woman is basically “Tarred and feathered” .
Revolting little man.

PoorMeAnotherEggNogg · 19/12/2022 10:14

Sartre · 19/12/2022 08:37

He’s justifying everything Harry and Meghan have said about the media and completely vindicating them.

This 100%
I've always hated JC, I hope he reels it in going forward but I'm sure he'll use it as a an example of how "you can't say anything these days"

TintinHadToBeMale · 19/12/2022 10:15

Mooda · 19/12/2022 08:37

YANBU. The whole piece is pure misogyny.

I couldn't believe what I was reading. Now I understand it's a Game of Thrones reference which at least gives some context but I don't think that changes anything - the imagery and sentiment are so utterly vile.

And obviously pure coincidence that Clarkson was out socialising earlier this week with Camilla and that other fair minded tabloid hack Piers Morgan.

That it’s a reference to a current fiction brings to mind the old feminist critiques of the misogynistic way women are portrayed in fiction supplied predominantly by men. The violence in film has increased massively as worse and worse has become acceptable: it is usually women on the receiving end, and men who predominantly produce it.

TheKeatingFive · 19/12/2022 10:16

That's all Clarkson is doing here, following his usual style of humour. It's not to be taken seriously.

And we wonder why crime and misogynistic attacks against women continue to be an enormous blight on society.

Christ almighty 🤦‍♀️

IncessantNameChanger · 19/12/2022 10:18

ACynicalDad · 19/12/2022 08:36

Also it’s not just Clarkson a whole line of sub-editors, probably right up to the editor themselves thought this was ok to print.

This. There should be criminal charges. Why should it matter if people like or dislike her? It's a hate crime and normalised / enforcement of misogyny and racism. No wonder those two are coming across tortured souls.

Imagine if that was your daughter? He is like Trump. Wiping up hatred to incite violence.

I don't get what she has done either.

TheKeatingFive · 19/12/2022 10:18

Was the relentless media bullying of Caroline Flack supposed to be 'not taken seriously' either? And yet we all know how that ended.

TintinHadToBeMale · 19/12/2022 10:21

TintinHadToBeMale · 19/12/2022 10:15

That it’s a reference to a current fiction brings to mind the old feminist critiques of the misogynistic way women are portrayed in fiction supplied predominantly by men. The violence in film has increased massively as worse and worse has become acceptable: it is usually women on the receiving end, and men who predominantly produce it.

Show quote history

(Meaning: it’s no excuse. It merely highlights the acceptability of violence against women and girls and misogyny throughout the male population.)

unclebuck · 19/12/2022 10:23

It's a misogynistic fetish isn't it? Hurling shit at a naked woman who behaves in a way you disapprove of. These fantasies give men like Clarkson/Piers Morgan etc a hard on. Shame, for him he revealed this, he has almost redemed himself from being a racist bully with his farming show and the charming Caleb sidekick.

CellarBellaatemycoal · 19/12/2022 10:23

Unbelievable that it ever got past editors. Utterly disgusting. Worrying that Jeremy Clarkson is in a position to influence a lot of young people (mainly male) through shows like top gear (which let’s face it are still aimed at men and boys). Pig of a man.

Snowyy · 19/12/2022 10:24

He no more meant she should be stripped naked and marched through the streets than Meghan herself meant she was literally fed to the wolves. It is hyperbole.

I'll say it again Margoyles wanted Johnson to die from covid, Brand wanted acid thrown at Farage. Were any one you as horrified by those comments?!

It shouldn't have been printed I agree but well known peope do say offensive stuff all the time. Old white guy says it and people take it literally.

yesforone · 19/12/2022 10:25

ACynicalDad · 19/12/2022 08:36

Also it’s not just Clarkson a whole line of sub-editors, probably right up to the editor themselves thought this was ok to print.

And they all knew it was okay to print this because (some of the ) British public love it. They feed off of the hatred. They only print what sells.

CaptainMyCaptain · 19/12/2022 10:26

JanetheObscure · 19/12/2022 10:06

Ah, thanks @CaptainMyCaptain . The principle is the same, though, as she was a fellow lunch guest.

But presumably not responsible for who else was invited.

TheKeatingFive · 19/12/2022 10:26

I'll say it again Margoyles wanted Johnson to die from covid, Brand wanted acid thrown at Farage. Were any one you as horrified by those comments?!

