Emotional affair

[Helena22]

I found out about my DH's affair back in the summer. My children had been doing GCSEs and A'levels and apparently the affair was going on for 2 years, with a rep at work who had already been in a physical relationship with one of DH's colleagues. Anyway, he has sent many gifts to her with messages of love and these intensified up to when I found out. I confronted him and he's been tearful, remorseful and defensive in equal measure. They were having a lot of contact via Whatsapp, phone and tracked each other's location but I was so trusting I never really guessed or suspected. He even said I would get on well with her when I confronted him! Anyway, some months on and I am medicated for anxiety and depression, he is still at home behaving like nothing has happened and I just don't know what to do. I feel I need evidence to disprove his claims that it was just an emotional relationship, didn't mean anything, was a fantasy etc etc. It took him 2 weeks to end it although I don't know if he actually did and I remain paranoid. I can't go on like this - any advice?

Why don’t you believe that you don’t have tie for a counsellor? Get to a damn solicitor!!!

He will be hiding money in her name!!!

Considering everything I think it’s only worth salvaging if there is truth, transparency. If he’s actually continuing to blatantly lie, then it’s not a problem of the affair, it’s just that these characteristics are dreadful for your relationship, because it’s about control. I would say that you really need to take a look at his character over the last 30 yrs. if you have noticed any lying any other entitled characteristics, you should really educate yourself about narcissistic personality disorder. Because a person refusing to apologise is a person entitled. There are lots of videos on YouTube about this. It is quite likely that both of them may have this disorder. Usually in an affair it has to be at least one person. To be able to inflict pain and to be accepting of lies and deceit being inflicted on another person, one would have to lack of empathy. Then it becomes more about whether you wish to live with somebody with that algorithm, or did they come under the spell of a schemer. I am afraid if he’s actually not wanting to support you with a counsellor, he says a lot about him and his lack of empathy. And you can be in any profession in this world, but still be callous and actually operate on a low emotional IQ.

So whilst it appears that he is just madly in love and that his feelings that he’s having, it’s actually probably a sign of a big problem. The fact that he could live with your kids knowing and that I didn’t bother him if they told you or not, that’s actually much more concerning than any possibility of physical STI sharing. I would put him under a microscope and think through your relationship as a whole, and what he contributed and what he didn’t contribute. That is a lot more important. Because if he does have NPD, he will be very difficult in terms of divorcing. So you would need to educate yourself about that side of things, to try and be able to cope with that.

Sorry, I have experience a bit with this but, for one, him having an affair actually could’ve done you a big favour. Sometimes narcissists have something called fear of abandonment. They usually will never ever allow somebody to leave their sphere, so just putting this out there, if this has happened to you, having an affair can be such a blessing because you can actually legitimately always hold him down to that. You did this and I could not move on. That was the end of the story for me. So that way you can continue to shut them down so they cannot manipulate you emotionally ever again..

She hasn't won;she's gained a man capable of lies,deception and unfaithfulness,one she'd never be able to truly trust.

That's if she actually wants him at all;in the cold light of day is the relationship actually that exciting when you take into account baggage and the cost of being divorced/separated?

Once she becomes the partner not the AP he doesn't have to "woo" her anymore,the presents will stop,thé effort will stop;Thé thrill of an affair isn't that thrilling when you become the one washing someone's skidmarked undies,finding one of their stray toenail clippings or discovering their bad habits is it?

She will, it seems they are inextricably linked and actually I need to realise that he has fallen deeply in love with someone else (despite his protestations to the contrary). I am so so tempted to message her but know that probably isn't the right thing to do. It is so tough when you have no one to share the yo-yo-ing between utter despair, humiliation and anger.....

The problem is that I have told noone - the support isn't there at the moment and I do not feel I can tell anyone until I have made a decision about what I am going to do. And to make that decision I need to be stronger and consider everything.

It is so tough when you have no one to share the yo-yo-ing between utter despair, humiliation and anger.....

I think you need to tell someone. You don't need to wait until you've made a decision. In fact, telling someone will probably help you to make a decision.

