Tiger parenting

[McCoysCheese]

I see a kid each week for tutoring. Chinese family, kid is Y8.

He's told me his parents love him and only hit him if he has been very bad. I've asked him to talk to his school counsellor but he said no, he's ok. I told him it's not allowed in this country for parents to hit kids. And that he can call Childline or NSPCC. But he doesn't want his parents to get in trouble.

If I report then I will never see him again and the situation doesn't change. Any advice?

Suggesting that an adult to whom a child has disclosed abuse has a duty to report this is a situation where there really is a "one size fits all" situation. There is not situation where a decent human should ignore (and thus become complicit in) abuse of a child.

Perhaps what this child has told you may be legal. Maybe it isn't. But that isn't for you to judge. You still need to report it.

I cannot say how disgraceful and cowardly it would be to not do the right thing here. The law is clear. Safeguarding advice is clear. What it is that is making you struggle to do the right thing?

Could you speak to his parents? That would be my first step. I would ask to talk to them in private and explain that something had been disclosed and you would like to hear their side of story. You can then go on to say that it's not permitted in the UK and you appreciate that their culture is different but if it is disclosed at school, social services will be informed and consequences could be quite harsh. Also a slap on the wrist is very different from regular beatings. Perhaps you could speak to the boy beforehand to gauge the level of physical punishment they are using. If it's regular beatings then it has to be reported to SS. If it's an occasional slap on the wrist etc then I would speak to them and tell them it needs to stop or they will be reported.

Technically it is allowed @Blueberry111 if it is smacking

The legal threshold for a slap in England is it cannot leave a mark. Do you have any more info on what exactly the boy meant by being hit?

From the fact that he's mentioned it to a tutor, I expect it to be more than an occasional light smack, and I think from your comments OP you do realise that too. I am professionally involved in safeguarding and have level 3 training. The law says you have to report.

To all those quoting cultural circumstances, you should read the Laming report on Victoria Climbie's death.

It says 'Every organisation concerned with the welfare and
protection of children should have mechanisms in place to ensure equal access to services of the same quality, and that each child, irrespective of colour or background, should be treated as an individual requiring appropriate care (p3 46). '

Here's a quote from a paper than references it:

"The
Laming Report, which suggested that some
professionals’ practice might have been affected
because of their fear of being accused of racism. As
the Counsel to Inquiry noted:

Race can affect the way people conduct themselves…
Fear of being accused of racism can stop people acting
when otherwise they would. Fear of being thought
unsympathetic to someone of the same race can change
response (p346).
This point relates to the one about training. Perhaps
one reason why professionals are fearful is that they feel
inadequately trained or prepared to work with families
from all ethnic backgrounds. So, instead, they either
try to avoid the issue by pretending ethnicity does not
matter when working with people from diverse
backgrounds, or draw upon their own limited
knowledge and experiences of ethnic minority families,
which may include many stereotypes and prejudices; or
perhaps they acknowledge their own limitations and
do the best they can in the circumstances, aware that
some ethnic minority families may not be in receipt of
the services or practices they deserve; or even try to pass
the responsibility to another worker or professional
from the same ethnic background as the family. These
strategies are not mutually exclusive, but they all have
their problems and/or limitations. "
From here
sci-hub.yncjkj.com/

Chand, Ashok (2003). ‘Race’ and the Laming Report on Victoria Climbie: Lessons for Inter‐Professional Policy and Practice. Journal of Integrated Care, 11(4), 28–37. doi:10.1108/14769018200300040

I would say report it to social services directly, rather than through the school, as you are a professional who isn't employed by the school. Childline would be fine if you feel more comfortable doing that.

You can call Childline to report if their online form isn't working.

Unless we challenge child abuse every time as a country it will remain endemic.

Often with the Asian cultures corporal punishment isn't considered bad and seen more like disciplining the child, so they need to be make aware this is not acceptable nor the correct way to discipline a child

This is a very arrogant assumption, and based on western values. That kind of attitude prevailed years ago when British people ruled much of the world and tried to impose their own values on other cultures. It didn't end well for native Indians or indigenous Australians.

Maybe look at today's society where many children are out of control even at primary age, before deciding that Asian culture is worse.

He didn't tell you just to make small talk now, did he? If he thought it was normal, it probably wouldn't have crossed his mind to mention it. He knows it's wrong.

Come on, op. Sod ethnicity. A child is being regularly beaten and has indirectly tried to ask you for help. Please help him. Imagine if he's said this to 10 different people and he's been ignored by all of them because it's 'ok because he's Chinese'. You know it isn't.

Worst case scenario, adults can kill children.

In England parents are allowed to smack their children and many do as part of ‘discipline’.

The fact that he’s told you about the smacking means that this isn’t your average smack on the bum for being naughty - as that would be normal to him and he wouldn’t feel the need to mention it.

Kids who are brought up with small snacks don’t go and tell people about it as it is the norm for them and they believe everyone does it - the fact that he’s reached out and told you means he’s actually screaming for help and someone to listen and take him seriously.

