Too old, too fat?

[WoofWoofMooWoof]

I need somewhere to rant. I went for a job interview today at my DC's school - they know me there. I do what I can to help the school out whenever I am able. It is an Ofsted outstanding school and I've always had the biggest respect for the teachers there.

There are two positions and they only interviewed three people. It was an 'interview day' where we had a tour of the school, met the team etc, and were then interviewed separately. The whole thing took three hours. Me and another lady did the interview day together and the third lady was interviewed later, after school, so I didn't get to meet her. The other lady and I had quite a bit of time alone together in the staff room and we chatted a lot. She owned a restaurant which she sold to open a wine bar, and she only wanted the job so she wouldn't be bored during the day when the bar isn't open. She's never even been to the school before. I am a single mother desperate to find a job so I can feed my kids who are pupils at the school.

However, I am 51 and fat, and she's in her 40s, pretty and slender.

I thought the interview went very well (despite me having bad side effects from my second Covid booster earlier in the week).

Got a phone call from the head teacher this evening saying that I am employable, but I was unsuccessful because the other candidates were stronger and had experience working in a school. This despite the fact that I have 32 years admin experience and the other lady owns a bloody wine bar!

AIBU to be totally pissed off at him blatantly lying to me? To me it's very obvious they've decided to hire the younger, prettier model?

AIBU to have lost all respect for the school and the head?

@JennyJenny8675309 OP, I understand what you’re saying and I agree with you. I’m a little older than you are, never been especially attractive but I have a daughter (24) who is very pretty and gets attention and favours wherever she goes. I’ve watched this for years and it’s definitely not my imagination. It’s a very unfair fact of life that attractive people are treated differently.

Oh Jenny, you sound awfully bitter and jealous about your daughter bring pretty - not an attractive quality. Bad form, Jen

I totally agree. I've never been 'butt ugly', but I've always been the one the pretty friends drag along to make themselves look better lol.

My daughter is still early teens, but she's drop dead gorgeous - flawless porcelain skin, corkscrew curls, huge bright blue eyes. She's going to be able to get things and opportunities in life just by batting her eyelids lol.

That is so funny and just highlights the fact that some people seem oblivious to the fact that good-looking people get more chances in life. It's instinctive I guess, to ensure the survival of the fittest/species and all that. @JennyJenny8675309 doesn't sound bitter and jealous at all - she's just stating a fact. She's probably very proud of her daughter, as I am of my gorgeous DD.

We are rural and there are a lot of jobs in the nearest town, which would mean an hour commute twice a day, and with my autistic daughter I'm kind of stuck to school hours as I can't leave her alone for too long

TBH you seem a bit 'lost' over what to do next with your career.

Hybrid working is now the norm for many jobs so it's not a given you'd go in every day.

Is your DD unable to have a 'child' minder (she's a teenager now?) or go to an after school club?

Being stuck to school hours is really going to limit what you can find because those jobs are like gold dust and lots of parents want them.

You will also find that you are competing with younger mums, whose children are very young.

At 51, most women's children are self reliant , or at uni.

I think you need to sit and seriously re-think what you can do.

You might be eligible for a career loan or grant to develop your own business, or even an overdraft.

Why can't you get full broadband installed?

I accept that looks do come into it, it’s patronising to suggest otherwise. However I am a single mother desperate to find a job so I can feed my kids is not a good vibe to be giving off.

It’s called attractiveness bias and it’s a thing. What you’re saying is possible, especially if it’s a people facing role? I was turned down for a job once and every time I went past afterwards all the female employees looked the same: blonde, slim, etc.

Some companies do prefer a certain look and will turn you down citing other reasons, this is why the discrimination laws aren’t worth the paper they are written on.

However, what I will say is there could have been other qualities the other woman had that the school felt were more suited.

Oh Jenny, you sound awfully bitter and jealous about your daughter bring pretty - not an attractive quality. Bad form, Jen

nasty

Gosh, do you know me? lol

I honestly don't know where to go. The JobCentre is pushing me to get a job and I know I need one, but they are hard to find around here, especially school hours.