I think you will find it significantly easier to cope once you are not trying to deal with it alone and have someone to whom you can vent/who can help you to process everything and support you. I imagine an outside perspective will also help you to see through his bullshit and make the situation clearer to you. Do you have someone you can trust?

I think that in a way, not telling anyone is your way of avoiding that it's happened because on a level you know that if you tell the people who love and care about you, they'll encourage you to leave because they want you to be happy and treated like you deserve to be treated which is not like this. You don't need to rush it, I would start with someone you know supports you and who you trust not to tell anyone else and go from there. The other side of this is, when you see that there are others who care about you it will make the very difficult process of leaving him properly a little more manageable because you won't be alone. You don't need to message her, but what you could do to get it off your chest is maybe write letters to them both separately. You don't need to send them if you don't want to but it would let you get your feelings out and help you process and then if you don't want them to read them just burn them. Financially are you in a position to go it alone? What you said earlier about hiding bank accounts is very very worrying. Do you have an account in your own name you can move half your money into and do you have your own income?

Well, if he is a doctor there will be a good slice of pension to divvy up. Start getting things together and find out all you can about where the money is. Search his emails and drawers for statements etc or register on the moneysavingexpert credit club to see Experian reports.

I'm sorry, but if he was truly remorseful he would have ditched all her contacts and moved where he couldn't interact with her, rather than being half-in-half-out. If he won't re-commit to you, take back control of the situation and tell HIM how things are. He hasn't been transparent, he hasn't answered your questions, so why does he deserve you? Also - the OW sounds a peach. My money's on either she'll get cold feet when your husband becomes available, or she'll ditch him for someone richer and better when they come along. Using your fanny as a means for social climbing is the pits.

Hello @Helena22 I am so sorry you are going through this.
I just wanted to say, for whatever it's worth; I have a good friend who's a very experienced and family law solicitor and it is her personal opinion is that divorce is rarely worth it.
I am aware that a lot of people will disagree, let me explain. We're not talking about couples where physical and mental abuse and disfunction prevent any kind of secure environment for the family. (I personally think that infidelity is both mental and physical abuse, but let's put that aside.)
She would probably ask you if you could bear to live with this new knowledge about your husband for a while and see how you feel before rushing into a divorce, and eventually see if you can see a way to live and make new choices and provisions for yourself according to the reality, within your marriage. This is because she believes that both parties, but more particularly women who are financially dependent have so much to lose in a divorce, and that both parties often end up regretting that decision anyway. She is quite sanguine about affairs, doesn't believe it's the best reason to upend your life, impoverish yourself considerably and generally make everything much harder for yourself and your children. Without condoning or making excuses for infidelity, she's quite disillusioned and see it as so common a failure in men that women should at least try to spare themselves the financial repercussions of it and weigh their very carefully options. She doesn't think women should accept infidelity, she thinks that finances make a huge difference in life and that women should look out for number one and that your long time best interest isn't necessarily a knee jerk reaction.
That's it, I know it's not going to be a popular view on here, but I do find some wisdom in it.

If you think about it, you knowing about your husband's 'friendship' actually sucks a lot of oxygen out of it. Yes he might be intoxicated at the moment but it's been what? two years? If he was so determined to be with her he would have initiated a divorce some time ago already. He might not be so keen to upend his life. He may be having his cake and eating it but so what, he's been doing that for a while, there's no rush. If you decide you do want a divorce, going ahead when things have cooled off a little with the OW, when he won't be so spurred on to give you a bad deal, might be better for you. I don't know, but you will, when you recover from the shock, you will be the best judge of what is the best way for you. In the meantime, you don't have to play her game and help her get back on her feet with a brand new husband asap by pushing for a divorce.

Good luck OP, be strong, all the best.

@Helena22 put your best poker face on, give nothing away.

Consult a family law specialist solicitor for advice.
This is a priority, get this done in days not weeks.
If you know of someone through friends who has helped them get a good deal that’s a place to start, otherwise the Law Society has a list of solicitors searchable by specialism & location.

