Shamima Begum's mother

[AddingUp]

I read an article about Shamima Begum's mother in the Daily Mail. I am very much in the camp that Shamima Begum should come back to the UK and be trialed here as her crimes.

Anyway, the mother says how close she was with Shamima and how she misses her etc.

If I were Shamima Begum's mum and my daughter was not allowed into the UK, I would travel to the refugee camp to be with her. Or, I would take my daughter to Bangladesh just to be with her and not leave her on her own.

I don't understand why Shamima Begum's mum takes no action to support her daughter!

why do you think Syria should have to deal with her?

VG was clearly damaged in early childhood (sexual abuse, drugs). She would not be the first teenager with this background to drift into the sex industry. It is the norm, if anything.

The similarity between them is that they cited trafficking as the reason many years after they had been living (more or less) how they wanted. The similarity ends there.

She's 23

what? 'drift' into the sex industry? 'years living how they want'?

I understand now. I thought it was straight forward racism. it's just lack of any depth of insight of anything at all. no empathy, just.....nothing

I think her parents should take some responsibility- she was 15 and shouldn’t have been allowed to leave end of story. She has probably done some terrible things but I am sure the male cohort of that period had an easier time of getting back to the uk. So while I think she should be dealt with severely we should consider the sexism in the situation and the fact she was let down by the adults in her life.

Shamima today is very different from the Shamima when she first arrived in Syria.

She's no longer an innocent girl. She's now a grown adult who has been trained, brainwashed and radicalised by terrorists. She may pose a security risk if allowed back in Britain.

You confuse your lack of nuanced thinking as empathy. You haven't demonstrated any depth of insight whatsoever, just the usual mechanical fist punching and conflation of unrelated minority causes - the usual silliness.

Are you from a minority ethnic or religious group? Or is it mainly consumed experience? Since I am then by the usual sjw rules, you should move aside.

Perhaps remember Kayla Muella and think about what the ISIS butchers did to her before worrying about Begun who brought it all upon herself. I for one think she made her bed and now she must lie on it.

James Bulger’s killers were white CHILDREN but they still had to face the consequences for their horrific actions. No different for Shamima.

‘Also not sure why people think she has Bangladeshi citizenship. She doesn't. Apparently shes never even been there.

Again just because of her colour.’

The connection to Bangladesh is through her parents.
There is dispute that she has dual British Bangladeshi citizenship based on her birth in the UK & her Bangladeshi parentage.

@AddingUp let's just suppose her mum did fly out to join her. What happens then? SB isn't allowed back in the country, so her mum lives with her in the camp for how long? It's been eight years so far.

What if, because her mum willingly went to Syria, she herself if not allowed back into the country? Then SB's family would have two people to campaign for instead of one. Are you saying it would be better for SB's whole family to take off to the refugee camp? Who should be next to go and live with SB AND her mum or does it just stop with mum having to stay in Syria?

What if her mum decides she's had enough and the government says 'tough, you went, you stay'? It's not a holiday camp, you can't just pop over for a couple of months and pop back when you need a break.

That’s Sharmeena Begum. Her similarly-named friend who went out 4 months earlier and persuaded Shamima and her two other friends to follow.

Sharmeena was more obviously groomed - mum recently died, dad immediately remarried and chucked her out to make space for wife number 2, Sharmeena had to move in with her grandmother, and left for IS a couple of months later. Physically escorted to the airport by women who told her she would meet her dead mother if she was martyred. Died early on out there in an air strike. Sad story all round.

Why do you think the UK taxpayer should have to stump up for a defence lawyer and court costs for someone who travelled to Syria to commit atrocities against innocent human beings, plus not giving a flying fig for their own infant children?

How many people do you know who has buried 3 healthy children - without the rest of the atrocities she was happy to take part in!?

Why should her crimes be a problem for the UK taxpayer?

