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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Friend called me a Karen

175 replies

cestelee · 06/10/2022 17:07

I was in a coffee shop with my friend and ordered a hot chocolate and some lunch. When the hot chocolate came it was very bitter and had no sugar in it at all.

It took a while (10m) to get the attention of a waitress as they were busy and I very politely told them that I think the barista made a mistake when making it and could they please remake it to be sweet too.

The waitress was very polite, and I thanked them and apologized for the inconvenience. She took the hot chocolate away. Five minutes later she came back and asked me if it were ok to just put sugar in it or if I wanted it remaking.

I knew it would be colder now and the sugar wouldn't dissolve, which is a bit icky, so I thanked her and asked if she could remake it. Waitress was very polite and the new hot chocolate when it came was perfect.

Friend called me a Karen for first sending it back, which she said is rude, and second asking them to remake it instead of putting sugar in it. She never got nasty and said it in jest but was trying to make a point.

My mum is called Karen and I really don't like that phrase. She's invited me for coffee this weekend and I don't want to go now. WIBU?

OP posts:
MistressIggi · 07/10/2022 16:52

Floogal · 07/10/2022 16:00

Is a gammon a male version of a Karen?

There is no male version of Karen.

ReneBumsWombats · 07/10/2022 16:56

According to this thread, he's gammon, Chad, Kevin and one other I can't remember. The only consensus is that nobody knows his race or how he wears his hair.

He doesn't exist. It's just a misogynistic insult for thick people and anyone who didn't understand the purpose of misogynistic insults from the start needs to learn.

AsAnyFuleKno · 07/10/2022 19:00

I thought 'Chad' was an incel thing - what incels call men who can easily attract women, paired with 'Stacey' for the type of woman who is attracted to 'Chad'. In other words, nothing to do with a male equivalent of 'Karen' - an entirely different and unrelated concept.

I agree, the sheer number of suggestions for a male equivalent indicates there isn't one.

Squirrelsnut · 07/10/2022 19:02

I detest the use of Karen as an insult, and I despair how many women think it's acceptable.

ReneBumsWombats · 07/10/2022 19:03

Squirrelsnut · 07/10/2022 19:02

I detest the use of Karen as an insult, and I despair how many women think it's acceptable.

They're not like other girls.

surreygirl1987 · 07/10/2022 19:19

I detest the use of Karen as an insult, and I despair how many women think it's acceptable

Agreed entirely

surreygirl1987 · 07/10/2022 19:29

People are getting so defensive on here. The term ‘Karen’ isn’t to get middle aged women to shut up, it is only aimed at people who complain over every little thing and make themselves out to be a right diva and difficult to deal with

But you're missing the point (or points - there are a few!). The term 'Karen' is being used to silence specifically women. Men can do what they like- but if a woman asserts herself she gets hit with a misogynistic slur. Furthermore, it is not just being used for women who behave like 'divas' as you put it, but for women asserting themselves very reasonably. I got called a Karen for asking a teenager to stop trampling on my 3 year old in a soft play, for instance. When I asked to speak with a manager for being significantly overcharged in a cafe (the till staff member was adamant I wasn't but I clearly was), I heard him mutter something about a 'Karen' - me. Neither of these were unreasonable requests, and it would have been different if I were male (got my money back though - I was charged 3x for one meal!).

Isitsixoclockalready · 07/10/2022 19:33

Has there ever been an era in which so much labelling is used?

NeelyOHara1 · 07/10/2022 19:43

It's Karenist.

EmeraldShamrock1 · 07/10/2022 19:47

Talk to your friend and educate her on why using the name Karen is a offensive.

Sometimes words are thrown out without much thought especially if the person is unaware of the meaning behind certain words.

erikbloodaxe · 07/10/2022 23:07

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

AsAnyFuleKno · 07/10/2022 23:38

erik Your comment makes no sense.

Quz · 10/10/2022 18:42

cestelee · 06/10/2022 17:24

"I don't think she meant it as anything other than a joke but also to get across a point. She said she was embarrassed with me sending the hot chocolate back.

It's not that I never want to be her friend again, its that I feel a bit disempowered and I know I have to address this to move forward but I don't like confrontation."

She intended you to feel disempowered. Knowing that you don't like confrontation (and so have no doubt often given in to her to avoid that), she used a passive-aggressive "joke" to say that her feelings (inappropriate embarrassment, in this case) are more important than whether or not you get what you actually ordered and will be paying for.

