"All men cheat, you just never find out about it"

[Maryfast]

I'm part of a mixed friendship group who have been friends since school. We went on a night out Saturday night and my partner works away (we've been together 4 years and bought a house last year). He tends to work away for 3 weeks and then be home for 2 weeks.

Anyway, friends were asking how he was and conversation soon turned to how some would never do a relationship that entails being far apart from each other for certain amounts of time. Then conversation turned to trust and I was saying how I can never imagine he'd cheat on me and how lovely he is.

That"s when one my male friends made the comment on the thread title, followed by how all the males he know outside our friendship group have cheated but all the friends never say anything.

I don't believe this to be true at all and I've never imagined my partner cheating. Does anyone else believe in the view that "men have an innate ability to cheat?"

I think it's nonsense

All men? No. But, having worked almost solely with men for decades (and spent a lot of time working away from home) I would say it’s far, far higher than you would imagine. Some try and hide it, be discreet. Some utterly flaunt it and don’t give a shit who knows! The “happily married” ones are the worst too. Personally, I think men have a much greater ability to compartmentalise than women….they put the wife who they do love “in a box” and then what happens on tour stays on tour. It’s “just” sex or whatever.
But, maybe women are the same? None of my female friends have ever admitted to cheating but maybe they are just being discreet?
Either way, I think it’s godawful!!!

And women on work nights-girls nights out-away.
I think cheating is common, for both sexes, women just don't or won't admit it.

All this and yet the only survey mentioned so far suggests that about 80% of men never cheat.

We used to have a works conference each year, officially to thank everyone for their efforts but really it was a piss up (no partners). Arrived Thursday evening and conference Friday meal in the evening and recovery Saturday morning leave after lunch. Thursday evening and Friday evening it was like watching musical bedrooms, Not all but quite a few.

I suspect some men will cheat.
I suspect some women will cheat.
I suspect some men steal.
I suspect some women steal.
I doubt that doing the wrong thing is restricted to one sex.

@ComtesseDeSpair

It’s the patriarchy’s way of keeping women in line and ensuring a man has sexual exclusivity of his property.
Men know the above is all bullshit and made up to keep women in line, aren’t socialised for signing up for it in the same way, and feel far more freedom to acknowledge that sex can just be sex.

This is spot on. Men instinctively realise this as well. They understand that the appearance of fidelity and adherence to its surface rules is very important but that as long as that line is toed, anything else goes. A bit like going to church regularly was a few decades ago.

They don't want to flagrantly insult or upset the person who is raising their kids and doing their washing, cooking and life admin. But underneath most of them are totally clear-eyed about the fact that long-lasting romantic love within a marriage is an oxymoron. It simply isn't possible to sustain long-running desire for the person who washes your pants for decades on end. In an absolute best-case scenario you achieve a mutual respect and friendship but the "romantic" underpinning of marriage which so many women are sold is complete horseshit and men know this.

To be honest I can't really blame them. I would probably feel very much the same if I were a married man. Marriage is a brilliant way of organising family labour and caring for children but it is suicide for the soul.

@RedAppleGirl I'm sure many women do, however the women I've seen doing it is absolutely nowhere near the same frequency as the men.
you only need to walk down the street to see married men making comments at women passing by to see general lack of respect for their relationships, and willingness to look elsewhere is common.

Nearly correct. However unremitted sexual activity ends with children born who have no stable family environment. The children nearly always end up being cared for by the woman. This unrelenting burden is shared by the taxpayer in our country. Or if government support is not available children are either brought up in destitution or they die.

The idea that sex is free from obligation just isn't true. Of course, it's great fun until the lines appear on the test or one catches an std. I know that Dp previous to me had a wonderful time, however, some of these women do persist in reappearing to ask if he is 'ok', (Code for lets shag).

Socially I believe respect for people of either sex in a relationship isn't given, people feel entitled to do as they please. Just look at the 'other' woman thread.
It's the world we all inhabit now, there is no girl code or a ring that means keep away.

Nearly correct. However unremitted sexual activity ends with children born who have no stable family environment. The children nearly always end up being cared for by the woman. This unrelenting burden is shared by the taxpayer in our country. Or if government support is not available children are either brought up in destitution or they die.

This is absolutely true. And for many men, the fact that there is government support for women raising children alone and the fact that more women are economically self-sufficient than every before, is a green light to allow themselves off the hook. Not that they weren't cheating in the past, but they were much more conscious of the jeopardy they were putting their children into by doing so and probably more careful.

I'm not suggesting that government support for single mothers or women being able to support themselves are bad things, btw. I think they are essential in a civilised society and tbh the less women rely on their husbands for financial support the better protected they and their children are.

No, not all men cheat and no, not all woman cheat. I’m sure a lot do, maybe even half. Who knows; but no I don’t agree with this statement

I believe most men do, yes., in one form or another.

Not after 4 years though OP

Not after 4 years though OP

What?! There is no magic cutoff. Some men manage to cheat the night before if not at their own actual weddings!

