AIBU to make a complaint to head

[bothsidesofasmile]

Hi all,

I'm looking for some opinions on if I'm being unreasonable with my child's primary school. DS6 after being picked up from afterschool club was visibly upset. After asking what was wrong he told us that a member of staff at the after school club had shouted at him because he accidentally broke a new toy. He said he was putting it away as it was tidy up time and one piece didn't fit in the box, he thought said piece could come apart and I'm trying to pull it apart it broke. Another child told this member of staff who approached DS and he says told him off and told him not to do it again. His twin brother also confirms this story.

Now I should mention DS is on the SEN register and is on the autism diagnosis pathway for social and emotional issues. He can be a sensitive child and this is known by all staff members. I emailed DS class teacher and the sendco at the school as I thought this was a bit much for what had happened and was surprised a member of staff had approached DS in this way knowing of his additional needs. I sent the email feeling as if perhaps half of the story was missing as is often the case with children of DS age.

To my surprise the sendco at the school emailed me to confirm DS story. Although apparently there was no shouting but he was spoken to firmly. The sendco says the children had been warned that this was a new toy and they were to be careful with it. The Higher level ta confirms that she said it was a shame that it had got broken as no one could play with it now and that DS was upset but she make a big thing of it and encouraged him to move on to the next activity. The sendco says the ta acted appropriately for the situation.

Now this has thrown me a little AIBU to expect a child not to be shamed after an accident and to not need to be spoken to firmly after an accident? Or am I being too sensitive?

I will be replacing the toy.

I can't believe you emailed the school about it. He broke the toy intentionally or not - that had a consequence - being spoken to firmly. Asd or not, intentional or not I would expect my child to be spoke to firmly for breaking a broad new toy that they had been warned to be careful with.

I initially emailed the school about it as we are in constant contact about any emotional issues, I haven't complained although I was thinking about it.

I know not everyone's going to understand and that's ok but advocating for my son and the understanding that he needs is all I care about. My son didn't need to be told off or told to apologise, he was very apologetic and still is. I think the ta could of had a conversation with him about asking for help when needed as if he had this wouldn't of happened. But again it's about that understanding of how his mind works. In his mind he was doing the right thing. The toy broke which he's very sorry for and we have had a conversation about him remembering to ask for help and that we will replace the item but the fact is his sen are relevant here as his mind does think differently to the typical.

But I would say that recognising an outcome is not the same as scolding a child for the action which is what happened here? And in recognising an outcome, I'd also say it's important to not lay any element of guilt or blame because otherwise, all that's going to happen is that the child will be too scared to do anything at all to help, exactly as @BoardLikeAMirror describes. I think on this occasion it would have been important to recognise that it was a mistake, that we all make mistakes, but next time if there's another new toy, it would have been better to either ask or put it to one side if it didn't fit.

Lots of autistic children spent their life feeling not good enough and are constantly "getting things wrong" just on a day-to-day basis. Processing delays means that there's a lot of self-doubt with many autistic children, and it doesn't take much to knock their confidence further. And as per previous, the autistic brain tends to find it very difficult to move past things.

I would suggest that in this instance the school were at fault because there's a child who has recognised SEN, a SALT professional has identified the child struggles to ask for help, and there's a new toy. Clearly the OP's DS required more supervision - he's also only 6 yrs old and combined with the above factors, it's a recipe for disaster.

My god I feel sorry for the teachers.

Believe it or not I do try very hard not to be difficult but it is a minefield when trying to navigate an autistic child! I've never niece been rude or impolite but as we get more understanding of Autism it means things do have to change and that transition can be difficult. I'm just trying to navigate what's best for my little boy and I'm sure all parents can understand that. He doesn't not have any consequences because he feels awful about it but I still believe it should have been approached slightly differently

He doesn't not have any consequences because he feels awful about it

This is what many people on this thread aren't understanding. Your DS will be punishing himself for this mistake, much more harshly than anyone else would or could punish him, because he thought he was doing the right thing by putting the toy away - but, no, it was 'wrong' for reasons he could not have foreseen - and it will be the latest in a long line of disconnections between the OP's DS and the world in general, getting it 'wrong' again when his intentions were to do the right thing - and if he is not treated with understanding and sympathy, things like this will eat away at him.