As a UK taxpayer I say leave her there! I have no wish for for her to return to Uk. I certainly have no wish to contribute payment for her to return. I couldn’t give a 💩 what happens to her tbh.

If one of my daughters committed the crimes she has I would disown them! I certainly wouldn’t be asking for UK residents to stump up for a defence lawyer - or to welcome her back into the UK!

You do know she is a grown woman and not 15?? I’m on the side of this grown woman should never be allowed back into the UK. I think you should read on what actions Ms Begum took part in while with Isis.

because she is a British citizen

why do you think Syria should have to deal with her/pay for her?

She was 15 when she went. Unless things have moved backward from when I was 15 - decades ago - then she was mature enough to know exactly what to expect when she arrived with the terrorist scum she chose to join. She was also old enough to have done her research and discover that her new chums chopped the heads off innocent people.

Indeed in some reports I've read in news media a GREAT deal more factual and unbiased than what any intelligent person now calls the Daily Fail, she has apparently in the past agreed that she herself did some chopping.

I most certainly don't want her to ever set a foot in Britain again, in case she's actually still a fanatic, trying to set herself up as a "sleeper". Which I frankly find a lot more convincing an idea than that she's done a U-turn and is now deeply regretful.

And if I was her mother, I'd have changed my name and home town and hoped never to be recognised as the sort of person who brought up that sort of child, rather than whining about wanting to do what she must know is impossible, all in an attempt to make her little poisonous darling seem like a clueless victim of circumstance.

If this post makes me a Mumsnet Pariah, then so be it.

She is a woman of colour. If she travels there. she may be accused of joining IS or condoning terrorism. If she travels with her to Bangladesh the govt could use it as excuse that that's is Shemima's home. She is doing the right thing. Likely as advised by lawyers who know more thn we do

Well, she has to be some country's problem... Why should the UK be able to wash its hands off her when she held UK citizenship and had lived all her life here? Why should Syria / the authorities of Kurdistan have to pay to keep and support someone who came over there to join and support ISIS, basically a hostile military force, in some ways an occupying one?

"Why should her crimes be a problem for the UK taxpayer?" Why should her crimes be a problem for the Syrian or Kurdish taxpayer? After all the devastation and slaughter caused by the group she went there to join? Don't you think these countries have more additional problems than the UK?

She had, in effect, only UK citizenship. The UK claimed she had a 'right' to Bangladeshi citizenship, which is not the standpoint of Bangladesh, and in any case she never actually held Bangladeshi citizenship.

Everyone has a right to a nationality. What that comes down to is that everyone must be the responsibility of some country or other. In the case of Shamima Begum, the country that fits that responsibility is the UK.

💔

The wider issue in this case is the precedence it sets. If SB is solely a criminal who went to another country and committed atrocities, what happens to the other children in those situations? Rochdale girls were involved in recruiting and grooming very young girls to be raped, drugged and be involved in criminal behaviour. Children up and down the country are coerced into committing serious crimes, drug trafficking and even murder. We always consider the initial grooming of that child because if we don’t, we are affectively holding children accountable for being manipulated by adults. It is not to say that she bares no responsibility at all but we have to consider what led a 15 yr old to join IS. If anything, this is the highest form of exploitation and grooming! We need to understand that this places so many children at serious risk of harm, not just SB.

Are you Mandy Smith's mother?

Do you think all sex with 15 y/o s is concentual?

Yep, this is not a path we should follow.

👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

The Police after that case gave letters out to girls who they thought were at risk of grooming. At no time did they speak to the parents, or collaborate with teachers etc. Likewise the teachers didn't report the girls change in behaviour, mood or the lack of homework etc. I to wonder why the county lines youngsters/prostitutes/groomed teens are seen as victims, but not her. I've seen interviews with child soldiers and they shut down in the same way that Begum has. I've seen women who've had severe trauma, including baby deaths and they look 'dead eyed'. Those explainable responses are held against her.

Because that’s where she aided and succoured barbaric acts.