I would not think twice about reporting it, even if just to the school so they can report it and I wouldn’t care if that meant not seeing him or losing my weekly pay cheque because of it.

This is terrible advice.

Let's just say this kid is being severely abused. Speaking directly to the abuser is not going to help, it will increase the risk to him. And then there will also be no record to build up a picture. There may be information from other sources (maybe teachers have seen injuries, it a GP has been worried about family interactions). Everything need to be reported to a central point for a picture to be built up.

And if he is only being "mildly abused?" Well, I don't think reporting it makes things worse.

So report!

It's so easy for affluent overseas parents to remove a child from the country. DS friend never returned to school after the first allegation. As I said before, she turned up years later as an adult on social media, having been shipped back to India to live with distant family. The disgrace she brought on the family was not something they were ever going to overlook.

Just to clarify OP, you reporting it doesn't automatically mean that the child is going to end up in the system.

I taught a boy who's parents were VERY hard on him. It was well known among the staff in school that he used to get hit if he didn't meet his parents' expectations.

SS and the school were working with his parents to combat their ridiculously high expectations. He was never removed from home.

Also, as staff we weren't allowed to call the parents directly if we had any issues with student. If we wanted to inform home of any misbehaviour, we had to tell the DSL to make the call on our behalf. This was in case we made the situation worse without realising.

I think you'll make things worse by speaking to the parents directly. Ask to speak to the DSL at the school and they will take it from there. They will work in the child's best interests and do so tactfully (I hope).

This.
You seem to need the approval from anonymous members of the public to keep this information to yourself - like you know better than the NSPCC or the established safeguarding recommendations.

Yes I’ve read that book but she didn’t mentioning hitting her children in that. I come from an immigrant background so can relate a lot to it but hitting and any other abuse is a safeguarding concern so no, ethnicity isn’t important.

Exactly.

You can uphold cultural values of discipline and importance of education without resorting to beating and emotional abuse. Doesn’t matter if it’s a cultural norm, it’s illegal in the U.K. end of and any ‘professional’ overlooking or trying to put this in some context is a cause for concern in themselves.

I dont get it.

Smacking is still legal in England?
So what can Social Services do?

OP are you a qualified teacher or unqualified tutor. I ask because as a teacher you would have annual safeguarding training to know what to do in this situation but a random tutor you may not have access to such training. Get yourself onto a course if you’re working with kids is my advice.

A large number of tutors are just graduates, or even A level students who have paid for DBS check and signed up with an agency or tutor company.

I know a few who drifted into it for a bit of cash on top of their jobs, while many are teachers, many are not and do not know anything about safegaurding.

So you can't assume OP is a teacher
You're right we can't assume that the OP is a teacher, but threads like this illustrate perfectly why private tutoring should be a regulated area like schools, childminders, childcare etc.

It's horrifying to think there are people like the OP working with children who don't give a damn about safeguarding, seem to have quite a high opinion of themselves, and have a low opinion of more experienced professionals with appropriate safeguarding training, despite their highly problematic lack of understanding of safeguarding.

What is there to get, if a child reports his parents hitting it’s a safeguarding concern, abuse is illegal but it depends on if it’s one off smack or systemic -only safeguarding and child protection professionals can make that judgement not Op or randoms on mumsnet

Exactly
without more information it could easily escalate into something far more serious
Eg. It’s a one off, legally allowed smack (however reprehensible and frowned up by mumsnetters) but parents see “social services” and send child back to China to avoid the “shame”, resulting in him losing a loving home, and being more vulnerable.

I'm not sure the point of this post. Are you saying it is bad to attempt to prevent children from being abused in case something worse happens to them? Or in case it damages their relationship with their abuser?

Either way, I don't agree.

Think about all the scandals were adults knew a child was being abused and did nothing. Victoria Climbie etc. Don't be that sort of person.

I lived in Hong Kong for years and some of the things I saw and heard were very shocking. My domestic helper told me that in a previous employment, the grandmother would put hot needles under the grandson’s nails if he wasn’t performing well enough at school. Just putting that here for context.

As you are in England and smacking is legal as a ‘reasonable’ punishment I am not sure that what he has disclosed to you is illegal. It would seem wrong to most people In England nowadays but may still be legal. If it is legal does the OP still have to disclose or can OP use their judgement on how to deal with the situation?

I doubt this is right, but if it is then it is perfectly safe to report the conversation to social services, and they can choose to take no further action.

The op isn't the person to decide that, though. They don't know what other information might have been reported previously.

When a child makes a disclosure, one of the main things to tell them is that you will have to tell the appropriate person in school. That helps to make sure they don’t think you have betrayed their trust.

I would say something maybe to social services i think his ethnicity is relevant. It is normal amongst Chinese parents. My dd is in a school with lots of Chinese dc. They have the same treatment. One also came from a school in China that caned her when she got answers wrong. My dd is 9!!