I wouldn't go to the head @bothsidesofasmile but I actually would go back to the SENCO again about this.

Specifically:

How is your DS supposed to learn from being told off when he WAS being careful? What outcome does the SENCO expect when your DS thought he was doing the right thing, and was taking care to try and take the toy apart rather than just jam it in the box? How do the actions that were taken by the TA in scolding your DS take into account his processing difficulties and SEN? What actions will they be putting in place to ensure this isn't a situation that will recur? The language used to explain to your DS how to handle the toy wasn't specific enough, and perhaps he needed someone to model the toy to him first and how it did/didn't come apart - will these strategies be used in the future? Saying "be careful" to your DS isn't explicit or specific enough because he WAS being careful.

I would tell her in writing that you recognise the impact on the other children so you will be replacing the item immediately, but that you remain concerned about how this was dealt with, the impact on your DS and their strategies for supporting your DS in the future.

Does your DS have an EHCP?

By the way, I was the SEN School Governor for our school for five years plus. This is what I would be asking the SENCO to explain if I saw that incident during a governor visit. There is an SEN Code of Practice and teachers/TAs etc have to take your child's difficulties into account. This isn't a positive outcome for anyone right now.

^All of this a million times over.

PP need to read this post from @BoardLikeAMirror because this is what needs to be understood.

@ExhaustedFlamingo thank you so much for this! It's so hard to know what to do or say sometimes especially as this is obviously all knew to me, there's no handbook. I was only going to go to the head if the reply from the sendco was as passive as her initial response, you've definitely given some great things to highlight in my response. It's hard to get it all down in words sometimes and I find it hard to articulate myself in a way to make others understand at times. Although I have to say I didn't think I would have to explain to the school sendco and I am really conscious of coming across as 'that' parent! I don't want to break any relationship with the school because I think this is important in supporting DS

@ExhaustedFlamingo he doesn't have echp. In fact I've only recently learnt what this is, I'm not 100% sure now if I'm honest. DS got accepted for an autism assessment in April and we are waiting on an appointment date.

@bothsidesofasmile - it's such a steep learning curve, I can remember feeling completely overwhelmed so many times!! I have twins as well - both autistic, one in special school, one in mainstream.

Ref dealing with the school, always try and take the emotion out of things. Figure out what you want to achieve from any communication and focus on that rather than getting caught up in your emotions. I'm actually a very emotional person (I have ADHD as well as being autistic) so I learnt the hard way not to just wade in without thinking 😅 I promise you, the school will have seen many, many, many more difficult and demanding parents - some of the things I saw during my governor days were just unbelievable!!

You are your child's advocate and the fact you're thinking about this from his perspective just shows that you're going to be an amazing support for him as he matures and grows.

Just like anything else, there are good, bad and so-so SENCOs. We moved from one primary school to another in Y1 because the first one was so bloody awful. The SENCO there was awful too - I won't bore you with the whole story but just objectively failing in her duties. New school, different SENCO who really "got it" and there was a world of difference. We had disagreements from time to time over the years but they were respectful and we always managed to thrash things out. Your child needs you to ask the hard questions when the school drops the ball - lots of us SEN parents are "that" parent. If you can connect with fellow SEN parents you'll get invaluable support and help. You're not in the southwest are you by any chance?

Ref the EHCP - not all autistic children need one, but it's not always obvious at the start of school whether one is needed or not. Is he on a My Plan? Do you have goals and outcomes defined for him that you review with the SENCO? If SALT have been involved, I assume that his needs aren't insignificant. You need to move through the system and spend X number of weeks at each stage before escalating to a EHCP (usually). It would therefore be beneficial to make sure you're already on this pathway. It might be a question that's worth asking the SENCO. Do you know whether he struggles in school in other ways, or whether additional provisions are already being made for him?

