Not allowed siblings at my sons nativity play .. including my breast fed baby??

[WinnieLovett]

My daughter is 4 months old and breastfeeding.

My two other sons are involved in the school nativity play. The school will be having two performers one at 2:30 and one at 7:00.

I have been informed that the school has a ‘no sibling rule’ to watching so I will not be allowed to bring my daughter. The issue is these times are both when she has milk.

I was also told by the head that she may make noise and interrupt the performance !!

Really sad as I don’t want to miss it ! But do not feel happy leaving my baby at these times!

Lmfao yes, and then all pop off to the phonics lesson together afterwards!

A school isn’t a public place.

Which section of the equality act would apply section 17 of the equality act to a school play?

I don’t know how many people have to point out that you can’t prevent a woman who is in a public place with her baby from breastfeeding her baby, and you can’t ask her to leave because she’s breastfeeding, or make comments or jokes about her breastfeeding.

absolutely nowhere, unless you’re going to point me to a specific section I’ve not come across despite practising in this area since the act came into force, does the equality act entitle a breastfeeding mother to demand that she be allowed to take her baby with her wherever she wants when other children are not allowed. Breastfeeding mothers can’t be treated unfavourably because they are breastfeeding. This is not the same thing as exceptions being made for them to rules as to who can or cannot attend private events. The no siblings policy applies to everyone. Section 17 is not an indirect discrimination provision.

By all means advocate for women to be able to take babies with them to nativities but please stop calling it discrimination.

Some useful guidance on who's automatically entitled to be on school premises.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/controlling-access-to-school-premises/controlling-access-to-school-premises

Our primary used to welcome babies to the dress rehearsal, so breastfeeding mums could see it then. Maybe you could suggest that?

Agree. There’s usually other rules like not standing up to get a better view, two guests per family, no phones to be used, phones on silent, no eating or drinking (I’m not relating this to breastfeeding), not moving the seating, not holding a seat for someone, not putting a bag/coat/feet up on a seat, leaving the hall row by row as directed by the teachers to avoid pushing, mobility reduced people being assisted as they need, no large bags or umbrellas (left away from the door outside the hall. Things like this ensure the kids on stage are respected and also that the audience knows what is acceptable.

What’s that Mingey? Schools are private property? People do not have an automatic right to enter? Anyone who breaks those rules would be trespassing?

Well, well, well.

I don’t think it matters what logic you raise @SirMingeALot - mummies know best, far better than the lawyers on this thread.

I think the Head is quite right and the poor li'l OP is being ridiculous if she can't organise herself better. That's the JJ verdict!

I know from experience that if you set a limit then there'll be the Oh but s/he's only a week over 6 months, blah blah blah brigade, I'm special so it can't apply to Moi!

This has turned into a rather bizarre rant at how unfair life is & we should all just accept it.
I’ve been an infant teacher doing nativities for a very, very long time. I have never seen a child upset by a baby crying.
Last year’s nativities were the worst as they had to be filmed out in the freezing cold at my school with nobody watching live thanks to covid.
Let’s try and gain some perspective here.

And if the baby cries? Just as someone else’s child delivers their ONE line. Totally reasonable. In my school we allow parents who really can be separated from performers siblings to watch the dress rehearsal. Imagine if all the parents wanted to be the exception. Your daughter can be fed before and after the performance.

I have never seen a child upset by a baby crying

Fair enough, for you. But it's safe bet that every adult will not be pleased to have their enjoyment interrupted in this way.

No she really couldn’t. Stop spouting shit.

Schools aren’t private businesses though are they? Parents of the school are allowed to watch their own child in the nativity play. The Head isn’t going to accuse a mum of trespassing when coming to watch her child in the play. The HT thensrelf can’t orevent her from entering the premises without calling the police which frankly they aren’t going to do (yes obviously if it was a safeguarding issue etc) but otherwise… not necessary.

maybe discrimination is the wrong term to use? Sorry for not being a qualified solicitor here. I obviously don’t have the breadth of knowledge and experience that you do but my opinion is that a blanket ban applied to all siblings is discriminatory to breastfeeding mothers. This is not about self interest as I have said. As a single mum, I’ve struggled with childcare, as a working mum I’ve struggled to get time off to see my children in events. Working in a school I can see how these things snowball and all the headteacher needs to do is apply some commonsense without fear that it is somehow going to cause some horrific problem. If another parent approaches and asks to bring her 6.2 month old child the HT can use their discretion to decide whether that is appropriate or not. If 22 parents all want to bring breastfed babies maybe the HT decides to do something different. But being inclusive to breastfeeding mums during the first six months should surely be encouraged. It doesn’t give you the right to ‘go anywhere’ and I didn’t suggest it did. But to your own child’s school nativity play… that’s a very different thing to say for example, the opera.

if you lawyers know the equality and discrimination law inside out and know that it is being described incorrectly then presumably you will have less understanding of how primary schools are run and what DfE guidance is.

Discrimination is the wrong term to use, yes. Glad we finally got there.

And no schools aren't private businesses, nobody said they were. They're usually private property, as per the link above, which isn't the same thing. You've been talking absolute nonsense.

On the other point, the comments about being practically unable to prevent entry mean nothing without some idea of the premises. Our assembly hall has quite a narrow door that could easily enough be physically blocked by a headteacher or anyone desiring to prevent a person entering. Unless you're about to suggest OP try and fight her way in...

I was quoting the Dept for Educations guidelines for access to schools. It confirms they are private property and that those entering uninvited are trespassing.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/controlling-access-to-school-premises/controlling-access-to-school-premises

I’ve worked in both law and eduction. Neither taught me more about how annoying kids are at school events, than being a parent myself. Personally, I couldn’t bear pissing off all the other mums and dads who’d had to move heaven and earth to get to the nativity.

Yes, can you actually imagine what a twat OP would make of herself if she turned up with the baby and told them they'd have to phone the police to stop her trespassing? She'd be legendary!

This! My baby was feeding without any pattern but she'd pretty much be content anywhere as long as she's had access to my boob.

I’m not a teacher but have been to many, many nativities.

I agree it’s not the children who get upset and generally it’s not the little ones who are disruptive. Some parents tend to be far more selfish and inconsiderate, standing up, taking phone calls, taking photos, talking loudly.

But she wouldn’t would she? She’d take the baby in and the school wouldn’t ring the police because they are in the real world. What head is going to call the police to prevent a woman from watching her own child in the play?

I tend to apply a basic rule of thumb that if I have to rely on someone not calling the police to get what I want, I shouldn’t be doing whatever I’m thinking of doing. But that’s just me.

OMG this thread has gone ridiculous😂People are just bonkers.

OP, hope you get to watch the nativity xx

As explained in my previous post, you'd need to know something about the physical layout of the place to ascertain whether OP could barge into the hall or not. Our hall could be blocked, perhaps theirs could.

Still, I suppose we should all be glad you've abandoned the legal arguments.

That's ridiculous not to allow siblings, no idea why the school are being so precious about this. Did they actually specify not even a babe in arms? I doubt it. Just put baby in a sling and turn up they won't send you away. Lots of parents at my kids school plays come with younger siblings because they're single parents or the other parent is working and they have no childcare. It seems really OTT of the school to have such rules and is definitely not the norm at schools in my northern city. Is this a strange competitive London school thing?

Some of these replies are awful! I have 4 mo twins and trust me when the want feeding they want feeding! Why should the baby have to wait because the school doesn’t want the play ‘disrupted’. It’s a stupid rule. If the child can sit on a knee I can’t see why they can’t be there. Not everyone has family or friends around to watch their child/ren. I’m with you op.