If someone wants to/has cheated in 4 short years, they will obviously do it again so marry at your peril

But, I am saying, ina lifetime, yes, I think most men will have cheated in one form or another.

I think, in a lifetime, the vast majority of men (and women) will cheat. I think people can go through very long periods where they don't cheat and often when they do, there is a shit storm of circumstances leading up to it, but yes most people will have cheated at some point.

Life's not black and white and I do believe it's perfectly possible to be a basically decent person and to have cheated. Some cheats aren't decent people of course, but cheating alone doesn't make a person bad IMO.

Horribly hurtful when it happens to you, but the perpetrator can still be a perfectly good person making a valuable contribution to human life.

Which streets are you walking down?!

And a comment, whilst obnoxious, is hardly infidelity

To assume the half of the human populace with XY chromosomes has more of a propensity to cheat than the XX half is naive in the extreme.

That a male can say this - much less actually believe it - is revealing of an ingrained misogyny that assumes only men have sexual needs, and that women are merely receptacles for those needs. As attitudes go, that one is pretty revolting.

I'm betting the kind of man who trumpets this would be the first to be appalled should their partners happen to cheat on them.

@Creasedlinen if you don't mind your partner making leary sexual remarks to other people that's fine and your own boundaries. but for most people it would certainly be cheating.

I think women typically have far more opportunity to cheat, because even if they don't get frequent offers, most would be able to find a willing man very easily if they wanted to. I think this probably makes cheating seem less desirable, as its not some irresistible chance, too rare to pass up. Turn one down and there'll be another along soon enough if you change your mind.
Men on the other hand are less likely to be presented with the opportunity, and often talk about how flattering they found it to be on the recieving end of another woman's interest, as particularly after a certain age, that happens very rarely for them.
There are other men, like the OPs friend, who are aspiring cheats. They actively pursue other women and work very hard at every opportunity to find one. With these it's largely a numbers game. Put enough time in and eventually they get lucky. I've yet to come across a female equivalent of this type. Again, probably because women wouldn't need to do this.

It is not niave, it is realistic.

Who is looking after the baby/child? What percentage are women what percentage are men?

How many heterosexual men are sex workers?

How many women go after younger, easy manipulated men?

I don't know about 'cheating'. It would certainly indicate an attitude toward females I find completely unacceptable, to the extent that should I ever find out about it, it would be an immediate deal-breaker.

'Not my Nigel' is a thing, though, apparently. And women have been known to stick by men who are irrefutably proven - trial and conviction - to have done horrible things against another person's consent. The media is full of them.

They can actually lie down with a proven rapist, coercer, even child molster. There are many documented cases of it.

I really, really can't compute it.

*naive
Agree wholeheartedly with @5128gap

I travelled at least once a week in my late 20[s/30[s. Completely normal, happily married family men (some still good friends) threw all morals out the window when away with work (women too, but less so) they got home... did not think about it again.

In addition to previous post - to my mind overriding someone's consent, even to the extent of being a heckler/sex pest to random women in public, is worse than sexual infidelity with a consenting partner.

Well my partner doesn't and neither do any of my male friends, even the ones I know do cheat. I don't think there's a correlation.

I'd have to say after working in bars in my youth, most of the "family" guys that came in and pleasantly socialised with their wife were completely different when they came in on their own and their wives would have been shocked and yes most of them had confessions of infidelity but I don't believe all the stories were true but they seemed to want their friends to think they were cheats and want all available woman to know they were willing to.

There's definitely a correlation between leery behaviour and likelihood of cheating.
Some men are simply way more interested in women than others. You can easily pick them out if you observe behaviour. In a group of men on a night out you'll see the ones who have little interest in much outside of their beer and interaction with their mates, compared with the ones who's eyes are everywhere, making comments to women, trying to engage them. Its pretty obvious that the man with the greater interest in women is the one more likely to cheat. Not guaranteed to, obviously, but way more likely if he got the chance.
Its exactly the same with a partner. The man who can't walk down the road with you without giving the side eye to every passing female, or hold a conversation with a woman as a person without needing flirting or sex to be on the agenda, will be more likely to cheat due to his heightened interest in women and his poor sense of propriety.

I was away with a group for a sports thing last weekend. Somewhere beautifully sunny (so lots of skimpy clothes) and the beer was very freely flowing.

Only one other woman in the group (and she was with her husband). The men were variously married, in long term relationship and single.

There was lots of drunken conversation about sex, including some occasions when they had to be "told" about their comments regarding passing young women, but AFAIK no one actually had any sex with the wrong person. Certainly no one came on to me.

That said, I do know for a fact that at least 2 of the men have been previously unfaithful, although they have unhappy tales about the circumstances that led to it. So, I think most people will cheat in their lifetime, but I don't think most are at it all the time.

I do think lots of men make lecherous comments, but I don't think they necessarily mean it and would run a mile if the women were a real possibility for them. The men I was with genuinely thought they were admiring beauty rather than causing harm.