His thought didn’t break it though did it. He exerted too much pressure trying to pull it apart
he was obviously mistaken but he still was rough with it

You are giving invaluable advice! And it is so nice to speak to someone who gets it. We have thought about moving schools in all honesty mainly due to the senco and the way she is. From reception DS was referred to salt because he wasn't following directions, the initial evaluation was done outside of school and then one was done inside of school. Salt reported he had some delays in receptive language and slow processing speed. Salt also reported some social and emotional issues, along with observing possible issues with short term memory and asking for help. He was then referred for an autism assessment. It was only then after two years of DS being at the school that the senco spoke with me and said they thought it was autism all along but couldn't say. No one had told us that this was what they thought was going on and with both DS being our first we had no idea either. Luckily the salt who came to the school was fantastic and spent hours on the phone explaining things to me and didn't make me feel like a burden at all. When DS entered year 2 I received a letter from the school to confirm DS had been added to the sen register and with his goals for the year. They were a bit confusing as one was for him to use the chunk- chill- method to remember more information which I was confused about because the salt had explained this is something for the people in contact with DS to do to reduce the load on his memory . While emailing her I had mentioned some things that had been put in place by his new y2 teacher because no one had spoke to us about these and I wanted to know what he was struggling with on a day to day l. One of them was a morning routine tick list, a toliet card to ask to go to the toliet as he was just taking himself and his own pen pot with everything in as he was getting confused l, frustrated and distracted looking for everything. While the senco explained this I asked if we could have bi- weekly or even monthly updates on what DS is struggling with in the school day because up to this point we still weren't completely sure. The senco refused to do this but said when the autism assessment people send a questionnaire to her to fill out she could send me a copy or alternatively I could ask his class teacher. I did the latter and I have a much clearer picture now on what he's been struggling with. He does have some intervention in school with some one to one work with his ta on social and emotional things which was tasked by the salt but past that it doesn't seem much has been taken up from the salt report.

I agree it would be very helpful to be in contact with like minded people unfortunately I don't know if anyone in the area and I'm in the West Midlands unfortunately 😞

Are you seriously saying that if your child broke a brand new toy at home you would just smile sweetly and say "oh well these things happen"? As if.

No that's not what I'm saying

So how would you have dealt with it?

I have a child with autism who is prone to massive overreaction sometimes when told off.............but we and his school still have to enforce rules and boundaries.
It can be a difficult balance but I think you are being unreasonable in wanting to complain to the head.

I wouldn’t like it I feel sorry for your little boy .

It's irrelevant really because it's not the same environment and also I am far more in tune with DS individual needs and would use different language without thinking and therefore this probably wouldn't have happened. However if the exact same thing happened at home I would explain that he should have come and got me to ask for help to put in to the box.

I probably shouldn't have put that. I did put further up that this was only if I could not sort this with the senco. I haven't actually complained to the head and I don't intend to

I think YABU and should move on. You need to teach your child to cope with getting told off. Your oversensitivity and overreaction on this is only going to rub off on him more.

Well, yes I would. And I have done, many times.

Why would you scold a child when something has happened that is purely an accident?! Surely you only tell a child off if they've done something deliberately or have been reckless? What's the purpose in telling a child off when it's an accident?!

It makes no sense to me. But then I'm also autistic so tend to approach things differently. It's not logical to tell someone off for an accident. Believe me, the child will be distraught enough that they've broken their toy.

And that's the same approach I take whether it's spilling a drink, breaking a toy or something else.

Being frustrated because your child had an accident is about your emotions, and doesn't help resolve things, nor prevent it happening again.

What does help is to try and think of a way that the accident could have been prevented. Does your child need closer supervision? Do they need verbal reminders? Were the words used explicit and specific enough? Were they in sensory overload for the day already, and therefore more heavy-handed than usual? Should the toy etc have been modelled in advance so your child knew how to use it? I could go on. SEN parenting can be bloody knackering sometimes because it's all about anticipation, and breaking things down into the right level of detail. And often when things go wrong, it might be because the child hasn't receive enough support/explanation etc.

My parenting is not the reason he processes things like this. In this situation things could have been dealt with differently while talking with him and making sense of what happened.

Are you autistic yourself?