Bizarre incident on train...

[Redqueenheart]

I had a rather unpleasant experience on my way home today on the London tube and I wonder how other people would have reacted.

I was sitting in a tube carriage and looking at images and videos I had taken from an art exhibition I visited earlier. Was really tired and just wanted to mine my own business.

A man comes in and seats next to me, fidgeting and getting a bit too close for comfort. I ignore him.

He then asks me ''What is that?''. I realise he is now looking at my phone and expects me to tell him what the picture I am looking at is.

I snap back ''That is my phone and there is something called privacy''.

To my surprise two young women who were sitting on the other said of me get involved and say ''that was rude, he was only asking you a question''.

At that point I had enough and said something in the line of ''My pictures are private and none of your business'' and moved to a different seat on the other side of the train. Heard the girls snigger but there was no more interaction after that.

I really don't get why on earth the guy thought it was OK to barge into my space and then start staring at my phone and demand my attention and why these two women actually thought it appropriate to defend him...

Afterwards I did ask myself if this was an attempt to distract me while one them would try to get something from my bag but even as it stands I was absolutely furious about these people's behaviour.

I am quite curious to hear how other people would have reacted.

Given the amount of pearl-clutching on this thread about the apparent rudeness of the words "'That is my phone and there is something called privacy'' on this thread, may I respectfully suggest, OP, that if this type of thing occurs again you just say "Fuck off, wanker" and really earn the title of Rudest Woman Ever?

Conniptions would abound I'm sure.

We need to normalise "rudeness" from women to predatory men.....the more we push back the less they are able to get away with.

Confused162 I think you really are confused. How was she rude? The person leaning over and looking at her phone was the rude one FFS! And the two girls who interfered were out of order and wrong to say that she was the rude one. I would have got off at the next stop and got into another carriage or walked through the carriage to another one.

I can’t believe all the weird answers on here. They must have a screw loose. Of course it was bloody rude of the weirdo to get too close and lean over and look at your phone and ask you questions. He had a fecking cheek.

I had a horrible experience about four years ago after visiting my sister in hospital. I had a long train journey with at least two trains to get home. I was in the first carriage, which was totally empty, and someone came in and sat opposite me. This immediately made me uncomfortable because he had the whole carriage to choose a seat from. He was an Asian guy of about 30 or less and I was 67. He then proceeded to sit next to me and then leant over to me and said “kiss me”. I said NO! He then said sorry and I got up and walked through to the next carriage. I decided to get off at the next stop even though I had a long way to go, but when I was waiting by the doors I looked through the window at the end of the carriage and saw that he was getting off at that station, which freaked me out even more, so I then sat down. I then walked through until there was a carriage that had women in and not just men. It made me worried to go on a train again. but I have been on a train lots of times since then.

I just tried to find the tiktok video of a young girl in Liverpool being harassed & intimidated by a man on the bus. She is helped by a group of very loud girls who shout, video and hassle him until he leaves. Or as the PPs on here would have it, "were very rude to an innocent man who was only trying to be friendly and probably had LD".

Sadly I couldn't find it among the MILLIONS and MILLIONS of videos and news items about girls and women assaulted and harassed on public transport.

Honestly "RUDE" ffs. Have a word with yourselves.

To the poster who recommended the 'Railway Guardian' app.

A million thanks to you for the single-handed most valuable piece of information on this thread. Every lone female traveller would be well advised to download it. There IS a problem on trains at the moment; this observation is not just anecdotal.

To any women posting here, who are perhaps in two minds about this situation, or who think rudeness/selfishness are the least desirable attributes in a female, and/or don't know that MRAs are all over this sight like a rash. Reread through a few pages, and ask yourself precisely who stands to gain from women having the brass neck to maintain their personal boundaries. Consider that men won't generally approach lone women other than in an innocuous sense: 'morning', if they happen to be next to you in a reserved seat, or 'do you know if they've changed the platform for the London to Plymouth?' A decent man wanting an exchange of pleasantries approaches another man, or someone who isn't on their own. A decent man takes the cues when a lone woman makes it clear she doesn't want a conversation.

If you're awake, you'll be convinced. Once seen can't unsee.

site like a rash, that should read. Not sight. My eyes do not have spots.

You asked how others would react to this experience then go on to be verbally aggressive to everyone who thinks you over reacted....maybe don't ask if you don't want to know. Because not everyone reacts aggressively, it doesn't mean we are oppressed or making excuses for a weirdo. I don't think what he did was weird....you do...so guess it was your call. If you react aggressively you tend to get the same back.

She didn't over react and she hasn't been verbally aggressive to anyone here.

What he did WAS weird, and if you don't know that, I fear for your ability to keep yourself safe and teach your children appropriate behaviour.

