Support thread for those hosting Ukrainian refugees.

[UltimateFoole]

I've started this new thread so that this support can continue for anyone hosting Ukrainians under the H4U scheme. Also for those thinking about hosting. And for anyone who has previously hosted and still needs support.

www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4552566-support-thread-for-those-hosting-refugees-and-advice-for-those-thinking-about-it?reply=122239451&utm_source=sendinblue&utm_campaign=Mumsnet_Watched_Thread_Notification_New_Talk&utm_medium=email

@user982548025 no, and I would be amazed if anything was said until it absolutely has to be. I cannot see this government choosing to allow up to 120,000 Ukrainians to stay indefinitely, or put them on a path to citizenship, and they have been very clear that the three year visa gives no rights in that regard. If the war has ended in two years time I'd expect some kind of transition period where children can finish the school year etc, and then they will be asked to go home - not least because I think in terms of international relations that is what Ukraine would want. They need people to rebuild and get to work there - they won't want half their women and children scattered across Europe and beyond. But there is a real chance it won't be over by then in which case they will have no choice but to extend visas - but I assume it will be on some kind of rolling basis.

My local news made quite a thing of a family who did this. I could help wondering what their hosts were thinking. I think it would have been the end of an arrangement for me.

Why?
There’s a big difference between being stuck in an area through all the ups and downs of the war and popping back for a few days at a point when things are relatively quiet.
If my guests went back to see people I would have no issue whatever. I am however happy they are safe here and the children can have school, nursery etc uninterrupted and without the risk of having to flee again.
At the start of the war their home in Kyiv will have been a pretty dangerous place to be. For most of the last year that has not been the case. However we don’t know what lies ahead in the coming months. It wouldn’t be good for the children to be moving their base frequently but going back for a holiday wouldn’t be unsettling in that way.

I don’t have a problem with that either. One of our local families did it too. Woman and little girl were desperate to see their husband/Dad and son/big brother. They made the difficult journey to Dnipro to see them. We were all worried for their safety and relieved they got back here ok.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11946489/Ukraine-scammers.html?ito=native_share_article-top

It is a fairly balanced article as it does make the point that of course plenty of those who have come here of course are not like that; but there do seem quite a few so perhaps a few changes to the scheme are needed.

I don’t think it’s balanced, it says that once whilst giving numerous examples of bad behaviour. That woman’s Facebook group is horrible, I lasted 10 mins before I felt sorry for any poor Ukrainian that were placed with sponsors who were in that group. There are much larger groups which offer support for sponsors and really do have a much more balanced and less xenophobic membership.
that woman has had a bad experience and is collecting here say stories and the ‘performing’ Facebook lives to spread them without any thought to how that could contribute towards bad feelings directed towards women and young children who have arrived from Ukraine. For every ‘my guest stole my husband story’ I’ve heard a ‘my guest was beaten up at school and is too scared to go back’ people just ought to try and be a little more balanced as there’s good and bad in every nation.

Also “my guest stole my husband” is such rubbish. Man has affair with a woman (likely much younger, possibly with dependent young kids) who was living in his home and dependent on his continued agreement in order to stay. If there was any level of coercion going on in that relationship sounds like it was going the other way. Is the Daily Mail ever balanced? It never used to be but haven’t read it for years and have no intention of helping their ad revenue by clicking into the article. We’ve had our guest for a year now. She sometimes does things that we wouldn’t and I find she’s not very proactive but some of the host support Facebook groups are blummin awful.

One of the complaints a woman was damned for in that group was a photo for a cleaning company. A pretty close up photo of a worktop and cupboard was used to try to set up a cleaning business. Personally a pretty non identifiable photo like that (especially if someone cleaned my kitchen first) wouldn’t bother me. Yes, polite to ask first, but I wouldn’t care if it happened. Even a family member might be pushed to identify it was certainly my kitchen from seeing a worktop and cupboard, let alone anyone else.
She then went on to say she’d had to ‘tell the woman how to clean’. I did wonder if that translated as ‘non English speaking guest checked which cleaning products to use before trying to help out. ‘ It sounded a rather twisted non-story all in all. Certainly rather inflated.

