"People have their own lives"

[alfreddo82]

We lived abroad for many years but moved back to the U.K. recently so our children could spend time with grandparents and extended family. DH in particular was really concerned that our DC were missing out from not having those family connections.

Since moving back we have found family on both sides to be a massive disappointment and one of the phrases I constantly hear when speaking to people about the situation is “yes but people have their own lives”

I have lots of friends who’s parents/aunts/cousins etc seem very interested in spending time with them and their children and this is just integrated into “their own lives”

I am well aware that everyone has different priorities in life, however AIBU to think that really that phrase just means “people can’t be fucked” and would rather just continue on as they always have without making any effort for anyone else?

The company of children isn't all that interesting though very often tbh. Even when they are GC.
My DM lived ten minutes away and we could go a month and not see her. No taking the DC out for tea. Never a sleepover in 13 years. She'd rather be shopping or going on holiday than standing in a play park or sitting in McDonalds and I don't blame her.
The families I know that spend lots of free time together seem to have have boundary issues, and the women ultimately beholden to ageing parents after years of 'family time' are all on antidepressants.

I do dislike the idea repeated again and again here that if your family don't socialise with you exactly how YOU want them to - your choice of both frequency and "support" - then they're a shit family.

It is very sad when you see loving families around you, and you don't have that level of love and support yourself. I felt that so many times, and bit back the tears. One day your little children will become adults, and it will matter less, and as you have grandchildren and great grandchildren to fuss and love, you can be the grandparent you never had. Shower your own children with love and affection so that the silver lining will be that your own close bonds will come from the ones you created and sustained with your dc.

I guess it comes down to being grateful for what we do have, and not focus on what is missing. No family is perfect, no matter how close and some are downright toxic and dangerous. I try to celebrate the love I have in my life, not the disappointments. Some people have nothing and no one and are still managing a full life.

Did you actually talk to your family about your reasons for wanting to move back, before you moved? It sounds like you made the decision based on some comments on social media, which frankly don’t mean much - people make all kinds of insincere comments on facebook.

As others have said, talking about how much “the value of family” means to you is a bit random, considering you moved away from them and now expect them to prioritise you and your children when it benefits you. It is what it is.

I am on the other side of the world from my family, and sometimes I feel like I want to be nearer to them, but the reality is that visiting them & actually moving near them are two very different things.

This.
This is the reality of many many families across the world.

Yes I often wondered what the level of expectation is of elderly care in the very close families, and I wonder how easy that will be after raising children for decades, to have to do the same all over again with both sets of parents.

The price of parental support maybe decades of expected care in later years.

Do they even like kids? Some people just don’t want to spend time with kids because they’re largely quite boring and annoying. They’re not obligated to be interested in your children just because you’re related. The idea of family ties is overrated. Friends who choose to be around each other because they want to, not because they happen to share DNA, can be a much better support network so it sounds like moving back to where you were is the best idea.

YABVU

i presume you lived abroad because it was what you wanted to do. How much did you prioritise time to spend with your parents /extended family during those years? Just because you’ve now decided your children should spend time with your families you can’t expect everyone to prioritise them.

I'd missed that bit but as you moved back 2 years ago and your children are 2.5 and 4 I'd worked it out! They missed out on the baby stage entirely with one and the tiny baby stage with the other. That's hard.

I think you are just relying on them too much to be your entire social life. Think back to before you moved. Realistically, how much time would you have chosen to spend with them over your friends?

OP you won’t get the answers you’re looking for on here. Mumsnet isn’t a place where many people are very involved with their families and don’t seem to understand the importance of it. It’s perhaps less important if you’re married but as a single parent, having family around makes such a difference. There’s not much more stressful than knowing that if you’re ill and there’s an emergency, there’s no one to help. But still there’s this attitude on here that wanting or needing help is ‘entitled’ and you should ‘suck it up’.

It’s very weird that someone would want to see their only grandchildren once a month. Have you told them how you feel though?

Do they even like kids? Some people just don’t want to spend time with kids because they’re largely quite boring and annoying. They’re not obligated to be interested in your children just because you’re related.

Children can be boring and annoying but come on, it's pretty sad if your grandparents don't even try to bond with you.

They can't even manage and hour a week or similar, bearing in mind it's spending time together not moving in!

Boring and annoying generally applies to the monotony of parenting, not a grandparent taking GCs out. That should be all the highlights and fun parts

You had 'your own lives' where you abandoned them for years, your choice not theirs to not move and not see them but now expect them to drop everything to rush and intergrate you into their lives... nah, thats not how it works.

You are not the main character of their story, hell your not even a side character because you choose to be in a different book to their story and they dont have to drop everything (they will have established routines) because once again you decided to up and move and now finally want to be part of their lives.

Its not all about you.

Thank you for your lovely response, my DH says that same, that we should focus on our family as that's where all our love actually is.

I can't imagine being indifferent to my kids, I will always want to be a part of their lives.

TBH I think the one thing that people lose sight of when living abroad is that relationships especially with the DC just aren’t the same.

If you have a baby while you’re living abroad and re-appear some years down the line that child is a grandchild in name only and there is no relationship. And because there’s no relationship, the incentive isn’t there to have one, iyswim. The grandchild doesn’t really care about the grandparent, the cousins, etc etc, because they’re essentially just strangers, and by the same token the grandparent doesn’t think the same of the grandchild as they haven’t been there from the beginning.