Gemcat1 · 10/10/2022 23:16

I hate the term, Karen, as I have friends with that name, and I see it as an insult to them and others with the same name. Having got that off my chest, I agree with the others, your friend was rude to you while you were standing up for the drink that you asked for. Perhaps you should mis-order her a drink and see what she says.

sjpkgp1 · 11/10/2022 00:16

I'm glad I've read this thread, and back to the OP, yes, if you are offended by what your friend has called you, given the "why", I think you could mention it, or just cool the relationship. IRO of the "why" - some people would add more sugar, some people would ask for it to be remade - I guess it depends on the individual and the circumstances - neither should really be a problem. My kids bandy about these terms (karen, dick, snowflake, woke, triggered, cancel to name a few) and I have to admit I have not really thought about them that much other than sometimes asking them what they mean. Often, I suspect they have the deeper meanings wrong (I asked my 25yo (works in service industry) son about Karen and he said "it is someone who complains" then I said "male or female" and he said "could be both" then I said "would you think it had racist connotations" and he said, "no, but maybe I can see originally if that is what you are telling me" then I said would the complaint be reasonable, and he shrugged and said "sometimes yes, sometimes no, maybe a bit fussy" but either way he did not see it as the ultimate insult to break a friendship over. To give the benefit of the doubt, I am not sure your friend has realised what the term means in its fullest sense, and probably didn't realise the offense that has been caused. I hope you find a happy way of sorting things 🌻

yeoldcatlady · 11/10/2022 12:39

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xogossipgirlxo · 11/10/2022 12:47

YANBU. I hate this whole Karen thing and naming everyone this in irrelevant situations like yours. Also don't like the idea that name became an insult.

Thatboymum · 11/10/2022 12:53

But why wouldn’t you just stand up go to the counter and get sugar and do it yourself 🥴

Lndnmummy · 07/03/2023 18:29

MistressIggi · 07/10/2022 00:13

There is no male equivalent of Karen.

Show quote history

We call them Johns in our house

ladywriter1968 · 05/12/2023 16:26

Hi there. I know how you feel. I put up a post on fb. I am someone who isnt a push over and stand up for myself. A friend reply on my wall. You dont want to be a "karen" I had no idea what this meant. So text her and asked. She sent laugh faces. So I looked it up. I reply back and said, I find that quite insultive. She said. Yep, you are a karen. And I reply, and you are a mouse. Been friends with her years and she is quick to "piss take" but dont like it back. She either be a proper friend or not one at all. Just because she is happy to put up with crap thats up to her. Her mate treat her like s... and she still happy to be friends with her. then good luck. Friends of a feather flock together...I dont want to fall out but not gonna be treated that way. Others could see it on my wall. I removed it....

ditalini · 05/12/2023 16:45

Give this a go: https://karenismyname.org/renamer

It's not the worst thing to ever happen in the world for a bunch of teenagers to be using your name as an insult on the Internet, but yes, it's misogynistic, and no, it's not just used for women who "deserve" it.

Empathy Generator

https://karenismyname.org/renamer

CaroleSinger · 05/12/2023 16:48

Us there a particular reason you couldn't have just got up and put some sugar in it yourself rather than all that faffing about?

Fimofriend · 05/12/2023 17:29

I wish I was better st sending food back. I went to a cafe and got a pancake with jam and whipped cream. There was obviously no sugar in the pancake batter and it tasted really bad. Instead of being sweet indulgence it was "Great I have now used up this week's sugar quota and it doesn't even taste like a sweet".
I just never went back to the cafe and have warned others about it. I don't think it would have helped to complain about it as some of my British friends claimed that that's the correct British pancake recipe. Fine, but then call it "flat bread" instead. Cakes contain sugar or sweetener.

ladywriter1968 · 05/12/2023 21:22

I dont blame you. I went into one earlier today as a friend called me a "karen" just makes you wonder who your friends really are. I said, I stand up for self. You are a mouse then. I am angry of it. When told her fiund it offensive she put on my fb wall in a trxt, she reply. Yep. Your a karen. I very nearly told her to get st!!!!!!. Tbh. Its made me feel different toward her now and known her years.

ladywriter1968 · 06/12/2023 23:33

I have fallen out with a friend because of this statement. She called me this on social media because I mentioned about our local council offices had closed down. She lives in another borough so not affected by it.
Its a shame they are using peoples names for insultive purposes against each other. People have become very hateful these days. When I messaged her and said I am offended, she reply with. Yep. You are a karen. I said, and you are a mouse. She thinks she is funny but all she has done is ruin a friendship now. She is rather hypercritical as to saying she follows budism when their beliefs is about peace and kindness to others....

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