Use the advice to collect information in case you decide to divorce.
The act of gathering evidence of income & assets will be your taking some control in this situation, change the narrative of what has happened to you.
The information gained will help adjust your perspective, as it will allow you - & your solicitor - to scope how you & your children many live after divorce.
Let this adjusted perspective be your friend as you work out what to do, what is best for you.

You have taken a heavy blow.
This has impacted your health & wellbeing.
You are dealing with a grievous shock & demolition of the trust you placed with him in your marriage.

Think not of the OW, she is not your concern & most certainly she is not concerned about you.
Think not of him, he has made his choices.
He chose to jeopardise the trust between you. He is not a callow youth wet behind the ears who did not understand the value of a marriage & family, he is an adult man of many seasons.

The anniversary? When they first shagged.

Get advice from the solicitor now, before Christmas rolls in.
Often an emotional pinch point for relationships where covert matters come to a head. Should anything blow up or blow in, you need to know where you stand so that you may keep a cool head & steady heart.

He has both injured & insulted you, you need space to work out what is right for you, so I suggest that he moves out for a while. No more his carrying on as though nothing has happened. If he quibbles about shifting, put a packed bag by the door & tell him the alternative is that you instigate divorce (& you will have done the prep). The power dynamics between you will have shifted.

Take control, change the narrative, work for what is right for you & the children. Part of your psychological distress is that you have lost control of your life, a helplessness has been forced on you. Taking control sets you on the path to recovery.

This is your life, live it well.

Great advice wish I did that when it happened to me. I went in all guns blazing. It was a long time ago now but it’s a terrible situation to be in. We have a child and I actually really like the OW now she takes good care of dd and I feel sorry for her she is trapped with my ex.

I think @CressidaV is spot on. Having lived through the same, she knows what she’s talking about. Wisdom for your own survival and best financial outcomes for you and children. Some tiny man’s feelings in his pants are really a passing phenomena that flickers out pretty quickly. Look at the big picture. If he’s a dreadful liar and has been throughout your marriage then ditch, but if this is just a teeny tiny bit of limerance at his grand old age that flatters his beer belly, it’s not worth your upheaval and chaos.

An emotional affair is worse than a physical one to me! You’ve got all the evidence you need that he’s in love with someone else. As awful as it sounds, you need to have more respect for yourself leave.

And these grand gestures of necklace and crappy poems are usually requested by the OW. Think about it. If someone dished out this shit into you you would think they’re bonkers. It is bonkers. It’s usually requested as a sign of big love ❤️ so that it can be used as evidence later on when the wife finds out. My h had letters requested. In the end she provided these letters dated in her own handwriting. That’s when I knew it was fake. She was keeping a chronological record. Who does that? A calculated psychopath. No way was I going to ever have my kids spend a day with that weirdo. A few yrs on we are happy and our kids are thriving. All I’m saying don’t disrupt your own plan and life over someone else’s stupidity and a tiny dash of passing limerance.

Of course they have slept together they are in love why wouldn’t they? And honestly what difference does it make ? No matter how much you question him you are never going to know every conversation, every text every lunch date as it’s been going on for two years.

He is still lying to you. Please for your own sanity leave or kick him out. The analogy earlier to a case in court is a good one. The evidence is overwhelming, he DID it he treated it so please please please for the sake of your own sanity kick him the fuck out.

@Jenny3412 I don’t agree with some of your earlier comments, but overall you are on this. Sorry to hear you went through the wringer, you sure have earned your stripes.

BTW, what it is with the side bar?
Invitation to share for a documentary?
Immaculate AI or what?

@CressidaV

This is because she believes that both parties, but more particularly women who are financially dependent have so much to lose in a divorce, and that both parties often end up regretting that decision anyway. She is quite sanguine about affairs, doesn't believe it's the best reason to upend your life, impoverish yourself considerably and generally make everything much harder for yourself and your children.

It's obviously true that in many scenarios divorce doesn't benefit anyone financially. But your position (or the position of your friend) assumes that the marriage balance sheet is the only consideration here.

