Too old, too fat?

[WoofWoofMooWoof]

I need somewhere to rant. I went for a job interview today at my DC's school - they know me there. I do what I can to help the school out whenever I am able. It is an Ofsted outstanding school and I've always had the biggest respect for the teachers there.

There are two positions and they only interviewed three people. It was an 'interview day' where we had a tour of the school, met the team etc, and were then interviewed separately. The whole thing took three hours. Me and another lady did the interview day together and the third lady was interviewed later, after school, so I didn't get to meet her. The other lady and I had quite a bit of time alone together in the staff room and we chatted a lot. She owned a restaurant which she sold to open a wine bar, and she only wanted the job so she wouldn't be bored during the day when the bar isn't open. She's never even been to the school before. I am a single mother desperate to find a job so I can feed my kids who are pupils at the school.

However, I am 51 and fat, and she's in her 40s, pretty and slender.

I thought the interview went very well (despite me having bad side effects from my second Covid booster earlier in the week).

Got a phone call from the head teacher this evening saying that I am employable, but I was unsuccessful because the other candidates were stronger and had experience working in a school. This despite the fact that I have 32 years admin experience and the other lady owns a bloody wine bar!

AIBU to be totally pissed off at him blatantly lying to me? To me it's very obvious they've decided to hire the younger, prettier model?

AIBU to have lost all respect for the school and the head?

You're 51 - so for a start, you're not 'old' by any objective standard.

While it's undeniably a fact that looks can also affect people's perception, there's no reason to believe that you are also not lovely looking.

Describing yourself as 'old & fat' is speaking to your own self-esteem & self-belief, which would impact on how you come across.

In the end, the decision is likely to be based on how you came across rather than anything as superficial as looks.

Ask for feedback and take it genuinely on board

I’m so confused why you think owning a business is inferior to admin experience, I own a business and I do admin, accounts, customer care, hr, h&s, sales, purchasing plus the actual business work and everything in between.

my business operates during the day, if I wasn’t so knackered and applied for an evening job, to pass the time, I don’t see what would be negative about that.

im sorry you didn’t get the job, but I think you are underestimating the skills of the other lady.

OP, there are three other things.

1. you clearly have quite strong opinions. Nothing wrong with that but a school is a relatively small team, so maybe they thought you wouldn't fit personality-wise.
2. You said you are 'desperate for a job'. Desperation never comes across well, even if you tried to hide it.
3. Maybe they didn't want a parent of one of their pupils.

Also bear in mind that 20% of appointments aren't successful and if you came a close third, and you now don't make a fuss and act all bitter, they may yet come back to you and ask if you are still interested.

Be magnanimous and cheerful, and earn their respect.

This. You have no idea what she told them in interview.
I was involved in the recruitment process in my last company and we had this a few times ~ one manager especially liked to make offers before reference had been checked 🙄.
So we had a few of his not pass probationary ( And in one case, not last until lunchtime) , then any good candidates who were further down the list would be considered.

Isn’t it possible that neither you nor she were appointed, and one of the posts was offered to someone who was interviewed on a different day?

The ‘employable’ comment sounds poorly worded, but could be a way of telling you that you ‘passed the board’ - I’m in the public sector and when we recruit we give candidates a grade, appointing the one with the highest grade, but our grade C means that we would appoint you (below the line means we wouldn’t). If the first choice candidate turns the job down, we can offer to another person who passed the board, or if the same job comes up within 6 months we can do the same. So it might be their way of telling you you’re in this category.

Maybe they thought you were overqualified?

I feel for you though. I hope you find a job soon.

This is kind of my point though - she has never been employed and yet the head told me both the other candidates have previous experience working in schools.

Do you know it’s her? Perhaps they interviewed someone else at another time. We usually end up fitting in another couple of candidates in different days.

Also, they may not want to employ a current parent. Its a tricky situation for both employer and employee.

I think working in a bar is excellent experience, dealing with kids is often like dealing with drunks!

You have zero idea about the third lady so it's possible she got offered it?

I have worked in a school office and we would not be at all keen to employing a office admin per who has children at the school as there is so much confidential information about other parents and children.

Of the woman they appointed wants the job just to pass time she is in for a horrible shock. School admin jobs are not easy. They expect blood for peanuts.

Running a business will have given that lady extensive skills- I’d say she’s actually really suited to the position, which was their assessment as well.
Ask for constructive feedback, work on it, then apply for something else. It’s all helpful, whether you get the job or not.

Read the OP

Do you imagine owning a winebar is just that. You own it and the ££ roll in?

