AIBU to make a complaint to head

[bothsidesofasmile]

Hi all,

I'm looking for some opinions on if I'm being unreasonable with my child's primary school. DS6 after being picked up from afterschool club was visibly upset. After asking what was wrong he told us that a member of staff at the after school club had shouted at him because he accidentally broke a new toy. He said he was putting it away as it was tidy up time and one piece didn't fit in the box, he thought said piece could come apart and I'm trying to pull it apart it broke. Another child told this member of staff who approached DS and he says told him off and told him not to do it again. His twin brother also confirms this story.

Now I should mention DS is on the SEN register and is on the autism diagnosis pathway for social and emotional issues. He can be a sensitive child and this is known by all staff members. I emailed DS class teacher and the sendco at the school as I thought this was a bit much for what had happened and was surprised a member of staff had approached DS in this way knowing of his additional needs. I sent the email feeling as if perhaps half of the story was missing as is often the case with children of DS age.

To my surprise the sendco at the school emailed me to confirm DS story. Although apparently there was no shouting but he was spoken to firmly. The sendco says the children had been warned that this was a new toy and they were to be careful with it. The Higher level ta confirms that she said it was a shame that it had got broken as no one could play with it now and that DS was upset but she make a big thing of it and encouraged him to move on to the next activity. The sendco says the ta acted appropriately for the situation.

Now this has thrown me a little AIBU to expect a child not to be shamed after an accident and to not need to be spoken to firmly after an accident? Or am I being too sensitive?

@bothsidesofasmile sorry OP I think you are being unreasonable. There are consequences to actions and you aren’t doing your DS any favours by believing a firm talking to is wrong. My friends DD has autism and no one is allowed to speak to her firmly and she rules her household, even her little brother now states she should have what she wants otherwise she will be upset, angry, disappointed. He needs to understand that there are consequences and as long as they are appropriate you should back the school.

Also, I have a totally over sensitive child (we’re working on it!) who probably would have ended up crying no matter how gently they delivered the telling, so don’t assume because he cried it must automatically have been in too harsh a manner.

You aren’t going to be able to control every interaction people have with your child especially when actions have consequences. Maybe your son will learn a valuable lesson and be more careful or learn to accept that even if it’s an accidental breakage he has to bear some responsibility. Don’t try to excuse, intervene and delete all consequences due to SEN. It’s not the carte balance or get out of jail free card you think it is. I have a SEN child who has a full diagnosis and ECHP but still needs to behave and is held to very similar standards As NT kids. It’s honestly not the free pass you think

Most kids would find being told off at school to be a bigger deal than being told off at home.

Being told off at school is embarrassing - kids generally want other adults to think that they are good and there's other kids witnessing this telling off. It takes a lot less for school staff to upset a child at school because it happens infrequently too.

The other witnesses say that it was a firm and fair tone. You say that your son is more sensitive than usual. So I am not surprised that he'd find the situation more upsetting. I don't think that you should complain - is it the school or an outside company that runs after school club?

It was an accident but if children are more careful then the accident would y have happened. It sounds as thought this is what the staff were telling him. I work with Sen children. We do sometimes talk very firmly when we feel necessary same as mainstream schools. Just because they have Sen most understand what you are saying completely and can be taught what is acceptable and what is not. Replace the toy and move on.

what's wrong with 'firmly?' If it was 'aggressively' or 'angrily' you might have a point but a teacher telling a pupil off 'firmly' is entirely appropriate. Nobody else suggests there was shouting or that he was shamed.
Sounds like you never tell your dc off at all, so perhaps he overreacted to what was a perfectly proportionate telling off.

I'm autistic and a similar thing happened to me when I was your son's age. In my case it was one of those small 1970s children's books where the pages were glued in - a Dr Suess book, it was. It was brand new - all I did was open it, the spine cracked and two pages fell out! I reported this mishap to the teacher and got a telling off, which made me cry, so I got told off again for 'putting it on'. No one knew I was autistic back then, of course, as few working class people had heard of it. The memory of the injustice of it still smarts now, 44 years later! to your DS.

YABU. I have a child with diagnosed ASD and various other issues on top and it does him no favours to not be told off nor see consequences from actions.

my nephew has ASD and my sister has never told him off and stops others doing so: 16 years on it is a disaster as he is a young man who looks “normal” and has no idea about what is appropriate behaviour. You may think that’s an extreme example but believe me this is where that attitude takes you.

YABU

Sorry, I'm with everyone else. At what point in life should he learn to deal with "firmly"? SEN or not, he's a long life ahead and if you want him to have any form of normal life, then best start now. He was told to be careful. He wasn't. He had been spoken to firmly and it's a lesson.