What about the mental wellbeing of the OP and the resilience and self-respect of her children? (including female children if she has them: I'm not sure whether she does). Yes by not divorcing you will probably provide a healthier financial baseline for the future of the family. And that's not nothing. If the OP wants her children to go to university for example, it will be a consideration.

But it comes at a massive cost to the OP: she basically commits herself by doing this to living with a man who has hurt and deceived her. It's impossible to overstate how this affects people's sense of self-worth. At best, she will eventually come to some grudging acceptance of the status quo, probably by cauterising her own feelings and living in a state of resentful neutrality. More likely she will come to feel contempt for her husband and the entire family will be poisoned by the couple's attempts to disguise how much they hate each other. In no conceivable scenario will the couple come to respect and love one another again. That's a legacy the children will carry with them for the rest of their lives and it will impact their future relationships.

I don't want to minimise the impact of divorce on anyone. I know from personal experience that its not trivial and shouldn't be undertaken lightly. But I do also know that when I divorced my husband my life returned, my self-esteem returned and I was able to do so much more than I had done living in a state of seething distrust and self-hatred. I eventually regained my financial security on my own terms. And I'm certain my daughter benefited ultimately. For me the trade off was worth it, despite the financial impact.

I don’t know @Thepeopleversuswork both you and @CressidaV have a valid point. Life’s a journey. If your man is decent you can have a bump in that journey. And later in on life you can always reflect with your children on the benefits of forgiveness. That is if it is over. It needs to be over for you to be able to even consider working on this.

You don't need any evidence of them having sex. What he (at the very least) has already done is enough.
You need to speak to a lawyer asap.
Sorry he's putting you through this.

@Jenny3412

If your man is decent you can have a bump in that journey. And later in on life you can always reflect with your children on the benefits of forgiveness. That is if it is over. It needs to be over for you to be able to even consider working on this.

But he's not decent is he? At best, he has minimised an emotional affair for two years (almost certainly there's more to it than that but let's give him the benefit of the doubt). If he genuinely was remorseful and the OP could guarantee it was completely over your position would be worth considering. But he's clearly not completely remorseful and its far from clear its over.

Most women would struggle to get to the "benefits of forgiveness" (I know I would). I personally don't think signalling to the children that they have an obligation to grit their teeth through a period of appalling disrespect is helpful to them.

@Thepeopleversuswork OP is yet to determine whether the H is decent or not. It all depends on future actions. Affairs are usually blown out of proportion. This is peanuts. My H had a 3 yr one. But during that time it was more off than on and oh dear, rather pitiful really. The OW was emotionally imbalanced. He was literally being abused. I don’t know what to say. I am glad each and every day my kids are not exposed to that madness, our sex life is better than ever. I have gained so much understanding and insight, I feel wise, still young, beautiful and happy, and a man that worships the ground I walk on more than ever. Either scenario is possible. And both outcomes can be great. Cheating is trauma and when one is traumatised the response is to cut ties, start afresh. Think about that for a second. That is why it’s so important to make the decision down the line. Not in turmoil. But once you are calm and collected.

@Jenny3412

OP is yet to determine whether the H is decent or not. It all depends on future actions. Affairs are usually blown out of proportion. This is peanuts.

We'll have to agree to disagree on this. I don't think systematically lying to your spouse and children over a period of years is "peanuts" and don't think anyone who does that in a sustained fashion could ever be described as decent. No matter how much remorse they showed after the fact. With respect and sympathy to you: you are minimising this because to acknowledge this would force you to look at uncomfortable facts in your own relationship. You say your husband was "being abused", but the bottom line was that he chose to become involved with another woman and to deceive you in order to do this. You seem to be putting all the blame on her as if he had no agency in the situation. Where is your sense of anger and of your own self-worth?

I understand people are human and make mistakes but I don't see the point of being legally tied to someone who you don't respect and trust. Other than the financial/legal contract of the marriage there is nothing left after an affair: no relationship, no respect, no trust (possibly no friendship or sexual intimacy either). Why would you stay with someone who had lied to you like that? You will never regain any self-respect.

One strike and you're out for me. A marriage without trust is as useful as a chocolate teapot.