AIBU to expect to keep my full holiday entitlement?

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I've just applied to change my hours at work so I finish at 3pm every day, meaning I now work 80% of my full time hours. I was previously entitled to 25 days holiday but they're saying that will reduce to 20
(I.e. 20% less). I understand the logic, but I'm still working every day and losing a whole week's holiday is going to be pretty significant for me. The reason I'm cutting my hours is because I have no childcare outside of school! My pay is already reducing by 20% so taking a weeks leave from me on top seems unfair.

Surely, since in each day I work 20% less hours, when I am on leave I am also taking 20% less leave. So, I should still get 25 days (but am taking 20% less hours each day). I already argued this to HR but they refused, and sent me a policy which very clearly states the calculation and says if you're part time on e.g. 80% hours, you get 80% leave even if you work 5 days a week. This seems wrong to me but they refuse to give in.

Has anyone else been in a similar situation and managed to argue successfully? Am I being unreasonable to expect a bit more from a company who claims to support women who need flexible working arrangements?

Just realised my * for multiply sign has emboldened some text (and not shown the x sign) in my post - hopefully you get the jist....

It should just be proportional hours. If you work a 32 hour week, you should now need to use 32 hours of annual leave to take a full week off instead of 40. If you work a 6.4 hour day, you should need to take 6.4 hours of annual leave to take a day off instead of 8.

At the same time, on bank holidays, you should only be paid for 6.4 hours.

Call the Acas helpline or Pregnant Then Screwed to get this confirmed…..

Yes, everything should be pro-rata, so technically, yes, your annual leave should reduce by 20% along with your hours and pay. BUT this should still equate to the same number of days you can take off.

It is confusing, because leave is usually expressed in days, even when it needs to be calculated in hours for pro-rata purposes.

So assuming you were previously working 8 hours a day, and you had 25 days leave, that was 200 hours (25 x 8).

Now you are working 6.4 hours a day, and you get 20 days annual leave. However, these days are based on the standard 8 hour work day, which means they equate to 160 hours (20 x 8).

However, the 20 days (160 hours) of leave, equates to 25 of your now reduced (6.4 hour) days off (160 / 6.4).

So every time you book a day's leave on your new hours, you should actually only be booking 0.8 days.

You should clarify with your work that this is the situation, but it is how it should work, and would in my workplace.

I did exactly this when they first told me and they replied with the policy, which clearly states if you go down to 80% you go down to 30 days, regardless of how many days a week you work. I think the issue is that the policy is wrong and unfortunately that is going to make it more difficult to change than if it was just an individual arguing with me

20 days, not 3

I think the difference is I have dropped a day, I just work less hours each day. I agree it would be different if I was working fewer days

Haven't dropped a day!! Gosh this interface is rubbish and I have a squirming child jumping on me

But they are right... you drop down to 20 FTE days. So 20 fulltime days, but as you only work 0.8 days, you only need to take 0.8 days for every day off. So it works out the same. It's easier if you just calculate your leave in hours.

It depends on your Terms of Employment - in our organisation if you work 5 days a week you get the same number of holidays whether working 4 hours a day or 8. If you only work 4 days a week then you get 80% of FTE.

Also this regarding you now getting 20 days. They are 8 hour days. When you take a day off you will using 0.8 of a holiday day so it would work out but they may not see that!

To have a five day week off you will need to use four holiday days iyswim.

Show your employer this: www.acas.org.uk/checking-holiday-entitlement

I wouldn't go in full guns blazing. I'd say they have it right but are communicating it poorly. I used to cry every year working out the Christmas rota and one fifth payment and public holidays for bank holidays because we'd argue until we were ready to collapse and then I'd present my rota and they'd say that's grand despite telling me I was wrong the whole time. We'd be saying the same thing in different words. It's like how doctors are taught to make their writing indecipherable in college.

Surely it would now just be paid at 25 6 hour days rather than 25 8 hour days (or however many hours your days are now). Leave is actually accurately calculated using hours and then you divide that by days, but still you will get 80% of what you got before. Same number 9f days but less pay.

OP - if you are going to check this with HR, then also ask whether your entitled to paid sick leave changes. You might as well have all the facts before committing to the new contract!

I've done the same. I still work 5 days a week but only 5 hours per day instead of 7. My holiday allowance, in days, has remained the same, but has reduced in hours.

Your AL should drop by the same % as the work you have dropped. So you should still get the same amount of days AL.

For example worked 40 hours per week, 30 days AL (240 hours). Dropped to 80% ie 32 hours per week means AL drops by 20% too so 24 days AL (192 hours). 192 hours AL divided by 32 hours per wk = 6 weeks off each year for 32 hours per week. 240/40 = 6 weeks AL.

The person should have said your AL entitlement drops by 20%, not the number of days off. Worth querying, but unless a very small business the payroll system will calculate the hours.

Ours is expressed as 25 days but actually booked by hour so 7.4 hours for a day off whereas you would only need 5.5 etc for a day off.

This. I've just changed my hours from full time to 9-3. I get less AL hours but I still get the same number of days.

OP - repeating in case you miss this message in the thread. This spells it out cleanly and factually.

I work part-time at 0.8 FTE and have no issues with leave. It can be managed very effectively when calculated in hours.

You work 80% compared to your previous 100% but expect the same holiday. Would you expect a colleague who only worked 60% to get the same as you? If not, why would you think you retain your holiday? It's usually worked out in hours, some employers' convert that to days for ease. YABU.

I did something similar last year and asked how It would be worked out. I now work Monday to Friday 9-3 instead of 9-5.30. I get exactly the same amount of days as previously, its just based on the new hours.

PP's way of explaining it is excellent where they equate that you're losing 36% of your holiday for a 20% reduction in your working hours.

If you look at in terms of actual hours worked, it goes as follows:

• Let's assume that a working year is exactly 52 weeks x 37.5 hours this is 1,950 hours. You take 25 x 7.5 days holiday, leaving 1,762.50 hours actually worked per year.

• Reducing to 6 hours a day is 1,560 hours of available working hours per year. If they're now only saying you get 20 x 6 hour days this means you'll be working 1,440 hours, so as a percentage of your original working hours it's 81.7%

I'd be going back to them if they insist and saying in that case you want 81.7% of your original pay, not 80%!

I reckon the intern has either used poor maths, got totally muddled, or has used the Government's calculator.

The problem with the government calculator is that it only works out the statutory minimum entitlement. You already had more than the statutory minimum in the first place.

That's how it worked for me when I cut my days shorter to finish at 2.30pm for school pick up. It was all worked in hours, so yes, I got less hours leave, but I only needed 5.5 hours leave to get a whole day off (NHS)

I'd ask them to clarify :-

1. How many hours the new leave entitlement is
2. How many hours of that leave do they then apply to you when you take a day off