I might well be unreasonable but here goes.....

[cocktailclub]

It seems that a lot of the working age population now are snowflakes or incompetent or just don't care enough to do a good job. It's rare to manage people who actually work reliably the hours they are paid to.
I just wonder what would happen to the economy in general if
A) employees turned up and worked hard for the hours they were paid
B) employees only took sick leave when they were really unwell
C) employees did not regard the usual ups and downs of life as 'mental health' but reserved that for people with actual mental illness like clinical depression, schizophrenia etc
D) employees just genuinely cared about doing a good job and tried hard

Also would the NHS thrive if we weren't all so dependent on referrals for minor issues and just took a bit of ownership and responsibility for staying well.

If people stopped blaming social workers for child abuse and looked at the parents.

Sorry a bit of a rant but I'm disillusioned

err @HotChoxs did you read your own article?

A lot of people who got a second job while they were on furlough, like driving for Amazon or working at Tesco, haven’t come back.

As I said why work in hospitality these days?

There's nothing imaginary about the staff shortage, but until the hospitality industry makes itself as competitive as the industries that are managing to hire and retain the talent, this problem isn't going to vanish.

People are working. They're just doing it elsewhere in exchange for better pay or better conditions. Restaurants don't have a right to trade if they can't attract and keep the staff they need.

"He has found that many young people starting their careers favour jobs at large retailers thanks to better starting salaries and easier working hours."

as I said

Haha I have just works 24 hours in 2 days doing 2 peoples job because they won't hire a replacement i am worn out and last week I was threatened with job loss if I am off sick in the next 6 months and I only had 1 sick day with a raging fever, safe to say I am looking for a new job ibeint be treated like shit oh and I get a tenner a hour

but that's my point. it's not a management problem if nobody wants to work in your industry anymore. it's an industry problem.

Totally agree. I generally find it with under the under 25’s especially, although some exceptions.

People are working. They're just doing it elsewhere in exchange for better pay or better conditions. Restaurants don't have a right to trade if they can't attract and keep the staff they need.

not sure how anyone can argue with this?

@HotChoxs where did I say anything about management. You replied to my post saying
Why are people coming up with their own imaginary explanations?

What did I say that was imaginary?

Hospitality can't get workers because workers don't want to work zero hour contracts. Employees don't want to be sent home for two hours and then called to come back in. Hospitality has trouble finding staff because the staff have gone to work somewhere else.
Customers are down, employers are struggling to offer decent employment packages. The workers are still working, just not in restaurants.

it's not a management problem if nobody wants to work in your industry anymore. it's an industry problem.

It's an industry problem if the industry is setting the wages and dictating the working conditions. It's a management problem if the management are in control of those things.

that wasn't aimed at you I was agreeing with what you were saying

employees only took sick leave when they were really unwell

This bugs me a bit if I'm honest, there are people who show up to work really poorly and take huge pride in it, when in actual fact, they just come in and make everyone else ill and it's a massive pain in the arse!

They're arguing with it by using illogical nonsense - the same PP, for about five pages now. And insisting their nonsense makes sense because everyone else in the world is dumb. (Mixed in with splash of "I didn't say [what's written in black and white a few posts up]" and sarcasm).

Laughing at people do the hours their payed for 🤣🤣🤣
99.9% of people do this plus more & eventually end up with burn out!

.bad management
.shite sickness targets
.lazy managers/supervisors/line managers
.shite pay
.favouritism
.underserving promotions
.power trips
.work overload
.accountability
Etc. Etc Etc....

Reading with intrigue, @cocktailclub I can understand your perspectives, and have seen similar myself

Have you ever thought that maybe it's not them, it's you? Maybe it's your leadership and management (or lack of) that's the issue?

My DD is a bar manager, lots of her staff are mums doing PT work. She puts a lot of effort into retaining them. Regular shifts, sensible pay and respect go a long way.

I'm guessing you are in a managerial or supervisory role.....well generally these days, one person does the job of three....they get one wage not three.....on top of this management still expect you to work extra hours.....work extra hours for free....change hours and timings when they balls up the rota.....expect you to drop everything for nothing .....oh and enjoy being treated like a mug whilst management get all the perks.....pay increases...praise.....performance pay and promotion on the backs of the true backbone workers ......it's called milking the system and it works both ways.....up the workers!!!✊

Exactly. I remember someone showing up acting all heroic because she had been up all night with a tummy bug. By the end of the week half the firm had it

Management aren't in control of people not going out as much after the pandemic, people not wanting to pay inflated prices, the new trend for home cooking using appliances, and the lack of cheap labour from the EU. The entire industry has gone into decline.

What does that have to do with your original statement of “it's not a management problem if nobody wants to work in your industry anymore. it's an industry problem.”

My response is addressing the above comment, not the subsequent tangent. The industry is not setting wages or dictating work conditions, that’s down to management.

The industry is also not at fault for individual businesses failing to adapt to market conditions. That is also down to how the business is managed.

Wow another one who think's it's a management problem.

GDP on it's knees, massive inflation, everyone striking, and so many still haven't woken up to the new normal. Perhaps management can solve that for us.

Management aren't in control of people not going out as much after the pandemic, people not wanting to pay inflated prices, the new trend for home cooking using appliances, and the lack of cheap labour from the EU. The entire industry has gone into decline.

COL is going to hit hospitality spending, the ones that survive will be the ones that stand out & have a usp.

Perhaps management can solve that for us.

Either management can solve it as that is what they are paid for or we need to rely on the fairy godmother.

It is a management problem.

If you cannot afford to create competitive staff conditions or cannot adapt your business to changing market conditions, you cannot afford to trade. There’s no given right to be in business; if you can’t afford the overhead to providing the service then that’s not the rest of the world’s fault.