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AIBU?

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Original poster

To think that transing young children is a medical scandal?

291 replies

WandaWomblesaurus · 22/10/2022 02:53

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11342541/Dr-Az-Hakeem-says-parents-claimed-kids-trans-NHS-Tavistock-transing-factory-clinic.html

"I remember saying to them, this is madness. What we're doing is madness. These are children. These are three-year-olds."
Are we seriously saying this is ok? I feel like as a society we have gone mad, allowing this to happen to young children.

AIBU to think this is child abuse? And if you disagree how do you justify three and four year olds being transed?

OP posts:
CarefreeMe · 22/10/2022 12:40

What are you actually saying here? That souls/minds/brains are racially categorised? Are there disabled/non disabled souls? How does that work?

@TheKeatingFive So are you saying albino people are biologically white?

As I know of albino people who identify as black as that is who they are and would be very offended that someone was telling them that they are white.

AlisonDonut · 22/10/2022 12:41

CarefreeMe · 22/10/2022 12:31

Do you believe that disabled people might have been born in the wrong body?

Of course.

That’s where the term disabled comes from.

We haven’t evolved to be born disabled.
Something went wrong usually in the mitosis or meiosis division.

Just like there are people born both sexes.

Or albino people who have white skin but are black.
These people are white but inside identify as black.
But something went wrong and their physical body doesn’t match their brain/mind/soul.

Oh right - so when someone has a perfectly able body but their brain thinks they should be disabled, we should remove limbs to appease their brain.

Got it.

TheKeatingFive · 22/10/2022 12:42

So are you saying albino people are biologically white?

No they have a pigment disorder. It's not difficult to understand.

What I want to know is more information on the racially categorised soul you're saying they have.

Livinginanotherworld · 22/10/2022 12:42

It’s an absolute disgrace and definitely child abuse, I dread to think of these poor kids fucked up futures.

helpyhelperton · 22/10/2022 12:42

AndyWarholsPiehole · 22/10/2022 12:09

If a 6 year old says I want to be the opposite sex and they are made to stay as dresses as their sex, with their name and hate it and cry themselves to sleep - what do we do then? Therapy I guess is most important here? And lots of it?

What do we do? We tell the parents to stop being regressive idiots and allow their child to dress as he or she wants to.

Sorry; I meant dress as and be called Jane at home but John at school and outside?

How do we justify/explain that?

Isn't that more confusing?

I'm not being goady at all, I'm so confused and find the thought of anyone hating their sex? Gender? (This confuses me) really sad.

CarefreeMe · 22/10/2022 12:43

People are not born "both sexes" . They might have a DSD but are still biologically male or female.

No people who are completely intersex are often given a gender by their parents or choose one themselves depending on whether they feel more male or female.
Of course if you are more one sex than the other you choose that.

WhereYouLeftIt · 22/10/2022 12:44

From the Daily Mail article in the OP - this was news to me!

"Dr Hakeem said there was an overrepresentation of grieving parents who had lost a child, only to become pregnant again."

I've read of parents being homophobic (wanting the gay trans'ed away), and of parents compared to Munchausens by proxy before - but grieving parents (presumably wanting to replace their lost child but giving birth to the 'wrong sex' to do that) is one I've not heard before and I'm finding that particularly sickening.

In all three the parents are seeing the child not as a human in their own right but as a tool to be used to fulfil their own desires, but somehow I'm finding the notion of grieving parents worse than homophobic/Munchausens.

TheKeatingFive · 22/10/2022 12:45

No people who are completely intersex are often given a gender by their parents or choose one themselves depending on whether they feel more male or female.

Thats nonsense. If your sex is not apparent at first glance, simple tests will ascertain what sex you are.

Its a bit embarrassing for you to be trotting out this nonsense. Absolutely no human has ever been 'completely intersex'

CarefreeMe · 22/10/2022 12:45

Oh right - so when someone has a perfectly able body but their brain thinks they should be disabled, we should remove limbs to appease their brain.

Erm no.

Lots of people have a physically able body but disabled brain.

Same as lots of people have a disabled body but a non disabled brain.

Lots of people with disabled bodies undergo treatment to ‘fix’ what nature messed up.

Should they not be allowed to do this because that is not the body they were born in?

Rainbowshit · 22/10/2022 12:45

CarefreeMe · 22/10/2022 12:43

People are not born "both sexes" . They might have a DSD but are still biologically male or female.

No people who are completely intersex are often given a gender by their parents or choose one themselves depending on whether they feel more male or female.
Of course if you are more one sex than the other you choose that.

