"People have their own lives"

[alfreddo82]

We lived abroad for many years but moved back to the U.K. recently so our children could spend time with grandparents and extended family. DH in particular was really concerned that our DC were missing out from not having those family connections.

Since moving back we have found family on both sides to be a massive disappointment and one of the phrases I constantly hear when speaking to people about the situation is “yes but people have their own lives”

I have lots of friends who’s parents/aunts/cousins etc seem very interested in spending time with them and their children and this is just integrated into “their own lives”

I am well aware that everyone has different priorities in life, however AIBU to think that really that phrase just means “people can’t be fucked” and would rather just continue on as they always have without making any effort for anyone else?

You don't mention whether you discussed any of this with family before coming back. Did you? Did they press you to come back and say how much they'd like to spend more time with you and your children, and then renege? Or did you make assumptions about how it would be? Have you discussed how you're feeling about how it's all gone? Have you discussed feeling as though you might as well go back? You talk about wanting to be close to your family, but what you've actually described doesn't sound close, communicative or collaborative at all.

When your parents are older and need help I wonder who they will reach out to?
Geographic distance can have its positives.

This. ^ When you choose to move away 100s of miles or abroad, then don't be surprised if, when you come back, most people aren't overly interested in you. It's a bitter pill to swallow. A friend of mine moved away 45 miles - not too far - but a bit too far just 'pop in' and in the 5 years since she went, she has had visits from a family member on 6 different occasions. Just 6! She visits once a month (was twice a month to start with but she has cut back the visits.)

For context, her extended family who all live within 3 miles of one another, see each other 2-3 times a week, pop in for coffees, go shopping together, pop to the pub together 3 or 4 times a month etc. She is 100% not included in anything.

Sadly, if you make the choice to uproot, and move miles away this is what happens. Sorry @alfreddo82 but this situation will very likely never change. You went away, and you stayed away too long. If you want things to change you will have to work VERY hard to try to make it happen. Even then it may not.

I'd be hurt too and agree that the frequency you've described is not what I'd be hoping for. I'm really close to my family and DH family and I'd be gutted if that was the only time they wanted to spend with us.

YANBU. In healthy families the family is PART of their life.

I get what you’re saying, OP. Thinking of my family, one of them has 4 dc, her family is extremely involved (enmeshed!) and I doubt she goes a day without seeing her parents/brother. We have dozens of cousins and she socialises loads with them, most weekends are organised, it would drive me nuts, but she revels in it. I’m glad I’m too far to do anything more than an annual visit.

I can imagine how disappointed you feel, but they probably have their rhythm so expecting them to change for you is too much. Do you offer to organise stuff?

I would think very carefully about moving back if I were you.

I found the 'devastation' extremely false and difficult to believe, we had been in the UK for decades with no effort made. Then suddenly expressing huge loss when we decide leave?

I sometimes think they just want a plan B for special occasions/emergencies/ and can't see that all relationships require both sides to make an investment on a regular and consistent basis.

We are planning to move overseas again in the not so distant future, and follow our dreams ~ I expect the same horrified reaction, but we haven't seen them for the past 9 months, so I am not sure why they would even care or notice the difference. I am definitely not buying into the devastation this time around.

I have been holding off visiting to see if they will make the effort this year...and nine months in it appears they still won't make the smallest of efforts for us.

You are not losing anything, if there is nothing there to lose. Cold and distant families have bizarre expectations in my experience.

Have the life you want, then you won't feel resentful or sad, and their visits to you will be enjoyable and fun.

Absolutely this.
If they are anything like my parents, they also might not have fully "forgiven" you for going in the first place (and taking their grandchildren away).
Small steps OP, it takes time to build a new life (even if it is your old life).

Similar here@alfreddo82 when we came back to the UK. We didn't expect a welcome committee, just to pick up more or less where we left but - not very nice for our DCs - we were made to feel that people had 'moved on'.

Which was so weird, the 'moving on' part must have happened when we were loading the removal van 🚚Because the same people had masses of time for us/came to stay all the time when we lived abroad
We've 'moved on' too now.

My DH is English and we live in my home country. One of my siblings lives 5 mins away and we only see them once a month at the most. Because we are all busy!

We have many friends who have moved back to the UK to be closer to family when they had kids, and many of them have come back again because it didn’t live up to their expectations in terms of family involvement. They acknowledge that there is a huge difference between going back for a holiday - when everyone is thrilled to see you and rearranges their plans to catch up - and moving back permanently where you’re no longer a novelty and there’s no imperative to catch up because you’ll always be there.

I do notice a lot of expats preface all their complaints/comments about parenting with ‘we don’t have any family support’ and I think they can have an unrealistic expectation of what family provides. Yes, some GP want to be extremely involved. But none of my friends ever received regular childcare from their family members, even when they live close by.