A man got too close to a random woman and made her uncomfortable, and you are telling her she was wrong to be unhappy about that, and say so. Re-calibrate, and fast.

@R0BYN ·
[This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request]

Thank you for sharing this. It actually made me go teary as I read it.

I completely agree with you about having ZERO TOLERANCE and refusing to accept the idea that women must always put the comfort and needs of men above their own boundaries in the name of being ''nice''.

A stranger making friendly conversation on a train is one thing, looking over at someone’s phone and then asking them about their personal photos is another. It is intrusive behaviour and was quite rightly unwelcome. I don’t agree the behaviour to then ask about the photo was reasonable. I don’t agree that giving any vague details about it being an exhibition is wise as it then leads to more questions. In hindsight just saying ‘ just my private photos’ in a neutral adult tone and then put your phone away in your bag may have prevented the defensive girls. I don’t know ages or whether perhaps also their response is a generation thing. Some people share so much these days to millions via social media - perhaps that’s normal to them ?

People do use phones for work purposes also so overlooking could mean seeing something confidential to that organisation or private details about someone. It’s entirely different to just starting up a friendly chat.

I imagine you are not normally a rude person but reacted the way you did as you were a bit shocked and this was your first instinctive response which is understandable. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. Just let it go now.

Actually I want to apologise for my ‘let it go now’ comment. It sounds dismissive as clearly OP you came on here to get a sense of the boundaries in this situation. I’ve also reflected a bit more on perhaps how I have probably normalised how I think a woman ‘should’ respond in this situation in an ideal world. Ie don’t be rude , behave as an adult , don’t escalate . It all does feel so minimising.

Sitting too close - rude.
Nosing at someone’s phone - rude.
Making a comment about what you seen - really rude.
Getting all touchy when told to mind your own business - also rude.
OP you were not rude. That guy had already broken several (unspoken) “rules” about how we behave on public transport. Serve him right.

Why should women have to suffer this invasion of privacy. Convention on tube/train is NOT to interact .

Thanks OP for running this thread so long. Clearly this discussion is very much needed. Women have right to perform their boundaries.

But the judgement was that "tge OP finds men creepy". Not "some" men, apparently "all" men!! That is patronising in the extreme, why shouldn't she answer!!

Thanls for posting this, it's so encouraging.

Just read that, it's so depressing it makes me want to cry. We always have to be scared and ready for danger, don't we? :'(

What if you DO look someone in the eye....so what???

I wonder if he had a hidden disability? Being direct and not understanding social boundaries can often go along with these conditions.

The whole thing sounds a bit OTT. I think if it were me, I'd have mumbled something and moved off if he was intimidating. Ridiculous to have your whole way of life dictated by the fear a man is going to look at a picture on my phone while on the tube.

This, and thank you, R0BYN, very well expressed. And very sorry that you had those experiences, and got shut down, gaslighted, no support, poor man - yeah, same here. Same with so many women and girls.

It was not the OP woman being rude. It was the man being an arsehole.

The OP wasn't aggressive to the intrusive man, she just made it clear he should back off. She didn't tell him to fuck off, call him a cunt.

If you didn't think he was weird or at least unpleasantly bothering the OP then I think there's something wrong with your social radar.

Actually what she got by being assertive, was exactly what she wanted, he stopped bothering her. As countless women have testified, often playing nice is what ends up with certain men being aggressive back.

Yes because mumbling to someone who is intrusive and ignores social cues works so well 🙄.

She's not having her whole life dictated by fear. She just put some annoying little man back in his box.

It’s interesting there was a thread on here recently from an OP who’s son (I think just 15 or almost 15) was in a group who were hassling one of the groups GF for a nude “flash” on a FaceTime/video call. The girl, in the end “showed them something” to get them to stop. This isn’t even F2F it was remote. Why didn’t she just get off the phone, why didn’t she assert herself and tell them to F Off….. because of the people on here who think she owes politeness, kindness, conversation, a negotiation. When she should have been taught to do what the OP did and is teaching her daughters, which is that the second she feels uncomfortable, the second her boundaries, whatever they are to her, are over stepped she has every right to say NO. No explanation, no justification just NO. That situation is not even the end game when we teach girls to “be kind”, be the appeaser, be polite instead of trusting their instincts and taking whatever steps they need to stop/end the situation. More importantly they need to know they will not be judged for doing so… Which is what is so shocking about this post, the judgement that OP firmly saying NO based on her boundaries is somehow “rude” and the message that sends young girls about the importance of their boundaries and feelings over others. It’s so so incredibly dangerous, and if that means my daughter isn’t the one in a million who meets her “spouse” on public transport because she’s brave not polite then that’s a risk I’ll take quite frankly.