Halloween Judgement- keep your views to yourself

[HappyHalloweenWeenies]

I'm not religious and love Halloween. I have always celebrated it and my dp celebrates with me. Nothing too scary or out there because our kids are young. No chainsaw Massacre figures in garden or dripping blood, just the usual pumpkins, ghosts and witches, food and pre agreed trick or treating with neighbours. Our kids love it too for dressing up and have been taught in a fun way and not a 'celebrating evil' way.

Anyway, sil and mil invited themselves down this week. I didn't invite them and made it very clear to dp that as it was half term I would be doing the usual Halloween stuff so kids don't miss out. Dp fine with this and we arranged a few activities like pumpkin picking, carving etc. Sil and mil here the whole week. Both kids going to the village party but no expectation for either mil or sil and kids to attend, just one evening.

Anyway, sil been fine. A few questions about it, nothing phased rudely. Politely declined Halloween party, which we offered with the caveat if it's not her thing that is fine no judgement. Sil is a fairweather Christian, eg church for marriage and getting into schools so we weren't sure if we should ask or not but thought it would be rude not to.

Mil has been making a few snide comments. Kids watching ridiculously sanitised Halloween songs on TV (think cocomelon) and scoffs things like 'how can they have a 'happy halloween' with all those ghoulish characters? Trying to dissuade kids from their own pumpkin designs and do ones she approves of etc. It's all been very low key so I haven't mentioned it to dp but aibu to think that as she knows we have conflicting views and she invited herself down knowing full well we celebrate it she needs to keep her views to herself? It's starting to grate on me as I don't want my kids to start seeing evil in perfectly innocent dressing up etc.

I feel it's a bit like if we invited ourselves down at Christmas and then made snide comments about going to church.

Aibu or is sil approach better and mil is engaging in weird power games?

You know what ?

Fuck off with your greedy children knocking doors for buckets of sweets - commercial tat and crap . Another excuse to grab grab and grab some more . Teens egging windows and shite when the elderly do t answer the door - chucking fireworks - yeah your gentle little Halloween isn't my experience. Try working in a 999 call centre or being a cop this time of year. It's actually really shite and maybe that's why I don't t like it - but by the same token as your op - do t expect me to partake and don't ram it down my throat . I do not feel obliged at any other time of year to buy bowls of sweets for strangers kids - not Xmas , not Easter , not Ramadan . Have a fab time- dress up , make decorations, waste a zillion pumpkins but ffs leave me alone and don't keep ringing my bloody doorbell for lollies that now cost 3x what they did 2 weeks ago .

And . Breathe.

I think using Christianity as an excuse not to like Halloween is a bit rubbish. Don't like it because it is American or commercialised , or wasteful , or trick or treaters sometimes knock on doors of people who have clearly not joined in - whatever - actually It is a pretty innocuous date with varying theories - Celtic & afterwards. Yes it is commercialised - more so still I think in the US but it isn't a reason I think for using Christianity to be judgmental

@MrsMinted I admire your spaghetti brains - when I did my second pumpkin the year after the first year after I realised I had chucked away the seeds ( because I thought soup better without) so I made them into vomit coming out of the jack O Lantern's mouth. Why I do not know. I think that is when we all thought Halloween had run its course in our family.

No!!! To
All that! Ha ! Yay ! Never bought a helium balloon, don't holiday , what was the other ?
Never lit a Chinese lantern . Do t do Xmas decorating, Halloween, Easter . So do I get a note from my mum ? I think I do practice what I are t preaching.

Did you miss the part where I said we do pre arranged trick or treating with like minded families.
Kids are not egging anyone's houses.
We haven't invited you to any celebrations so I wouldn't worry about us ramming it down your throat.

But that's all you told us she's said:

how can they have a 'happy halloween' with all those ghoulish characters? Trying to dissuade kids from their own pumpkin designs and do ones she approves of etc.'

It's really not that bad, OP. I've no idea why you're stewing over that.

Though what nasty aspects of her religion? Sounds intriguing.

Well, on the Halloween topic thousands of innocent women were burned as witches in the name of Christianity, losing us collective knowledge about midwifery etc for centuries.

You may not think it's 'not that bad' to make such comments, but it's not particularly tolerant either.

@feindVicarInATutu - Please do keep breathing. Where I live trick or treating is really not unpleasant . The general rule is , if you do not decorate your house - no-one will ring on your doorbell . I can understand frustrating if that is not the case where you live.

@feindVicarInATutu yeah you probably have a point here. I live in an area where Halloween is very polite and nice so I'm seeing it from my own experience - mainly little kids, there is never a Trick because no one runs out of sweets (simply take pumpkin back inside and then no one knocks).

I have absolutely no experience of real pranks, police callouts, or old people being harassed. I would hate what you're describing and didnt realise Halloween was causing policing headaches.

You then are in a minority.

I have enforced overtime this time of year because of fireworks, teen's terrorising the elderly, and general fuckwits . Takes the shine of that pumpkin a bit .

Never really got Halloween. Did t do it .
Don't fly work from home
Do t and never have bought a helium balloon
Walk or cycle where I can as can't drive anyway due to injury
Dunno what those arguments were meant to prove ? If it was meant to make
E oh oops I buy helium with the weekly shop , jet off around the world and drive big car .....😂. Nope .

Happy for anyone to celebrate it - but leave me be please ! I don't want to feed your children a gallon bucket of haribo. I do t want my dogs barking all night . I do t want to partake . Thank you x

Sorry I've got a bit animated.

