To ask my colleague to withdraw christmas holiday request.

[Jessiejuju]

OK I feel terrible about this but me and my colleague who I get on with quite well normally have both requested Xmas day off but our manager has said that only one of us can have it off and that we need to sort ot out.I have asked her to withdraw her request as her and her husband they have no kids normally go to her husbands parents on Xmas day but they also go everyweek so it's not like they never see them where as I on the other hand have a 4 year old Autistic son he normaly goes to nursery but his nursery closes 1 week before christmas and doesn't open until next year the shift in question is a 3 hour shift between 7 and 10 in the morning so she and her husband could still be at his parents for lunch time where as because I am a single mama and the nurseries are closed I have no one to watch my son yes I could pay someone but it would be extremely expensive and he would most likely be very distressed with having someone he is unfamiliar with in his home plus it would be difficult for said person as my son is non verbal.
I do feel bad asking her to do this but if she won't then I am going to have no choice but to leave my job.

@Goldenbear there is a big difference between parents getting ‘some flexibility’ and parents ‘getting some / a lot of flexibility at the expense of non-parents’. You say the former, knowing it’s reasonable, but all your posts are about the latter.

I’ve worked with colleagues who have had access to working arrangements I haven’t because of needing to care for someone. Good. As it should be. I have also been flexible on occasions that are one-offs. Surgeries, accidents, etc. But permanently relegated to the bottom of the pile for basic things like access to holidays? No. Not fair, and goes beyond what I think can reasonably be expected of me. It’s a really shit employer who just dumps the consequences of some staff needing flexibility or adjustments on the less ‘deserving’ employees.

OP isn't being unreasonable, but the amount of people calling a childless woman a bitch for not being happy to participate in co-parenting some random person's child (whilst the actual parent of that child gets to sod off, apparently) is just ridiculous to me

This

Lol, but my post is still readable.

Agree, and how much pisstaking will there be if some people work out that they can take all their leave and still be guaranteed additional time off outside this by just saying "oh childcare". And again yep I'm saying that as a parent!

This is all the fault of the manager who has ignored this potential issue for over 6
months. And now it's causing ill feeling and OP will worry over the break about a disciplinary.

Fact is OP isn't more entitled than her colleague but has more need now because the useless manager didn't make a decision earlier when OP could have asked her mum to look after the child. It's too late now for her mum to change her own shifts or for OP to arrange anything other than extortionate emergency childcare - if she can even find anyone!

Doubt this would happen unless people had no choice as they wouldn't be paid. No exactly the easy option in a COL crisis.

HerMajestysRoyalCoven, good at circumventing my point about GDP there. If you have an aging population ratio where the number of workers per pension population drops, the GDP is impacted as the government is going too reduce its expenditure on productivity enhancing investments and debt stocks become unsustainable with weaker GDP.

Do you have any carers that live away from home and will not be going home? This used to be common pre Brexit and if so they might want company in the day and could do your shift.

From working in retail (granted not the same as op), every year it was the same parents who couldn't work Christmas eve, boxing day and new years eve/day. The bleating of "I have no childcare" yet they would be spending the day with their family and in one colleagues instance that was her childcare.

Your situation is different OP but from a manager perspective I'm sure they've dealt with the same Christmas CFs and that's why they have said to sort it between yourselves.

A colleague of mine frequently asked me to cover for her so she could pick up her kids or go to sports days or do this or that for her kids, which I usually did, the final straw for me was when she was scheduled to work xmas day and asked me if I wouldn't mind covering as she had kids and I didn't, I had been trying to have a baby for 3 years, had 1 failed IVF round and I just thought sod this.. NO I am going to enjoy my Christmas in peace with a lie in and loads of alcohol!

I agree

The lack of basic compassion on this thread astounds me.

Sadly it doesn't astound me any more. OP, if I were your colleague I would work on Christmas Day, it's only for a short time and you are in an unfortunate situation. I don't have children but enjoy Christmas as much as anyone else, however I would give up a few hours of my day to help someone - it's called Christmas spirit, but sadly many on MN have lost sight of what Christmas actually means. If indeed they ever knew.

