To think there’s nothing wrong with quiet children?

[LydiaBennetsUglyBonnet]

Just had my parents evening for DD (9).

I was told “She’s very quiet” and they want her to speak up and raise her hand more. Very much spoke about ‘being quiet’ like it’s a bad thing.

It pisses me off because what exactly is wrong with not being some ostentatious gobshite of a child? She is far from shy - she will stick up for herself, place her own order in a restaurant etc. but she isn’t loud and doesn’t say things unless there’s a need to say them. There are a lot of overconfident kids in her class and she doesn’t wanna be like that. She’s been the same since she was a toddler. She’s very aloof and much more one to stand back and observe rather than pile on. She doesn’t get it from me, I’m an extrovert, but I’d never expect her to be the same as me so I encourage her to go the flow.

AIBU to get really pissed off when people describe quiet people in a negative way, like it’s a flaw?

I did say i don’t see what wrong with being quiet it’s who she is and I don’t think she needs to change, the teacher practically recoiled in horror 🙄

This is exactly my DD. She takes stock of the situation before speaking rather than blurting out what she thinks (like I do!)

I don’t think there’s anything wrong with being quiet but I think it’s good for kids to be supported so they can raise their hand and join class discussion.

Thinking of it the other way - there’s absolutely nothing wrong with being a reserved or more quiet person but it’s not ideal to sit silently in team/group meetings at work, is it?

I wonder if your DD is picking up on your distaste for children who aren't quiet?

Where have you got this from?! What a weird thing to say

I also wouldn’t draw some binary between ‘quiet child’ and ‘ostentatious gobshite.’ Because I’m sure you wouldn’t like to hear your child described as a ‘wet little wallflower’ or ‘dull nothing to say’ etc. The fact is some kids are more out there, others more reserved. Teachers try to support all of them so that it isn’t just the more confident kids railroading the class discussion. Hard to stem any ‘ostentatious gobshites’ when they need to talk because your quiet child isn’t participating.

Agreed and also they may be quiet at school but not at home or with their friends.

Oh i had this at school. Guidance teacher even wrote it in my UCAS letter. I firmly told her that I’m not quiet or shy. But in class, I’m listening to the teacher, as I’m there to learn, and it would be rude to chat while the teacher is teaching.

Im actually an extrovert but did keep quiet in class

Maybe calling them ostentatious gobshites is a clue!

I don’t think the teacher has told op her daughter needs to chat more while teachers are talking. She’s said she doesn’t raise her hand to participate in class discussion. Which is a totally different situation. If you’re there to learn engaging with all learning opportunities would be ideal.

My answer, which I've given many, many times.

"She is quiet- so what are you doing to make sure she doesn't get forgotten?"

There is a difference between being a gobshite and showing interest/participating in class.

I hate gobshite children and adults who constantly demand attention from others (and drain them in the process). Your daughter is far better as she is.

Not read all the responses…because I got so annoyed I needed to respond!

Im an introvert and therefore quiet. At school I was often seen as quiet and it was assumed I lacked confidence… I don’t! And didn’t! … but having the world say you do is a horrible self fulfilling prophesy!

We are who we are, l was also a quiet child, now a quiet adult, the problem l find is that it can be viewed as a negative, but l refuse to pretend to be something l' m not. Society seems to celebrate the forced fake kind of enthusiasm often adopted by tv presenters and the like, where as l find it very wearing.

Yeah, this.

And tbh, it sounds like they want her to participate more. There's nothing wrong with suggesting that.

The way you've come steaming into your thread, you're obviously really angry and been quite nasty. You need to calm down and realise that 'quiet' isn't an attack on your daughter's character.

"It pisses me off because what exactly is wrong with not being some ostentatious gobshite of a child?"

Can your DD Make her needs known to an adult if she has a problem? Is her quietness causing difficulties for the adults in the class because she's sitting with a broken pencil and not writing anything or asking for a pencil sharpener?

Or is the class teacher just making an observation that she is quiet, and not putting herself forward to voluntarily answer questions? I which case, it's just an observation by the teacher, which you seem to agree with, but not agree with the teachers perspective on whether it's a positive or a negative.

Order

No you can't "force" someone to be comfortable, but you would be doing them a disservice if you didn't encourage them to try to participate more, because it is important in life - in so many jobs, but also in life generally, not just work.

Just the same as, in the post you are replying to you can't "force" someone to enjoy doing maths, but it is still the role of the teacher to encourage them to practice, in the safe environment of the classroom, so they leave school with as many skills as possible, at as high a level as possible. Be that at maths, spelling, drawing, catching a ball, signing a descant, making a crumble, making a bookcase, solving a problem, or participating in debate, or having the confidence to make an observation, offer an opinion, or ask a question.

