MIL dropping hints about moving in.

[HappyDays40]

I have a lovely but very elderly MIL who at 94 lives independently and has friends who come and visit her that live on the street. We do shopping appointments etc and visits each week she is about 20 miles away. Sometimes when she isn't feeling too good she stays for a few days but is always glad to get back home as we have a noisy 6 year old who she loves but it can understandably get too much.
She told me today she is having the house valued so she can "move in with family ".......I think she means us considering there is nobody else:)
She is unsteady on her feet, can't do stairs but her house is adapted, she is familiar with it. Wherever she moves to would need some adaptations. When she does stay its very hard, we have a small dog who gets under her feet so is a falls risk, we have to move our work ( both full time) to make sure we are home to help her too the loo, get her drinks etc. She is no problem just sits in her chair , watches telly and drinks tea. But it isn't possible to work from home all the time our jobs involve some time out of the house!
Her friends pop over and wouldn't be able to do that if she were here.
We go away, do festivals and are not home much at weekends especially in the summer, she won't have carers or respite care.
I don't want her to move in permanently as it cannot possibly work logistically. She is welcome to stop over but it stops our routines an restricts us to the house. Not sure how we would manage to work, care for her full time and continue any quality of life for our son. Any suggestions how to address this without hurting her feelings are welcome.

*care home, not car.

She thinks you don't love her because you don't want her to live with you!

You have had to find someone to look after your 6yr old & your husband is staying a couple of days.

No you can't make her do anything, but you also don't have to jump when she tells you to.

If she doesn't feel safe then she needs to move to where she does feel safe!

If she's sharp as a tack she'll soon work it out!

While he is there he has to talk with her. It's tough. They do not change their minds. Some things have to be non negotiable for their own good.

My husband is a good man and even he realises that she can't stay here. To be honest in her heart of hearts she must think that too. He also can't stay there indefinitely either.
He is going to get her GP appointment to start with and ask for a review of her anti depression medication. She has an appointment for her hearing tomorrow at the audiologist. I wish I could scoop her up and resolve it all. I can't imagine how she is feeling. I just know the way she views our life whenever she is here is not representative of how it actually is. There can't be a long term arrangement here if she was poorly for a short term then yes we could and would buy she is generally just frail.

You obviously know your situation best. If my parent repeatedly shuts down conversations about elder care, it won’t take me long to get to the point you’re at right now: well what’s going to happen to you when you can’t manage any more? We don’t have space in our house, we don’t have a downstairs loo, what are you going to do?

These exact conversations are happening right now with my DPs, albeit in their 70s. It’s a dialogue that covers everyone’s plans. We’re planning for their autonomy, everyone having space, financial planning, everything is on the table. My DM initially said she’d only leave her house in a box. It took a solid year for her to understand that a lot could go wrong that she might not be able to handle before try at happens. It’s about facing all that, and it can take a long time to reach that acceptance. I am keeping at it. Because what’s the alternative? I guess the situation you’re finding yourself in which isn’t good for anyone - including you be sure it’s clear you mean well, you feel bad, you might feel guilty. Your initial question was about how not to hurt her. I’m sorry it’s come to this for you.

@Suemademedoit
Thank you for your understanding. She is a nightmare to try to get to discuss things. My own parents have decided that when their time comes they will sell their house and fo jnto sheltered accomodation
They are a little more understanding of what is possible and not possible. My MIL is a totally different generation. She looked after her mum but she had the capacity to do that. She is acting out of distress and I will still love her no matter what she says or does.

@LooLooLemon thank you. I don’t want to derail the thread but there are some very crazed posters (who I can only assume haven’t been full time live in carers for the elderly) who are trying to make out that to choose not to be a live in carer for an elderly in law is pure evil, and doesn’t seem to realise that one fall, stroke, infection the onset of dementia to take someone reasonably mobile and with it to incontinant, mentally incapacitated, agitated and violent, and caring for someone with these needs is complex, exhausting and expensive.

I wouldn’t wish my years of caring on my worst enemy, although from frustration at the critical posters on this thread, I wish they would have to upend their life into drudgery, they wouldn’t have the time or emotional energy to post.