Your child broke a toy, by being disobedient or not listening. Have you considered offering to replace it?

I have a fanily member who is pensionable age and was not disciplined. They still expect to get their own way and all of us dread having them at family gatherings, where there have been actual tantrums over the years.

A teacher needs to be firm if needed, it’s not popular however they have to have an element of authority otherwise how on earth can they effectively teach so many children of different abilities.

I'm going to completely disagree with everyone else on this post OP.

For me, intent matters. Your DS didn't mean to break the toy and was just trying to put it away. In his mind, he WAS being careful with it because he thought it came apart.

I would suggest that actually the staff should have been keeping a closer eye on him. He's known to have SEN and it's a precious new item - I'd expect them to be keeping a closer watch.

Accidents happen. I don't scold my children for accidents. What is the point of telling a child off for something that wasn't their fault?! Unless they were reckless in some way, there's no benefit at all. We all have accidents, and I think it's deeply unpleasant to make a big deal out of it. Your child thought he was doing the right thing, there was no lack of care.

Autistic children are incredibly sensitive and a "firm telling-off" will make a very big impression, and often be difficult to forget. Your DS probably feels terrible, and it will affect his confidence. Others can scoff all they want. I have twin DC who are both autistic, and I know they'd both be bloody devastated to have been told off - to the point of them not wanting to go back into school the next day! Both of my DC have difficulties asking for help too, again, it's a common difficulty with autistic children.

I'm not suggesting autistic children shouldn't ever be told off, obviously not! But they don't just shrug things off like an NT child so it really does need to be meaningful and appropriate. What's the point of telling a child off? Surely it's to prevent the behaviour from happening again in the future? How is this child supposed to learn from this - all that will happen is that he'll be frozen in fear and too scared to do anything just in case he makes another accidental mistake.

You're replacing the toy OP, and I think that's absolutely the right thing to do. I would say to your DS that you know he was trying his best and just made a mistake, and that we all make mistakes sometimes.

Yes, it’s harsh to say you’re failing at parenting. But honestly, the best thing you can do for your son is teach him to own his mistakes, and learn to accept that if his actions affect other people negatively, they have a right to be upset or annoyed, even if that wasn’t his intention. I have a 12 year old DS with ASD and he really struggles with this because his autism makes it hard for him to understand any point of view other than his own, but I keep persevering with the message about taking responsibility for his actions. Your son will never learn if you shield him from any consequences!

I'm going to completely disagree with everyone else on this post OP.. I agree with you, ExhaustedFlamingo - see my earlier post. What's happened is really unfair to the OP's DS.

I work in education. The head won't give a shit and won't be the one to answer you if you raise it with them.

Sympathies @BoardLikeAMirror - I agree with you. NT folk don't have a clue about neurodiversity. All the comments on here about how the OP's DS "needs to learn" are so far off the mark.

Being told off is appropriate if a child has done something wrong. The OP's child made a genuine mistake - there was no lack of care, just a misunderstanding. I really cannot see what he has done to warrant a telling-off.

And yes, I'm also autistic too!

Oh cross-posted 😅

Completely agree with you!

Your child broke a toy by being too rough with it. He might not have meant to break it but he was obviously being far too rough with it for it to break.

But he wasn't being rough with it though? Not trying to be argumentative, honestly, but the OP says her DS thought the item came apart so that's how it broke. That's not being "rough" with a toy, surely that's just an unfortunate misunderstanding?

Exactly this, thank you! I think it's hard for others to understand but like you say in his mind he was doing the right thing and he is known to not ask for help, it was even noted in his SALT report when they came to do observations in school and so while I do understand he needed to be spoke with I do feel the way he was spoke to was inappropriate for the situation.

I thought from the level of understanding in your post that you were probably autistic too.

I agree, pps have got this very wrong. OP's DS didn't consciously do anything 'wrong' - he was helpfully and tidily putting the toy away and made a mistake about how it fitted together. It is no use saying he has to 'learn' - if he is not treated with understanding he will likely withdraw from the idea of putting toys away altogether, in case he makes another mistake.

It’s about recognising outcome as well as intention though; both are important. My son will sometimes damage his sister’s toys by using them incorrectly, and then struggle to recognise why she’s upset because surely she must know he didn’t mean it. And I have to emphasise that her feelings of disappointment and frustration at her toy being broken are valid and he still needs to apologise because he won’t recognise that himself.

The person who told your son off was probably frustrated at losing a brand new resource that there probably isn't money to replace. And other children will be disappointed not to be able to use. It doesn't have the same impact as if he broke something at home that was his to start with. It being an accident unfortunately doesn't change the impact!
I would replace the toy, personally.