Yes, I agree.
There seems to be very little drama among the guests and hosts I know in real life. One host was upset her guest was sending money to relatives back home when she was giving her lots of free childcare so she could save for a flat deposit. The upset was understandable but it hardly makes her a conwoman. As for stealing husbands, well it’s mostly single women hosting single women and families hosting families. And that’s in nearly a year.
But of course it fills newspaper inches much better to make it all sound disastrous than to say lots of families are still chugging along fine, others ended the arrangement amicably and as planned when the guest found somewhere else or went home.

Typical Fail anti-refugee nonsense.

Just popping by to say my guests (who moved into a rental back in February) just called in yesterday with a Ukrainian Easter cake for me! Yesterday was Ukrainian Easter, apparently. Bloody delicious cake. Such lovely people.

No one can steal someone else. Its ridiculous.

I mean, if you got 110,000 British people together some would be lovely, some would be defrauding the benefits system, some would have affairs, some would be hypochondriacs, some would be hard working and resourceful, some would not. It's not surprising some people have had bad experiences and it's not surprising we don't hear more from the people that haven't because that doesn't make good copy.

People are just people. I don't like these attempts to take anecdotes and turn them into anecdata.

I agree the notion of stealing a husband is nonsense. In my experience, even when the hosting is going well it is hard having someone else under your feet all the time. Some hosts have tolerated truly terrible behaviour and attitudes and I have been lucky but I would not consider doing it again.

I think the best way of imagining it is asking the question: if Putin invaded England would the British become suddenly moralistic and perfect? Would the EDL disband? Benefit fraud end? Systemic Racism be resolved? Marriages would never fall apart?
I’m guessing no, Putin invading wouldn’t make us all so grateful to be saved by someone that we’d collectively resolve to live perfect lives. It’s the same everywhere

I've been hosting for nearly a year and it's going well with just a few minor niggles that inevitably come from sharing our living spaces with another family I agree MumEeeee that's a good way to look at it. I try to imagine what would have happened when I was a child if my mum and sister and I had to flee to live in a stranger's home. We would have been one of the "horror stories" posted on a Facebook group as mum was an alcoholic, my sister and I fought all the time, and we were all very messy. Having our country invaded wouldn't have fixed that!

Ive been hosting for a year. Lots of things have made me feel rather taken advantage of at times. The fact that there have been multiple lengthy trips back to Ukraine on holiday, the fact that the family have three properties in Ukraine (in reasonably unaffected areas) and a business and yet still get full universal credit and child benefit, the fact that the DH lives and works in Italy whilst his wife and three DC are here..

With gentleness I say, you are under no obligation to continue the arrangement, if you want to end this and find a guest that you find to be more worthy of your generosity then that is what you should do. If you feel that the benefits system is being abused, there are places you can report that too if that is what you feel needs to happen. I couldn't bring myself to report them but I would certainly feel that they could stand on their own two feet without my financial support of giving them a rent free home. I'm absolutely certain there are guests out there that would fit your idea of deserving. I think all hosts are just feeling fatigued at sharing their homes for 12 months with no end in sight for the war.

@user4750 I cut short my 12months to 9 months because I felt exactly the same as you. My Ukrainian guests even arrived to the UK with $15,000 cash (and I dumb dumb looked after it) without declaring it officially. As well with multiple properties back in Ukraine. Do I think they are cheating the benefit system? Yes. Do I think they are less entitled? That's a difficult one. At the end of the day, we Brits are so generous in that we DO give out Benefits too easily and not enough checks in place to sort the genuine needy vs those WITH funds.

However the reason why I cut short wasn't because of the money and benefits. Let them have it is what I say. The reason why I cut short was they made NO EFFORT in looking for a place to live. Even down to the last 7 days of my deadline they hadn't properly looked. I warned them repeatedly in Russian, Ukrainian and English in both written verbal and with UK friends who speak their languages. I did EVERYTHING I could to make them independent and in the end, I left them and their things on the doorstep of some illegal sublet bedsit place that the sitting tenant in her 70s took to the sofa out of kindness and perhaps desperation for money. I did THREE car loads to help them move out including 15 pairs of their shoes and you know what, good luck to them.