Where on earth are you getting this from?! 🙈🙈

Samesesame · 22/10/2022 12:46

Hooverphobe · 22/10/2022 06:05

Yes! Munchausens!

I’ve been muttering for years that a certain type of parent is delighted in the attention it brings. But seriously? The actual recorded figures have dropped? 😲

out and out child abuse.

And then you get totally innocent parents of SEN or certain conditions dc accused of FII (similar to munchausens) because they are pushing for ehcp/support/funding etc its horrendous

CarefreeMe · 22/10/2022 12:47

Thats nonsense. If your sex is not apparent at first glance, simple tests will ascertain what sex you are.

And what tests would those be then?

As it’s normal for intersex people to have both male and female tissue inside their bodies.

Palladin · 22/10/2022 12:47

It's disgusting.

As the prevalence of true intersex people is only 0.018%, this is really not relevant to the general debate.

TheKeatingFive · 22/10/2022 12:48

Erm no.

There is a disorder where people 'identify' as amputees or paraplegics. According to your reasoning, their mind says they are, but their bodies are not. Should they be given surgery to correct this mind/body imbalance. And if not, why?

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 22/10/2022 12:48

CarefreeMe · 22/10/2022 12:45

Oh right - so when someone has a perfectly able body but their brain thinks they should be disabled, we should remove limbs to appease their brain.

Erm no.

Lots of people have a physically able body but disabled brain.

Same as lots of people have a disabled body but a non disabled brain.

Lots of people with disabled bodies undergo treatment to ‘fix’ what nature messed up.

Should they not be allowed to do this because that is not the body they were born in?

But what about the transabled - should they have limbs removed on the NHS?

AssignedNorthern · 22/10/2022 12:48

Whowhatwherewhenwhynow · 22/10/2022 07:52

To add I think the care for genuinely trans children needs to be not “you can change sex” but “you can never change your sex, but you can present how you want and let’s try to get you to a place where you are as happy and comfortable in your body and identity as possible”. People can’t change sex and I worry that pretending that is possible is harmful as it sets very high expectations.

Agree with this 100%

TheKeatingFive · 22/10/2022 12:50

And what tests would those be then?

A saliva test for example, used in sport.

As it’s normal for intersex people to have both male and female tissue inside their bodies

What it is 'male tissue' or 'female tissue'? What are you talking about exactly

Clymene · 22/10/2022 12:50

You really don't know what you're talking about @CarefreeMe and it's enormously offensive to bring people with a specific disability - a disorder of sexual development - into a discussion about parents taking their toddlers for gender affirmation treatment.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 22/10/2022 12:51

CarefreeMe · 22/10/2022 12:47

Thats nonsense. If your sex is not apparent at first glance, simple tests will ascertain what sex you are.

And what tests would those be then?

As it’s normal for intersex people to have both male and female tissue inside their bodies.

You are being incredibly offensive. Please go educate yourself.

CarefreeMe · 22/10/2022 12:52

But what about the transabled - should they have limbs removed on the NHS?

Absolutely not.

But if you’re an adult and want to get plastic surgery to add or remove, enhance, cut, pierce yourself then crack on but only at your own expense and under strict rules like living as an amputee for years and having the all clear on your MH or ability to make decisions.

TheKeatingFive · 22/10/2022 12:54

Absolutely not.

Why not?

What is the difference, via your logic, between cutting of breasts/penises and cutting off a leg?

in both cases, according to your arguments, it's about bringing 'bodies' into line with 'souls'.

So why are they different?

CarefreeMe · 22/10/2022 12:55

You are being incredibly offensive. Please go educate yourself.

Lol what by saying that intersex people have both male and female tissue in their bodies which is 100% accurate.

Nice try at silencing me when I’m starting to make sense though.

If you or PPs are unaware then be honest and go and educate yourself, before dismissing what I’m saying without checking first and embarrassing yourselves.

TheKeatingFive · 22/10/2022 12:56

Lol what by saying that intersex people have both male and female tissue in their bodies which is 100% accurate

Once again, can you please explain what you mean by male / female 'tissue'?

CarefreeMe · 22/10/2022 12:56

Why not?

Because unless the body part is life limiting then it shouldn’t be paid for by the NHS.

AndyWarholsPiehole · 22/10/2022 12:57

Or albino people who have white skin but are black
These people are white but inside identify as black
But something went wrong and their physical body doesn’t match their brain/mind/soul

Souls come in a variety of different 'races'? Confused

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