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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To not want a stranger at Christmas?

816 replies

Oneeyedreindeer · 18/12/2022 22:15

My mother and brother were due to come to my house for Christmas. I am married with 3 DC, one of who is a young baby. Last week he randomly said he has a friend from abroad coming to stay for a month and if I don’t invite him he will be alone on Christmas Day.

i explained I don’t want a stranger there and it changes the dynamics with small children/breastfeeding etc. he is insisting I could meet the friend beforehand. He is like a dog with a bone and won’t drop it and keeps bringing it up/poor friend will he all alone etc etc. I’ve been clear that if he can’t come as he needs to be with his friend that’s fine and now I feel very mean indeed. But AIBU? I just think it would be very awkward indeed and I do also think there’s an element of my brother wanting to park up for some free/food drink with his friend - he suggested bringing his games consoles “for DC to play” although DC are 4 and under.

OP posts:
neverbeenskiing · 19/12/2022 13:38

"I don't care if someone else is on their own at Xmas" is not a feminist issue.

But the expectation that women swallow their own feelings of anxiety, irritation or discomfort to ensure the comfort and convenience of men in the name of "kindness" absolutely is a feminist issue.

OP is being called "mean", "selfish" and a "baby" by posters who have nothing negative whatsoever to say about her Brother. A 35 year old man-child who is happy to let his sister, who has just had a baby, feed and water him and his guest, while they spend the day gaming and enjoying her hospitality. He might profess to care about his friend being alone at Christmas, but he doesn't care enough to turn down the free food and drink on offer at OP's house and cook for his guest at home does he? It's so easy for men to appear kind and thoughtful by volunteering the services of their wives, girlfriends or female relatives.

whatkatydid2013 · 19/12/2022 13:42

LydiaBennetsUglyBonnet · 19/12/2022 09:57

Firstly how is it misandry to not want a random stranger in your home?

And I’m amazed people aren’t more careful of this. If it was in the news a child was attacked in their home by a complete stranger the FIRST thing people would say is “why on earth was this person allowed in a house of someone he’d never met”

Show quote history

Well it might be the first thing you’d say. I’d not say it because if something like that was to happen you’d have been incredibly unlucky. People invite people they don’t know into their homes for various reasons regularly and pretty confident that the overwhelming majority of the time nothing awful happens as a result. Really if you don’t want to invite people you don’t know to come and join a meal that’s totally understandable but you don’t need to come up with a load of reasons why no one else should do it or they are bad parents if they do.

SinnerBoy · 19/12/2022 13:45

People invite people they don’t know into their homes for various reasons regularly...

And others don't.

whatkatydid2013 · 19/12/2022 14:03

SinnerBoy · 19/12/2022 13:45

People invite people they don’t know into their homes for various reasons regularly...

And others don't.

Well possibly if they don’t get things repaired/quotes for work to be done, have a meter’s read, invite kids friends over and have parents turn up to collect, loan things to neighbours they come to collect, invite new partners of friends/family to join things etc then some people might not but most people have strangers in their homes and many people regularly do for all the reasons above and many more. @LydiaBennetsUglyBonnet is being as ridiculous in suggesting anyone who does invite people they don’t know or at least don’t know well to join them for Christmas are putting their children at risk as all the posters suggesting that the OP is awful if she doesn’t want to cook for strangers. It’s the season of good will and all that. It’s perfectly possible to not want to do the same as someone else without them being mean/reckless/stupid/uncharitable etc etc.

Pothoswithasparkle · 19/12/2022 14:04

Half of you are scared to answer door fgs😂
Stop pretending everyone would be fine with being pressured into hosting extra basically last minute😂

SinnerBoy · 19/12/2022 14:04

Well possibly if they don’t get things repaired/quotes for work to be done, have a meter’s read...

Well, the situations are hardly comparable, are they? She said no, so why people are telling her that she should just do it is a bit surprising to me.

ArabianLeopardCub · 19/12/2022 14:17

This not some random stranger, it is a friend of her brother.

If I was inviting my brother or other family member around for Christmas lunch, and they said such and such is staying with me - the invite would automatically be extended. Pretty much everyone I know would be the same. I have never heard of such in-hospitable people in real life.

We know this is not a capacity issue - as the Op has said his GF would be welcome.

To be honest though, if I was the friend and I was aware of this reluctance to invite me I would not want to go. It is obviously not going to be a warm or enjoyable occasion.

The guy is from China? I have lived in China - the sharing of food and community is second nature there. He will think you all most odd I am sure,

WomanStanleyWoman2 · 19/12/2022 14:23

Flapjackquack · 19/12/2022 12:27

Well yes but to what extent? I am going to a European country to stay with friends next year. I know that there is a festival specific to that region of the country and there is a two day celebration with food and most shops will be shut. I haven't researched the minutiae of how every family celebrates as I have assumed my friend is ok with us coming over those dates having agreed them. The onus was on OP's brother to check it was ok before telling his friend he could come but I wouldn't expect a foreign guest to know the ins and outs of a UK Christmas which just from this thread is different for everyone. The whole world isn't tuned into the UK, we even celebrate on a different day to most of Europe. The Chinese friend will also have restricted internet in China too.