DTD1 is OK to leave on her own, but she's going through an extremely aggressive phase and my main worry is leaving her alone with her twin for too long. She has threatened to kill DTD2 in the past, and whilst I obviously hope she won't do anything, and I don't think she will, I really don't want to take that chance. She's mostly aggressive towards me.

We have full broadband but I need an ethernet cable which I'll have to thread through the whole lounge, down the passage and into my bedroom where my 'office' is. Wi-fi and internet here can be spotty. We're not even on the gas grid.

Yes, I've had that a number of times - sorry, you're overqualified and we think you'd be bored in the job. I just wish people would understand I just want a job.

Recruitment costs money, in time and sometimes agency fees. I would not employ someone over qualified as, in my experience, they take the role as a bolt
hole while they look for something else. Waste of time and money.

I don't think I did. One of the questions was: If you find a way to make things run more smoothly but your manager disagrees, what would you do? I said that I wouldn't want to go over his head, but I might present my idea to the team and see what they think about it, and that if the team feels it would work we could all present it to the manager.

Was this a hypothetical question?

If you are equally matched professionally and you don't really know her full work background to say otherwise, then it will just come down to personality fit.
From what you describe she sounds like she was quite friendly and open pre interview, with both you and the assistant head, whereas you do sound like you chippy about your weight and age, in addition to moaning about feeling unwell in the interview, nobody wants to work with Eeyore.
If you are having lots of interviews, then presumably your CV , but your interview technique must be letting you down, so that is something to work on. Practise with friends and get some honest feedback from them.

This answer would be a red flag to me, and would stop me employing you. Your are telling me that if I said no you'd try to get the team to gang up against me. You're interested in getting your own way, rather than collaborating with me.

A better answer, IMO, would be 'I'd be curious and would calmly ask if they could share what concerns he/she had about the idea. I'd then actively listen to learn. If afterwards I though there was still possibility to improve processes I'd ask for a short meeting to further discuss. If they agreed, I'd look to provide alternatives or solutions to their concerns. If they didn't agree I'd respect their decision.

I’m in Cheshire. We have high schools

That is unfair to @JennyJenny8675309 and OP

There is sound academic research to back up what @JennyJenny8675309 has noticed. Certain physical characteristics do affect your likeliness to get hired and what you are paid, all other things being equal. Being fat does harm your hiring prospects, on average. Short men on average also get paid less than tall men, for example.

In many areas of the retail and hospitality industries it is well known that staff are recruited for their looks and size: usually younger, thinner and more attractive is preferred. It might not be legal but it happens.

Hear! Hear!

I agree. You should stop your volunteering role with them . Unless you like having the chance to look the school from the inside?

I agree with poster who said the way you answered the question what you would do if the manager disagrees with your idea is a red flag for a hiring manager.

OP, you must be so frustrated. Why don’t you do your therapist role? it’d give you the flexibility you want? You’ll find the right job for you.

Acknowledge your disappointment and then, move on. Good luck.

I get you @WoofWoofMooWoof. It’s not necessarily the ‘younger and prettier’ thing, it’s the fibbing about why.

I had it recently (and posted here) where I was approached for interview and then had two - and then was declined BY TEXT due to not having enough experience with the base systems the company used.

Except I did. And spent a lot of time talking through how I used them as I knew it was important.

Honestly if they’d just told me they went with a better candidate it wouldn’t have stung so much.

the other lady owned a restaurant and now a wine bar. From what I could tell she's never actually been employed

Running two businesses is harder work than a regular job

💐

That was a poor answer and the fact you've relayed it on here shows you don't even realise with hindsight that it was. I wonder how the younger slimmer candidate answered it?

This is why I wanted to know if it was hypothetical or if they were asking specifically about the person who would be her manager.

If it was hypothetical, she suddenly decided the manager was male and that won't go down too well.

Attractive privilege exists. Also, people make subconscious decisions and could perceive someone who is slim and attractive, well put together one might say, who has run their own business, as someone who is generally more organised, motivated, committed, and able to deal with stress effectively.

Yes, you're right, that's just the way it is.

Yes, I realise in hindsight it was a poor answer 😞- I definitely wasn't 'myself' at the interview.

It was a hypothetical question and I said 'them' and 'they'. I didn't specify gender.