I grew up abroad, and although I had a relationship of sorts with my grandparents when we came home, they were essentially just there, they were grandparents in name only, and I wouldn’t expect any different tbh, not because they didn’t care, but because it just wasn’t a relationship. It’s pretty much unrealistic to present a 2 year old child and say “hey this is your grandchild, now you’ll have a loving relationship.” Iyswim.

I absolutely advocate living abroad, but people need to realise that there is a price to pay for so doing.

My husband's mother was persuaded to move abroad by her second husband who wanted her to sell her house in UK (owned outright and solely in her name) so that when they bought a house abroad it would be half his and therefore he would have assets to leave to his family. He didn't have a penny to his name after two previous divorces and always having rented. He also had very substantial debts here that didn't get paid when they moved abroad.

Our children were very young. We did wonder why H's mother didn't want to be involved in their lives anymore.

Twenty years later, they have returned and are puzzled as to why they cannot fit back in where they left off.

We moved on. Our lives evolved without H's mother. Maybe it's hard to 'move back'. I can see 'issues' which may have something to do with abandonment. H cannot be in the same room as her. The rest of us politely tolerate her when she turns up and breathe a sigh of relief when she leaves. She doesn't know our children/grandchildren. It's all very strained sadly.

I think you need to ask yourself the following questions...

If you didn't have children, would you have the same expectations on time spent socialising with these family members?

When your children are older, will you have the same expectations on time spent socialising with these family members?

Personally, I think once to twice a month is a reasonable amount.

It's not about seeing them less as a result.

But it's double standards, isn't it? It was okay for OP to move abroad and not see her family, but somehow it's not okay for her family to have filled their lives with other activities in the meantime 🤷🏻‍♀️

Life doesn't stop for those left behind.

Comments on social media aren't a conversation, though. Did you ever actually discuss this, in a proper conversation, with your parents or PILs? Did you say you were thinking of coming back and wondering how it would be in practice, how much you would see of them, how involved with their GCs they'd want to be etc? It sounds like you didn't tbh, just made assumptions. And it doesn't sound now as though you've actually said to anyone, look, this isn't what we imagined, we thought we'd see more of you and hoped you'd be closer to the GCs, what do you think about what we're saying.

I'm not big on family myself but I can't imagine feeling as you are and not talking about it openly, so that you can get a sense of where everyone is coming from and what they want. If any of this is genuinely important to you, I wouldn't up and leave again without talking about it properly, otherwise it's just flouncing, isn't it?

The fact that none of this is being discussed openly, and your willingness to just sack it all off and leave again, make me think you were never actually that close to them anyway. That's okay and pretty common tbh, and it also explains why people haven't made that much effort, but it's not reasonable to expect great closeness to spring up on demand if it was never there before, imo.

Once or twice a month is good, it's neatly half the weekends in a month

I have a couple,of sisters who decided that after years of indifference towards me that I was suddenly important to them when they had their kids.

I was pleased at the beginning, but it soon became clear that I was expected to provide babysitting/entertaining for their children and that they weren't actually interested in me.

I never wanted kids, not great around them and not interested in them so I kept my distance - didn't stop them trying to get me to take the kids to the park etc, apparently it was for my benefit but that was crap, it was only for theirs.

Maybe your siblings feel that you weren't bothered about them when you fucked off abroad, now you're back because you want a free babysitting service. Don't blame them for keeping you at arms length

Just makes me sad that we uprooted our lives and gave up so much so the DC could know their family and they barely see them

Well it's your own choice you need to be sad with. Not your extended family.

Yes your expectations were too high and it made no sense to uproot your kids on the basis that others would change their usual plans to see you all more.

From my experience, and I have done what you did and am now back abroad again, the reality is that the close relationship is either there or not. It doesn’t depend on where you are located for most part of the year.
My DD (17) has a close and loving relationship with GPs and cousins even though she spends only a few weeks a year with them. On the other side of the family (living in the same country as we do) there is no relationship and she doesn’t know her cousins.
Organise your life around what is best long term for your family (career, education, lifestyle) and don’t hold grudges. People indeed have their own lives and will only put in the effort that comes naturally. And that’s fine.

You are not the main character of their story, hell your not even a side character

Wow!!

That is such a harsh comment. So op can't expect to even be a side character in her parents' lives?

I disagree. As a parent, I would move heaven and earth to spend time with my young adult children. I can not imagine a time I would not rush to help them, talk to them and would see future grandchildren as possibly the most wonderful thing to ever happen to us as older people. Would I want to see them more than once a month for 1/2 hour - hell yes!!! I would have them every day if I could.

This is largely about personalities and expectations.

If you are a CBA and pretty selfish and self centred maybe your children and grandchildren are not especially interesting! You might not care too much about seeing them at all. Maybe tescos has more to offer in the cold meat section on a Sunday than your little grandchildren. If you are a loving person, of course you will embrace your adult children and grandchildren. I am sorry op but they are just not very nice or interested, and unlikely to ever be. As hard as it is to hear.

I would have a long cold look at what they were like before you left, and I think you will find nothing has changed, which is why you left in the first place.

I agree with this. My sister moved away years ago then gets upset when she comes home because my mum and l are closer. Of course it is fine for you to move away but this is one of the consequences.

To be honest, if you move away for years and years, you can't expect people (who have built a life without you front and centre) to suddenly leap into action to make you the focus of everything. They are used to not being around you, and involved with you, on the day to day. It'll take some time to change.

But really, from your post, you sound really pissed off that people haven't fawned all over you and the kids like you expected. But it's true, people DO have their own lives. And you can't expect to swan in and be worshipped. If you're giving the extended family the vibes you're giving off here - I'm not massively surprised they haven't made you number 1 priority.