I'm not sure I agree with all of that. There are lots of people who just don't feel comfortable speaking out in front of lots of people, especially if there's a chance they might not be correct. I don't think it has to hold you back in life. This is all on the proviso that you ARE able to assertively communicate in smaller groups and 1:1.

For example, in the workplace, there are lots of people who aren't comfortable vocalising their thoughts in large meetings but make really valuable contributions in smaller groups.

I was a manager and I had staff who were brilliant in our team meetings (I had a small, close-knit team of 8). However, in larger departmental meetings there's not a chance they'd open their mouth.

I do agree that it's desirable to encourage children to participate and put up their hand etc but this absolutely should be voluntary. None of this picking on names in class or pulling a lolly stick out of a hat. These tactics cause genuine distress and anxiety for some children. And if there's a child that's making active and positive contributions to the class in other ways but doesn't feel able to put up their hand, I disagree vehemently with them not receiving the same accolades. You're effectively punishing a child for their personality, and for being anxious - and that surely can't be right?!

If you can't speak in front of a small group of people, then I can see how that could be really problematic for both work, and life in general. But not being able to put your hand up and speak in front of 30+ people? I don't think that's an essential life skill. Useful? Yes, absolutely. But definitely not vital.

And obviously, there is the issue of SEN. Autistic people often find it excruciating to speak out in front of large groups. It's not a deficiency, it's a difference. I know there's not the issue of SEN with the OP, but it's the wider principles. Children with SEN who don't like to participate in class discussions due to anxiety but are fantastic in smaller groups shouldn't be seen as "less" or "failing essential skills". It's an incredibly ableist approach to suggest that everyone MUST speak up.

Maybe if more children were encouraged to step outside their comfort zone on a regular basis, then there would be fewer of the people on MN who couldn't possibly do so many things "because of their anxiety".
Before everyone piles in, I am not talking about the relatively small number of people who have medically diagnosed anxiety - I realise how crippling that is. I am talking about the many, many MNers who have never been taught that it is okay to feel nervous, or anxious in some situations - we all do, it is a normal and natural response but it is something you learn to deal with and step outside your comfort zone. It is the responsibility of parents teacher and other adults to help children learn that, and learn how to manage their nerves.

Yanbu. Quietness is lovely. Introverts are constantly underestimated and undervalued. Crippling shyness on the other hand should probably be addressed ( but not by force). There is no world in which their approach is helpful.

My DD was described as quiet from a young age (she wasn’t quiet at home!). I really appreciated the comments from a couple of experienced teachers. Her preschool teacher said the other kids charge into every situation without thinking, your DD stops, thinks and makes her own choice, even if everyone else is doing something else. You’ll appreciate that when she’s a teenager and everyone else is getting into a car with a drunk driver.

Then her yr 5 teacher who said that many of the other kids loved the sound of their own voices but that when my DD raised her hand she always had something insightful to contribute. Those kinds of teachers empower ‘quiet’ children to feel more confident about their personalities.

I've been a teacher for a very long time. Kids aren't divided into quiet, well-behaved ones and gobshites. There is nothing wrong with being a quiet child, but neither should a quiet child be seen as inherently well-behaved and hard-working just because they are quiet.

The problem with quiet children in the classroom is that it's harder to assess how they are progressing. Participation is important. Work on paper isn't everything. In a subject like mine (languages), speaking is 25% of your grade at GCSE. Lots of subjects involve discussion and expressing your understanding and ideas.

I get annoyed about this too - quietness doesn't need to be pathologised in itself. It could be part of a larger issue if the child is unassertive/underachieving/short of friends, but if everything else is OK there's no reason to see quietness as an issue.

Literally every parents evening I had ever been to for DD until year 10 almost every teacher commented how shy and quiet she was and how they'd like her to put her hand up in class or contribute to class discussions. But I think YABU to say the alternative is being a wee gobshite. There's a whole range in between!

She's year 12 now. She did very well in GCSEs (all 8s and 9s) but I have to say I do worry about the next few years and going to uni because she's still really shy. She absolutely hates talking to people, even neighbours who we know well, (she'll actively avoid saying hello/how are you in passing). I'm trying to help her apply for some pt jobs to hopefully improve her confidence. While being quiet, of course, isn't a bad thing, I think things are a bit easier if you have a little more self assurance or confidence.

I could have written your post, my DD exactly the same exactly how you described, first time in a parent's evening last year, y12 she was- her psychology teacher made the same comment so I am used to it, ignoring but then she said it is not only her, other girls are also so she isn't the only quite one in the lot then she said it is just if your daughter spoke a bit more that other girls could benefit from her- I thanked her many times

I think teachers do need and appreciate some engagement though (remember my dad dreading the odd “dead” class he had). If they all sit there mutely that could be a real struggle!

Dd2 aged 13 has been praised recently for engaging and answering questions as she is seen as cool so if she joins in with the lesson apparently so then do the others !