Oh and guess what, since moving out, they found a naice 2 bed rental within record time. They didn't last long at the sublet place did they?

So what I'm saying is, don't feel guilty. You do what you have to do. You did more than you needed to and it's ok to say goodbye to them.

No hard feelings me, although I did leave them a stinging voicemail about the state of my bedroom and ensuite they left the state in (they did since send flowers) but its a shame we ended the way we did. I think its a mix of head in sand, and not wanting to commit to living in the UK which was going through their minds.

Also the war isn't going to end for YEARS and YEARS. Not until Putin is usurped as leader, or is murdered. He has it in for Ukraine and he has said so.

"@Redissuereader completely agree to no end in. The war started in 2014 (I'm no historian but our Ukrainian Step Grandfather said its being going off and on for years before that with Russia). So how is 2023 or 2024 going to be any different. Honestly, the best thing Ukrainians can do it is banker down for the long term if they want to remain in the UK which means moving out, getting jobs etc. And yes, not every Ukrainian is like mine or @user4750 so I'm not completely cold hearted because there are many who homes have been flattened AND lost their breadwinner.

I had some drama. See this thread (I changed my username since). But things are looking up now. Ukrainian | Mumsnet Spring seems to have brought some joy. I don't know how long they are going to stay now, as the husband just arrived.

So grateful to have found this thread. I am a slowly going stir crazy. We are coming up to 6 months of hosting a family (mum, dad 2 daughters), whilst it has been very rewarding we are now starting to feel very put upon and taken for granted. The latest upset is one of the daughters had a friend over to play. Both parents just went out and left me to look after all their children my children and this random kid!!! I wasn't even asked if she could have a friend over. This has happened 2 Sundays in a row and I am pulling my hair out. I have so many boundaries to establish with them I don't know where to begin. I also find a lot gets lost in translation. Does anyone else struggle with this expectation of free child care and taxing around at all hours of the day? Help we are struggling with no end in sight.

@RedToothBrush has been very helpful on these threads.

The short answer is yes. Continuous reminders of the boundaries seemed to be necessary in the early weeks and months and being very direct about it made for a better experience with our guests. They have all left now and I am both glad I did it but also a bit disappointed in how I handled the challenges. It's been so long I'm sure you must have discussed expectations of each other?

My guests (mum and 12 y o son) returned to Ukraine in Jan. The child care issue was a continuing problem for me, particularly when the mum found a job which required very long days. Telling her I wasn’t prepared to provide child care (I work from home) didn’t work - I was told firmly “he is not a child; he can look after himself”. He was not able to get a place in a local school for the first 2/3 months so he was at home with me all day and some evenings. He was a sensible boy but nevertheless only 12, and I felt obliged to seek out activities and provide taxi service - he was only getting about 2 hrs a day in online classes from his school in Ukraine. But at least his mum was working. Talking to other hosts and to local authority welfare officer, it seems Ukrainians allow their kids a lot more responsibility/freedom at a younger age than is usual in the UK. But in your situation, there are 2 parents available and it seems to me that they are taking advantage of your generosity! I’ve heard of similar stories from others, including one where both parents went off to London for weekend, leaving their teenage kids with the host family without asking and treated their hosts appallingly in other ways. But
your guests are in a better situation than most (as both parents are here) and coukd find their own accommodation. I think you need to be really firm on the child care issue ie they must not leave their kids home alone without checking with you first. And if they don’t agree, as they are coming up to 6 months here, perfectly reasonable to give them notice to leave. I think you’ve been very generous and the parents’ behaviour is NOT fair on you. On the boundaries/clarity point, worth knowing that some Ukrainians think English people are ‘hypocritical’ because we don’t say what we mean - when we regard this as politeness! Eg We would say “could you please ask before you leave kids with me” as opposed to “you must not go out and leave the kids with me unless I have agreed”! Hope things work out for you - I feel your pain!