Show quote history

“The whole world isn’t turned into the UK” 🙄🙄 Would you say that about any other country?

No one has said the whole world should be like the UK. But given that that’s the country he’s visiting at Christmas, is it really relevant what the customs may be in Romania, Finland or Greece?

Also, I don’t think internet access is quite so restricted in China as to keep the date of Christmas a secret.

ArabianLeopardCub · 19/12/2022 14:27

I can almost guarantee that if your brother visited him in China at Chinese New Year, your brother would be welcomed into the family festivities. There is no way they would leave him home alone 'because he doesn't celebrate it' or he is a strange.r. In my experience he would be treated as a guest of honour and have food and drinks almost forced on him.

Flapjackquack · 19/12/2022 14:27

@WomanStanleyWoman2 - I said tuned, not turned. Googling would have probably told him that at Christmas in the UK family and friends get together, put up decorations, have a big meal and swap presents. His friend, the OP's brother, had said it's ok to come stay for December. Where in that is someone not immersed in the UK's weird and unspoken rules around social engagement is the poor man meant to guess that he wouldn't be welcome to spend Christmas with his friend's family so he should avoid coming to the UK over 25 December??

whatkatydid2013 · 19/12/2022 14:44

SinnerBoy · 19/12/2022 14:04

Well possibly if they don’t get things repaired/quotes for work to be done, have a meter’s read...

Well, the situations are hardly comparable, are they? She said no, so why people are telling her that she should just do it is a bit surprising to me.

Tell me you didn’t read the whole comment without telling me you didn’t read the whole comment 😂
As I said originally to not want to invite people to dinner is totally understandable but suggesting anyone who wants to is an irresponsible parent as some posters have (not the OP but the one I responded to) is ridiculous.

Loics · 19/12/2022 14:51

ArabianLeopardCub · 19/12/2022 14:27

I can almost guarantee that if your brother visited him in China at Chinese New Year, your brother would be welcomed into the family festivities. There is no way they would leave him home alone 'because he doesn't celebrate it' or he is a strange.r. In my experience he would be treated as a guest of honour and have food and drinks almost forced on him.

Which is OP's brother's fault for threatening to leave him home alone. Or is him harassing her about it okay?
He could have a lovely Christmas dinner with his actual host, however his host would rather leave him alone all day to allow himself to be fed by someone else.

Loics · 19/12/2022 14:54

Flapjackquack · 19/12/2022 14:27

@WomanStanleyWoman2 - I said tuned, not turned. Googling would have probably told him that at Christmas in the UK family and friends get together, put up decorations, have a big meal and swap presents. His friend, the OP's brother, had said it's ok to come stay for December. Where in that is someone not immersed in the UK's weird and unspoken rules around social engagement is the poor man meant to guess that he wouldn't be welcome to spend Christmas with his friend's family so he should avoid coming to the UK over 25 December??

OP's brother said it was okay, same brother also invited himself to OP's house, then dropped the friend coming too on her. This isn't the UK having weird and unspoken rules, it is a rude, lazy host who would rather bully his sister into providing a Christmas dinner than do it himself.

SinnerBoy · 19/12/2022 14:56

whatkatydid2013

Tell me you didn’t read the whole comment without telling me you didn’t read the whole comment.

Oops, busted!

LydiaBennetsUglyBonnet · 19/12/2022 14:56

neverbeenskiing · 19/12/2022 13:38

"I don't care if someone else is on their own at Xmas" is not a feminist issue.

But the expectation that women swallow their own feelings of anxiety, irritation or discomfort to ensure the comfort and convenience of men in the name of "kindness" absolutely is a feminist issue.

OP is being called "mean", "selfish" and a "baby" by posters who have nothing negative whatsoever to say about her Brother. A 35 year old man-child who is happy to let his sister, who has just had a baby, feed and water him and his guest, while they spend the day gaming and enjoying her hospitality. He might profess to care about his friend being alone at Christmas, but he doesn't care enough to turn down the free food and drink on offer at OP's house and cook for his guest at home does he? It's so easy for men to appear kind and thoughtful by volunteering the services of their wives, girlfriends or female relatives.

👏🏼 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼well said!

poefaced · 19/12/2022 15:01

neverbeenskiing · 19/12/2022 13:38

"I don't care if someone else is on their own at Xmas" is not a feminist issue.

But the expectation that women swallow their own feelings of anxiety, irritation or discomfort to ensure the comfort and convenience of men in the name of "kindness" absolutely is a feminist issue.

OP is being called "mean", "selfish" and a "baby" by posters who have nothing negative whatsoever to say about her Brother. A 35 year old man-child who is happy to let his sister, who has just had a baby, feed and water him and his guest, while they spend the day gaming and enjoying her hospitality. He might profess to care about his friend being alone at Christmas, but he doesn't care enough to turn down the free food and drink on offer at OP's house and cook for his guest at home does he? It's so easy for men to appear kind and thoughtful by volunteering the services of their wives, girlfriends or female relatives.