Social media has a lot to answer for. Various family members would comment often on how sad it was to not be able to see the DC grow up etc. when we told people we were moving back they were very excited. When we first moved back we seen people fairly often, however very quickly it became very one sided. I realised that I was the one who was always inviting people places or organising meals and catch ups etc, with young kids and a demanding job I started to feel resentful so I stopped doing it and now for the best part of a year we haven't seen anyone except my aforementioned "pop in for a cup of tea" once per month.

many of them have come back again because it didn’t live up to their expectations in terms of family involvement. They acknowledge that there is a huge difference between going back for a holiday - when everyone is thrilled to see you and rearranges their plans to catch up - and moving back permanently where you’re no longer a novelty and there’s no imperative to catch up because you’ll always be there

100% this ^

Whatever the rights or wrongs of how both OP and her family expect their family interactions to play out, being back is not working for OP. Sounds like she had a nice life abroad that she enjoyed with her "urban" family; and being at home doesn't compare or make up for what she's missing and the life she could give her children. I bet that if she does go back, her family will complain about not seeing the grandchildren.

My experience was the reverse, actually, as the sibling who went down the concentrating on career path, and got married/had kids many years after my sisters did and nieces and nephews came along. I passed up several offers to work abroad because my sisters/parents complained about me being too far away to be a proper aunt/daughter; but the effort (including significant monetary support and a great deal of emotional input) I made with them was a complete one way street. They weren't really interested in me, and all the time and effort I spent on the nieces and nephews counted for nothing (we are not close). When my own kids came along, they showed little interest. I will always regret the missed opportunities.

OP, you tried, it hasn't worked, not all families are equal, go and find happiness elsewhere.

It was your decision to move away so they adapted to life without you.

Now you want them to drop everything and spend more time with your DC when they have their own families? What did you to get to know their children while you were living abroad?

You will always get those that want to try and make you feel guilty. I guess it was annoying seeing your lovely photos and perhaps they were not so happy with their own lives.

Either way - you now know where you stand.

So this is the whole point of my post really. It's just very obvious that I don't/won't have a healthy family.

And maybe that's why it was not too much of a struggle to move abroad for a while.

Oh we've learned our lesson. We moved very close to where they live from another part of the UK and they visited twice, we had to make all the effort and were told well that's what you do, that that's your role. Unsurprisingly we moved abroad and will not be moving back.

Ironically, I was brought up very close-knit with cousins and grandparents so I know the value that brings to kids and the family members as a whole. Unfortunately this hasn't been carried on.

DPs family visit regularly, mine hasn't come once. We are missing nothing. I will never be like this with our kids, it is cruel.

Just as well nobody got too attached, then.

Do you think it’s a case that grandparents always knew this might happen?

At least read the op. Op is not expecting anyone to 'drop everything' just to occasionally organise family get togethers and/or see the much loved grandchildren they claim to cherish! She has not once suggested the families should stop everything for them. Please stop with the posts like this, it is annoying as op has addressed this point repeatedly.

I don't know why you expect anything different when you chose to live abroad for many years. Your families get used to life without you. Move back again if you are finding family connections disappointing and this is the sole reason you came back.

You've given up your social circle to live near family but they still have theirs. It must be disappointing, but the siblings are childfree, I assume they do not have the same interests are two pre-schoolers. As for the grandparents, they might be enjoying their childfree freedom too. Maybe it's a bit of a bonding problem too. They don't really know the children and missed out on all the cute baby cuddles. I assume that as they are near strangers, the children were not running into their arms either.

Unfortunately this is how modern Western life seems to be now. It’s really sad and quite depressing. I think it’s the loss of community and that people generally feel quite overwhelmed and exhausted most of the time. I dream of seeing friends and family a lot but I end up not seeing them a lot because I am so busy and tired with my own nuclear family. I believe the internet/TV has a large part to do with it too because they’re very distracting and keep you sucked in and sedentary.

Did anyone ask you to uproot your lives for that purpose, though? To me it sounds like you moved back with an expectation of something that wasn't actually going to happen anyway.

If grandparents had been begging you to come back and saying they wanted to be able to pop in every day and have the kids a few times a week and go out as a family regularly at weekends or whatever and then they didn't, I might feel a bit short changed. But unless they were that specific (i.e. not just 'It'd be nice if you were closer!') then I think YABU a bit.

Also, the DC do know their family, surely? That's not an unusual amount to see GPs, nor is it unusual to see extended family much less frequently. I didn't see one set of my grandparents more than once or twice a month most of my life, but I loved them very much and knew them well and have fond memories of my childhood with them. Both my aunts I saw about 4 times a year despite them living relatively nearby and I get on great with them, and we're very close now I'm an adult. It's not like you see them once a year!

We usually only hear from our in-laws when it’s their birthday or Christmas