Rather than the transferable skills of admin - ordering stock and ensuring everything arrives in time so you have enough to sell, doing the accounts, VAT returns, HR - recruiting and being up-to-date with all the current legislation with regard to employing people. Keeping the place up to current Health & Safety legislation, I presume they sell food so the accompanying Hygiene Certificate knowledge, keeping records and ensuring you have the correct licences for the sales of alcohol (our primary makes ££££ on alcohol at events by running licenced bar). Then just general stuff like timekeeping, customer service /friendly nature - a beaming smile to meet and greet is the norm for a winebar (is your chip on your shoulder obvious? I suggest get some career coaching), the art of delegation - I presume she has sufficient competent staff she has recruited and trained?

Bit harsh. Men give jobs to younger/prettier the world over. Its not exactly shock news. Its both well researched and reported on, aswell as known anecdotally.

My first thought is because you have children at the school and actually they know you.

I did tell them before the interview that I was having side effects and I might not be my best.

I have a splitting headache, brain fog and I ache all over. My DC also have flu so I'm probably in the early stages of that also.

I'm really confused by this. You said the head teacher told you the other 2 candidates had experience of working in a school. You said one woman had zero experience of working in a school. Why are you calling the head teacher a liar? OK so she currently runs a wine bar but that doesn't mean she didn't work in a school before!! Maybe she was a very impressive candidate - school experience and experience of running a business (which requires many skills). I really think you're jumping to conclusions to assume this is because you're old and fat. If you'd gone for a job in a bar then yes, I wouldn't be surprised if they chose a young, pretty candidate for the job. But a school receptionist? I think looks would be pretty irrelevant. Our school receptionist is in her 60s and a larger woman and she's excellent. Extremely professional and competent. I worked in another school and again the receptionist was older and overweight. I just don't believe a school would prioritise some attractive lady for this role. It's quite a demanding role and they need someone capable with experience and excellent interpersonal skills. I'm sure you have these skills too but it seems the other 2 women were better qualified.

It would surely be helpful to ask for feedback on your interview performance. As a qualified therapist I'm sure you are aware of the value of learning, reflection and feedback.

If you feel this is true, the answer is lose the weight!

It's in your hands if you feel this is stopping you getting a job.

I am old and fat.
I understand where you are coming from but, if an employer has a choice of candidates, all with the experience and ability to do the job, then it ultimately comes down to ‘who they want to work with’.
Remember, if you are not for them, they most definitely are not for you.

Maybe you all had similar skill levels and they just gelled more with her and thought she'd slot into the team more easily. If you have to work closely with someone that can be an important factor. Also the fact that she doesn't need the job could have meant she was much more relaxed at the interview. I interviewed recently for a job that I didn't really have experience for but I did have some transferable skills. I already had a job but this one had better hours and would mean a better work life balance. I went to the interview quite relaxed as I didn't need the job and I wasn't confident that I'd get it. The interview went really well as we ended up chatting for an hour and I think that was the reason I got the job.

Being older and overweight are two potential reasons, but that are further down the list of the potential reasons why they didn't offer you a job.

Maybe they decided that they actually didn't need two staff and only offered 1 role, to the person you didn't see. The fact that they gave them special allowance and interviewed at a later time and without the visit of the school mean they might be someone already working there or very familiar with the school.

You mentioned that you've interviewed for a number of jobs and didn't get any. Maybe you don't interview as well as you think. I've carried many interviews in my career and quite a few were very surprised when I gave them feedback and didn't agree with my points.

There could be many other reasons you are not aware of. What matters is not to focus your mind on potential ones you can't do anything about as that will just beat you up. Instead focus on what you can improve. Ask to meet with the Head (assuming he was part of the panel) and ask for pointers on how to improve yourself so that you are more than 'employable'.

In the meantime, give yourself a break. You are entitled to be very disappointed and confused. Let yourself feel sorry for yourself, just not too long and then work on a list of actions. Good luck OP.

OP I really don't think it was her age or slimness, schools aren't really a hot bed for that kind of behaviour. It feels more like you feel you've helped out the school a lot, and are under pressure as a single parent, so felt you deserved it more. Deserving it more, sadly, isn't what gets a person a job, it's best fit for the job that counts, alongside experience and so on. Please don't let sour grapes at not being chosen colour your opinion if the school itself as you were happy with it up til now. Good luck on finding another job!

Perhaps they aren't keen on employing someone with kids at the school?

My dad was a headmaster at a school (admittedly a long time ago) that had a deliberate policy of not employing parents of pupils

You sound like you’ve done a lot of different things which would make me wonder about your ability to stick at things, your commitment and whether you’re exaggerating your experience. You say you’ve owned your own business, worked extensively in admin (listing various jobs), had a career break and are a therapist. I don’t know about the other things but to be a therapist would take at least three years for the training and presumably you’re saying you’ve worked as one which adds more time.