Very well said

ArabianLeopardCub · 19/12/2022 15:01

I don't agree with that at all. Completely overthinking the whole thing. I can guarantee if the brother offered to host Christmas that would be a problem too and the OP wouldn't want to go.

He wants to spend Christmas with his family and he doesn't want to leave his friend alone. The brother quite frankly sounds like the only reasonable person in this whole situation.

Flapjackquack · 19/12/2022 15:02

@Loics - I agree it's the brother's fault entirely but there are a couple of posters on here claiming the friend should have known not to come to the UK because it was Christmas and that is what I was responding to. And sorry but it is a bit weird when compared to many other cultures who take pride in welcoming guests. I am not saying the OP is wrong, but to an outsider with different rules around hospitality it probably will look strange. Again not the OP's fault, just a comment on cultural differences.

Loics · 19/12/2022 15:03

ArabianLeopardCub · 19/12/2022 15:01

I don't agree with that at all. Completely overthinking the whole thing. I can guarantee if the brother offered to host Christmas that would be a problem too and the OP wouldn't want to go.

He wants to spend Christmas with his family and he doesn't want to leave his friend alone. The brother quite frankly sounds like the only reasonable person in this whole situation.

...Reasonable? OP's brother, is that you? 🤣

whatkatydid2013 · 19/12/2022 15:06

SinnerBoy · 19/12/2022 14:56

whatkatydid2013

Tell me you didn’t read the whole comment without telling me you didn’t read the whole comment.

Oops, busted!

:) - I agree with you though it’s totally up to OP If she wants to host at all and who she is happy to have in her home for the day and it’s not mean to want to enjoy your own Christmas.

Loics · 19/12/2022 15:11

Flapjackquack · 19/12/2022 15:02

@Loics - I agree it's the brother's fault entirely but there are a couple of posters on here claiming the friend should have known not to come to the UK because it was Christmas and that is what I was responding to. And sorry but it is a bit weird when compared to many other cultures who take pride in welcoming guests. I am not saying the OP is wrong, but to an outsider with different rules around hospitality it probably will look strange. Again not the OP's fault, just a comment on cultural differences.

@Flapjackquack Fair enough, although the only weird one here is the brother. I'm not British, at home it is very much "the more the merrier" at Christmas, but OP's brother forcing her to host his friend is wrong. He has already invited himself, he should have been prepared to host his friend, knowing full well he would be staying over Christmas.

ArabianLeopardCub · 19/12/2022 15:31

Can you not understand though why the brother would not want to host Christmas alone with his friend? Most people I know want to be with others at Christmas, especially family if this is possible. The more the merrier vibe.

Two male friends having Christmas alone seems quite sad. It is not weird for people to want to spend it with their family. He probably doesn't want to admit to his friend that his family are so unwelcoming that he can't bring him to celebrate with them.

Original poster
Oneeyedreindeer · 19/12/2022 15:34

Flapjackquack · 19/12/2022 09:54

100% this. It’s all well and good shouting misogyny if the OP was just expected to cook by her whole family whilst they all sat round waiting to be fed, but OP openly admits she insists on cooking and doesn’t want people to help in the kitchen.

I never complain about having to do everything because I don’t do everything. I treat my husband like an adult with all the expectations that has, and between us we do 50/50 housework and childcare (actually it’s more 60/40 him/me as I work longer hours). Christmas Day we both cook if we are hosting or pitch in if parents are. You don’t get to insist on doing all the work then complain about having to do all the work!

Show quote history

This is not what I said! At all!

i am doing the cooking. DH is shit but I also enjoy the cooking. DH does everything else!!! I am not complaining about him at all - he doesn’t like having my family for Christmas as he sees them as “moochers”.

They will drink a lot and do some playing with the children which will get less and less as they drink more and more

A lot of people aren’t reading my posts which is why I have people rooting for my brother and his Chinese boyfriend despite saying many times he has a gf!

it is a good point that he doesn’t celebrate Christmas anyway so it’s not like it matters to him

OP posts:
Original poster
Oneeyedreindeer · 19/12/2022 15:34

INACGMOOH · 19/12/2022 10:38

@LydiaBennetsUglyBonnet "But you did claim I pulled the ‘dodgy character’ from nowhere when actually the OP said it herself"

She has literally not ever typed the word dodgy. You're making stuff up here, Lydia. I genuinely feel sorry for you that you exist in such fear that the world is so heavily populated by abusers, racists and well... men.

Tbf I did say that many of his friends smoke weed and are dodgy

OP posts:
LydiaBennetsUglyBonnet · 19/12/2022 15:36

Flapjackquack · 19/12/2022 15:02

@Loics - I agree it's the brother's fault entirely but there are a couple of posters on here claiming the friend should have known not to come to the UK because it was Christmas and that is what I was responding to. And sorry but it is a bit weird when compared to many other cultures who take pride in welcoming guests. I am not saying the OP is wrong, but to an outsider with different rules around hospitality it probably will look strange. Again not the OP's fault, just a comment on cultural differences.

Who said the friend shouldn’t have come to the UK??