Is there a rule that Christmas is only for children? You do know that Christmas is actually a religious holiday? Maybe this colleague is a Christian? Maybe this colleague has a family member with a terminal illness and this will be their last Christmas? Maybe this colleague just wants a day off that they are entitled to?

Are you not protected by carers rights? Would your situation not come under the equality act 2010, whereby they have to make reasonable adjustments for your situation. I would go to CAB , especially if you have been employed over 4 years you might have more protection than you think. Where do you live?

This is all the fault of the manager who has ignored this potential issue for over 6 months. And now it's causing ill feeling and OP will worry over the break about a disciplinary.

THIS ⬆

Now no matter who gets the time off the working relationship between these two women is tarnished.

Lazy management style.

OP, if I were your colleague I would work on Christmas Day, it's only for a short time and you are in an unfortunate situation

If the colleague plans to have Christmas nearby that might work if they were willing, but they might have plans to visit an elderly relative on the other side of the country. Not everyone has friends and family close by.

workingfamilies.org.uk/articles/time-off-work/
this article has some info:

@Jessiejuju I love how all these people who haven't read your updates are giving you a hard time. I also appreciate you are not actually saying your holidays are more important than the childless co-worker's but at this late stage and given your child's SNs it's very hard for you to sort, with little available help etc.

You could ask them to check the timestamp on the original emails or in the holiday system. There will be one. That won't help you if her request got in first. What you could also say is - I did last year, it doesn't seem fair for me to do this year but I will do next year. Also say, you cannot get cover and if you could it would cost £100 which you cannot afford. Maybe email your boss, cc the co worker, the reason you asked for the whole 2 weeks is your Mum can't cover and what would be involved (the 0630 start and so on).

Finally, it's pretty cr*p that they waited until November because they have caused this issue with the other worker - when you asked they should have let you know whose request got in first so you'd know it wasn't definite. I can see why neither of you wants to back down.

The colleague has one day off over the entire period, so perhaps her well of Christmas kindness is running dry.

All these people saying 'Who asked first?' is ridiculous because then there is nothing to stop you asking for Christmas day off every year and because you got it there first by 1 second then tough luck to everyone else. Do it fairly and let everyone have the chance to have it off at some point.

I would explain to your colleague the difficulty you have arranging childcare for those 3 hours. There is no childcare open so it would need to be a family member or a very expensive nanny.

Yes it would . The carer is fine. She essentially can tell them she can't do it and be covered by disability discrimination.

The other carer, who would have no days off for two weeks around Christmas if she covers is screwed.

Or poor person needing care won't get care. Which actually is the most likely outcome.

For a situation which the OP definitely knew was going to happen since April and that the employer would have realised was going to happen since November.

"You have kids so you win Christmas. I can’t believe anyone upthread really would be selfish enough to think anything otherwise. If you don’t have kids, you don’t get priority on Xmas annual leave in my book"

God, you sound just like my ex colleague. Her mother pretty much raised her daughter but when it came round to Christmas she'd pretend to be Mother Earth and even cried at having to work a 5 hour shift in the afternoon. Argued that I should work it as I had no kids. I also had no family locally, nor a partner so would've spent all of Christmas Day alone despite having worked the previous 2 years. I told her to fuck right off.

@Rockingcloggs

"How do you know it won't affect the colleague? You have have no idea what her colleague is dealing with behind closed doors. None at all and if the colleague isn't disclosing personal information at work then neither does OP."

It's a 3 hour shift, 7-10am. The colleague has a husband and we know from the OP that they plan to go to family 30 mins away for lunch. So it's unlikely to affect her plans for the day, is what I said.

Naturally, if the colleague, for example, had a relative with a terminal illness and this would be their last Christmas, that might be relevant information the colleague might choose to share in these discussions by way of explanation of why she is unwilling to change shift.

42% of people with infertility consider suicide

Or is it only the outcomes of parents and children that matter and not other members of society?

Personally I find christmas very hard on my mental health as do a lot of people with infertility. People telling us how we matter less because we haven't contributed sufficiently to society apparently need to do some reading up on the stats on that

You seem unwilling to acknowledge that non-parents may have caring responsibilities too, e.g. care of elderly parents, that also require flexibility.