She is acting out of distress and I will still love her no matter what she says or does.

You are clearly a lovely DIL. It's a shame that so many people put the worst possible spin on genuine distress.

It was being scared of being alone overnight that was the first sign that my lovely MIL wasn't coping. My SIL and I (my husband had died by then) both lived a couple of hours away.

SiL really wanted her to be able to remain in her home (her road was a real community and she'd known some of her neighbours for 60 years) so she took early retirement and would go up there for three days a week, and MIL had carers popping in on the other days.

Sadly that didn't turn it to be for the best. On a day that SIL wasn't there, MIL was found by the police, wandering at 5am some distance from home. They took her to hospital, and from there she went into a nursing home. Things can change very quickly.

Yes, she’s basically cornered you. But, even if you wanted to, you couldn’t have her stay with you. Is she more likely to be open with you, your DH, or both of you together? Do you think she will respond best to being given choices or a fait accompli? What does your DH recommend in all this? It must be very distressing for all concerned. If she continues to stonewall, she will have to suffer the consequences and unfortunately so will you. A scenario like @saraclara’s MIL. Or, maybe not. Maybe she will go quietly in her sleep as my DH’s DGM did at 96yo. Fit as a fiddle, just slipped away quietly.

Communication, with all parties involved or affected, is key in these scenarios. Just keep communicating. And try not to worry needlessly. It might all be ok.

A tale of 4 elderly people I am currently responsible for.

A: Retired couple a few health scares including a significant stroke. They had bought their last house with the eye of it being adapted as life changed and health started to decline. After the stroke, they reevaluated and moved into an independent living facility that has step care options through to hospice.

B; Very independent person who was hit with a terminal illness. Was in treatment but recently decided to decline life prolonging treatment. Currently working to do everything possible to die at home. Including allowing nursing and support services to come in to the house. Has said they prefer to die at home, but willing to go into inpatient hospice if necessary. This person was one of those who said they never wanted to be a burden and would move into a retirement situation when the time came. They do understand that anyone moving in with them to care for them is not an option.

C: Very passive person who isn’t really doing much for their health, barely mobile, did not make any plans for the future. Will be on their own soon and will be moved to assisted living (or maybe skilled nursing) soon. They just don’t get a choice. There aren’t any assets or money so it will be the best facility that I can find for them that is paid for by the gov’t. I will help with incidentals and pocket money but not with full living or care expenses.

I’m really not going to sit back and blame anyone for their situation or lack of planning or anything. It is what it is and they are all adults who had agency to make decisions. If those decisions have limited their later options then it is what it is. You’ll notice none of the options is to come to live with me.

OP it’s a tough position for everyone to be in. But we’re not talking about a child. This is an adult who has agency over her life. She may not like the choices she has now but it’s what she has. You and your DH need to realistic on what you can offer which it sounds like you are. Then from there it’s making the best of the not ideal (to her) choices that she has left.

I think your DH and you should talk to her asap about this - especially as she is getting her house valued. We also tried my DMum moving in with us (at 91) it just didn't work. We both work FT out the house so she was very lonely, she couldn't open the door or windows, she wouldn't meet anyone, we spent money having the house adapted but eventually she moved into a home as it just didn't work for many reasons. She is actually much happier there than she was with us - so there are other options that can work better.

OP this is probably not the best idea, but could you go along with it and say she can move in, as a trial for 3 weeks. Hopefully she will quickly realise that it doesn't work.

@HappyDays40 - I suspect she doesn't really believe you don't love her, and I'm sure the relationship you've shared with her all these years speaks of the reality and that deep down she will know this. This is almost certainly her distress talking. At present it sounds as though she'd recently come to terms with the reality of losing her cherished independence, and as soon as that's happened, she's learned the alternative she had in mind hasn't worked out. She's bewildered and afraid, and you're bearing the brunt of that. I've been there too, and I also understood this was in no way my relative's fault.

I'm sure once the dust has settled a bit then she, you and your husband can have a calmer conversation.

Poor woman. And poor you. These are awful situations all round.