Those aren't okay either. But we've just had Meghan being rubbished by sections of society for talking about media campaigns against her and now Clarkson obliges with this. This kind of harassment and bullying is totally unacceptable.

Snowyy · 19/12/2022 10:26

'It's a misogynistic fetish isn't it? Hurling shit at a naked woman who behaves in a way you disapprove of.'

It is and yet Game of Thrones was so popular. I didn't watch it but from I gather it was full of horrific violence and misogyny. Why on earth did people love it?!

cakeorwine · 19/12/2022 10:27

Snowyy · 19/12/2022 10:24

He no more meant she should be stripped naked and marched through the streets than Meghan herself meant she was literally fed to the wolves. It is hyperbole.

I'll say it again Margoyles wanted Johnson to die from covid, Brand wanted acid thrown at Farage. Were any one you as horrified by those comments?!

It shouldn't have been printed I agree but well known peope do say offensive stuff all the time. Old white guy says it and people take it literally.

The Brand comment - do you know what the context of that was?
It wasn't in a national column - it was on a show called Heresy. Where a lot of outrageous things get said - but context is key. Did you hear the actual show and have you ever heard the actual show when it's normally on

Original poster
Nogbreaks · 19/12/2022 10:27

‘That's all Clarkson is doing here, following his usual style of humour. It's not to be taken seriously.’

Having actually spent time with him, Incan tell you he’s one of the most humourless people I’be ever worked with. He’s also one of those men who’ll talk to ANY man of any rank in the room before addressing a woman.
Hes Ronseal - you get what you see - cantankerous, rude to juniors, sexist, incredibly confident, slightly racist.

OP posts:
FancyFanny · 19/12/2022 10:27

I don't understand how this could even be published!

MissBattleaxe · 19/12/2022 10:28

That's all Clarkson is doing here, following his usual style of humour. It's not to be taken seriously

I can't believe what I'm reading. On what planet is this remotely humorous? There's a human being at the end of his vitriol, or is she supposed to laugh it off? Even the mental picture he paints humiliates her. He has over 7 million Twitter followers. He therefore has a responsibility over what he shares and the harm it can cause.

Original poster
Nogbreaks · 19/12/2022 10:29

Whether or. It it’s his ‘style’ to be a misogynistic creep I’m more upset at the other staff and Editors who thought this was okay to publish.

OP posts:
Untitledsquatboulder · 19/12/2022 10:29

CocoC · 19/12/2022 09:50

I can't stand Meghan, think she is a self indulgent, narcissitic trouble maker fuelled by jealousy of William & Kate, who did everything to get back in control.

However, I think the JC comments are totally unacceptable about ANY woman, as they are deeply misogynistic and disturbing, and show a real underlying desire to see a woman humiliated - I hope his head rolls, and especially those of the editors who printed this.

However, I also find it very annoying to read people on this thread who refer to this as being 'racism' - this has nothing to do with racism, and everything do to with misogyny. Don't confuse the two! This is also what makes people like Meghan so annoying to others, the fact that things are pinned on 'racism' when it's something else, which might be rudeness or unkindness, or even a kind of Xenophobia (about people who are not British) but not necessarily racism.

I disagree, I think race has everything to do with it. Sorry if that makes you uncomfortable but it's really, really obvious.

Snowyy · 19/12/2022 10:29

'The Brand comment - do you know what the context of that was?
It wasn't in a national column'

It was widely reported.

Were you offended by her inciting violence?

Mrsjayy · 19/12/2022 10:30

Nogbreaks · 19/12/2022 08:26

Feels Meghan has done to him to justify the vitriol and misogyny of that article he wrote where he’d like to see her naked and assaulted?

I mean WTF? How in earth did a major publication think that it was fine to publish his little sexual fantasy about hurting a woman like that?

I’m no fan of the Royals in any form, and could care less about their infighting, but why are we surprised that there is so much violence against women and girls when this kind of article by an influential man is seen as okay to write?
Where’s his description of a naked, vulnerable Harry being assaulted??

I agree with you, I actually think he should be reported for threatening violence. Its written in such a way that it wouldn't stick though. What a disgusting old man he is.

cakeorwine · 19/12/2022 10:31

The Brand comments

www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-48611424

The show is called Heresy. There were comments on milkshakes at Farage. She then said she was joking obviously

But the clips were shared edited and without context.

We can see what Clarkson was thinking.