It is mainly harmless fun for those with little uns . But as a copper I get the rage - (did you notice ?) 😂. Sorry . But it's a bloody nightmare for policing. Probably colours my view .

Well, on the Halloween topic thousands of innocent women were burned as witches in the name of Christianity, losing us collective knowledge about midwifery etc for centuries.

Come on, OP. Burning people as witches (thus losing valuable midwifery knowledge) is one of the nastier aspects of your mother-in-law's religion that you manage to keep your mouth shut about?

You are leg-pulling now I'm certain! Très amusant

@feindVicarInATutu I was looking for examples of pointless waste in your daily life. You ignored many of my examples.

But you provided me one. Your dog is an unnecessary luxury. Unless it is a working animal. Think of all the farmland used up and the carbon production to feed your pet - isnt it socially irresponsible to keep a pet that is eating every day for years, when the land used to farm its food could be used to produce food for humans?

My point is you can take millions of common behaviours and extrapolate to prove they are some kind of crime against humanity.

Why do you get to keep your dog alive, but I'm not allowed to enjoy a pumpkin once a year?

He is a working animal .

Why do you think 'Christians' would be opposed to Hallowe'en?

It was always huge in Ireland, with a large RC population. Older traditions around Samhain coexisted peacefully alongside the Christian celebrations of All Souls and All Saints days immediately following.

Fwiw, to those complaining about Americanisation, Hallowe'en was taken to America by the millions of Irish and Scottish emigrants who settled there.

The only people I have known to be anti-Hallowe'en (based on a completely groundless idea that it's the Devil's birthday) are Baptists.

Well he was a working animal . He isn't now . He's old . And my god do I pay through the nose for that with the vets let me tell you!

You enjoy your pumpkin. I'm really not that mean .

I just see another side to the whole dark nights thing - it's a massive and almighty pain in the arse for police .

Realise I'm a bit jaded . Sorry.

@feindVicarInATutu I just knew you were going to say that 🤣

And I'm sure there is SOME aspect of your life that isnt 100% saintly, but cba to keep looking for examples.

Feel free to clobber the antisocial pranksters if you can catch them this Halloween. Giving Halloween a bad name and makes me v sad to think it is creating so much work for police eho have far better things to do.

You may think it's a bit rubbish but a lot of churches actively preach against celebrating Halloween. Some run their own, alternative, light festivals on the same day so children can still attend.

If she genuinely believes you are encouraging your children to celebrate the Devil, then she's being very restrained in her responses. Well done mil.

It sounds macabre and over-commercialised but your family seem to have it as a central celebration. Perhaps she didn't realize that when she arranged to visit? Most people just chuck on a witches hat and go trick or treating for 15 minutes, job done. Next year you could remind her it was a full on celebration time of year and she might want to come another time.

Thanks 😊 sorry I'm being a right old humbug aren't I ? I did buy a zombie bride costume last year for a party. Fucking hated it 😂 you enjoy your pumpkins 🎃. And enjoy doing stuff with the littlies . And I will ensure if I catch any of the little soda who egg windows I'll make sure they having a window cleaning round for a week 👍

@feindVicarInATutu
The way the wild and raucous culture of Hallowe'en in the US got tamed and turned into a fun-filled and joyful event for children and parents and law abiding citizens in general involved turning it into a night where trick or treating by small children predominated. Up to the 1950s it was a night of wild carry on.

Do you know how the transformation happened? People opened their doors to small children and gave then candy.

You can huff and puff all you want about Hallowe'en but it's in the UK to stay. If you want the neighbourhoods you patrol to start becoming more pleasant places at Hallowe'en, you need to encourage families with small children to take to the streets, and you and the Hallowe'en grinches need to start opening doors and dispensing candy.

I would love nothing more than dishing out candy to solve the community tensions I deal with . How lovely that would be. .

(Sighs)

I do always buy a shitload of haribo, lollies and fun size mars bars.

And I leave my light on. I'm not a grinch really . I'd like to be . I keep aspiring to it .

Why do you think 'Christians' would be opposed to Hallowe'en?

It was always huge in Ireland, with a large RC population. Older traditions around Samhain coexisted peacefully alongside the Christian celebrations of All Souls and All Saints days immediately following.

Agree. Halloween would be celebrated, though the trick or treating wasn't really a thing in our area (and would be hollowed out Jack o' lantern squash, swede or even potato). All Souls was a quieter day of prayer and remembrance that I recall. We'd bring flowers or foliage into school for the vases.

Though I'm not really religious nowadays.

@feindVicarInATutu - if you are having to police an area where those kind of things are happening - then I can actually see why you hate it.

I am also in an area like @MrsMinted - so maybe a minority as well , where it is the accepted thing that only on decorated houses do you knock on the door , when you run out of sweets - take the decorations down ( I have actually seen people stick a note on the door saying "Run out of sweets - please don't knock " & that has worked. & it is 99.9% little'uns with their parents in groups with parents saying - just one sweet . Well they are the ones who will have to cope with the sugar rush afterwards unless they put them on a High Shelf . But seriously it is mainly early evening and all done and dusted pretty soon. The worst I have had is two teenaged boys when I had taken everything in expect one bat on the door which I had missed & they knocked , to which I said , sorry no sweets but I do have some apples. They gracefully declined.

If people are using it as an excuse to behave badly to the extent it requires policing I can understand your animation.

Oh . An I am saintly. In all ways . 😇.

If it's not insensitive of her to offer an opinion, I don't think it's insensitive of you to make it clear her opinion is unwelcome and could she please stop spoiling Halloween for the kids?