I think that's just kicking it into the long grass, and at the point where she has to be told it isn't working, will cause the poor woman even more distress. Best to be honest in these situations from the start, IMO.

@geraniumsandsunshine and do what with my paid job in that time?

I don’t know.

I’m 40. I have three grandparents who are living that are only just late 80s. My mother didn’t have me young for “back then” either (she was 30).

There is no need to do three weeks to see it won't work. Gran has to face reality. Making a little more wiggle room in terms of visit, face time etc is a thing, putting in place help and visiting care home until she finds something not far that works that would be good. Perhaps visiting her more often, or scheduling vacations with her. Compromise has to be found. Putting her in the living room is just furthering the problem and making it bigger. This is going to be very tough. They won't change mind. But "it's for the best and it's the only viable solution" is the mantra.

My last remaining grandparent died at the age of 99 when I was 34. I'm always surprised when people in their 30s talk about their living grandparents until I remind myself women have babies anywhere from 18-45 without anything being unusual, and men continue to father children into their 60s and beyond (whatever we may think about the ethics and wisdom of doing so aside, they do).

I'm not sure why you think the age distribution in your family disproves the age distribution in other families DixonD

Unfortunately this is a huge gamble, and she's entirely as likely to be confirmed in her belief that the op is "being difficult" and "doesn't love her" and is deliberately being horrible if the op (who is her dil - but it's unlikely she'll blame her son, and even if she does nothing is gained) goes out to work and leaves her in the living room unable to get upstairs to the toilet.

Then the elderly lady utterly loses her dignity or perhaps worse - has a fall trying to get upstairs to the toilet on her own, becomes ill from sitting in her own urine and worse, becomes dehydrated from not drinking out of fear of needing the toilet and gets a UTI, which at that age can quickly lead to dementia -like symptoms and physical illness, MIL is hospitalised, social services get involved and questions of elderly abuse are raised...

If the OP and her husband move his mother in for 3 weeks to show her it won't work and carry on as usual with her left to her own devices that's not crazy over-thinking, its a likely scenario.

If, to avoid that scenario, they use annual or other leave and take it in turns to be home with her then it'd be counterproductive as she'd get the impression it'll all work out just fine!

"Don't know" what? You don't know if you believe that a couple with a 6 year old can have a parent in their 90s? Men can father children at any age, therefore they could have a parents past 100 and it still wouldn't be particularly surprising.

LookingForTipsNotPuns · Yesterday 12:35
Put her in a home.“

Good luck with that!
You can’t just “put” someone of sound mind in a home if they don’t agree.

Trying to deal with someone who is physically frail but mentally sound who refuses outside help is incredibly difficult.

This thread is heart-breaking and so stressful because there is no easy answer. It makes one wonder about one's own last few years on earth and what they will look like. 😥If there were affordable assisted living near your house which would facilitate frequent visits, that would be ideal. I hope you can work something out with her.

Trying to deal with someone who is physically frail but mentally sound who refuses outside help is incredibly difficult.

It really is. And the barrier to getting help for someone physically OK-ish and mentally frail, but plausible enough in brief bursts when denying there's a problem, is also very difficult.

Been there, got three different t-shirts, by now.

It's all very well to say 'plan beforehand' (and indeed DD has already started to thrust Retirement Home leaflets at her not very aged parents). But we'd quite like to spend most of our retirement doing noisy, antisocial hobbies, and I'm not sure anywhere would want to take several animals, a range of brass instruments and a drumkit.

I am so sorry you are in this situation. My own dm truly does not realise that whenever she stays with us all normal life ie work, social life, everything, down to what we cook and the steps we take in the garden either goes on hold, or is moderated and supervised because of the risk. I know that to her it feels like being part of a family, but in reality, even the dog and the furniture has been rearranged. It's unsustainable for more than a week, and absolutely exhausting.

My DM is turning 80 this year. She lives alone in Spain and I don't even know how to start planning for when she needs more support. She is managing fine at the moment but how long can that realistically last as she gets older? Social care in Spain is practically non existent, families are expected to provide all care.