AIBU to be wondering if we should be leaving London too?

[KarokeandGin]

We currently live in east London with 3 young children in a 3 bed house. Very happy with our house and whilst the younger two share a room hopefully we will be able to afford to do a loft conversion in a few years so by 7/8 the younger two won’t have to share.

lots of our friends are leaving London and moving to Kent and Essex for the grammar system and more space. Our local secondary school is fine, nothing special but not awful.

AIBU to not really have considered if we should be leaving London too? We are happy here but I do wonder if the extra space and countryside living would benefit the DC. My main concern is moving and not being happy personally (both myself and DH grew up in London) even if it was a better life for my DC. Should I be putting their happiness and potential for a better education first?

YABU - consider going and put your children first
YANBU - continue enjoying the life you have and your children will likely do just as well

dont move to be the same as your friends

i would stay

Personally the pollution, violence were sticking points for me. My countryside house has a nice neighbourhood, regular city access, lots of dirt play (damning streams, scenic pub walk rambles, building shelters & fires)

There is no right answer. Any decision will have upsides and downsides. You just have to weight them up, and it sounds like you’re pretty happy, so I wouldn’t make any rash moves.

Me and DH are both Londoners who stayed in London to bring our kids up. We occasionally had vague notions of ‘living by the sea’ , but neither of us wanted to live in a small town and we’re both realistic that we are not village or rural people at ALL. So we stayed put.

It’s been a good decision for us. My family are close by. Kids went to decent but not outstanding state primaries and secondaries . Both flourished/flourishing (now 18 & 14). Both independent, streetwise, sensible kids. Both love living in London.

Me & DH very glad we didn’t move. We are looking at eventually downsizing in London, and being merry middle aged/oldies who take full advantage of this wonderful city and use our Freedom passes a lot .

I wouldn’t want to live anywhere where I was surrounded by Brexit voters.

I see people saying this but in practice, it's not the same for a few reasons:

The people in Kent usually don't live that close to the station - sometimes a drive away

Again I think this is similar in parts of London though particularly in zones 5/6. I had two friends who lived in different parts of z3 & it was a pain to get them, a good 25 min fast walk to station & no bus route.

Frequency & cost will definitely be different but again parts of outer London are like this anyway & not everywhere even has the tube. But I was only referring to length of journey.

I've always lived in z2/3 & always allowed at least 45 mins for my journey door to door despite having train/tube/bus on my doorstep because there is generally the delays from traffic/people congestion/waiting for a tube etc. My friend in Kent takes similar time to meet (train itself is 20 mins to St Pancreas)

Where do you live @Tomorrowisalatterday?

That friend comes into central London far more than me for recreation.

Plenty of Z6 stations are in Surrey anyway

Zone 3 and no bus route? I would be very interested to know where that is.

Yes of course if you compare zone 6 with the home counties, there won't be much difference - because they are basically right next to each other!

I know you're trying to make it all about exact journey time but my point is that's not everything - cost, frequency and number of options make a difference too. And by and large London is better for that than living outside on a train line.

I live in South London, zone 3. 10-15 mins walk from 2 train stations on different lines, can catch a bus to 3 different tube lines. I can get to most places in London in 45 mins door to door, not just one mainline rail station. I can go to a gig at the 02, the museums in Kensington, my friend's gigs in obscure Islington pubs, etc etc.

I am not saying everyone has to think the same things are important but it's disingenuous to say that there is nothing different about living in London.

We stayed in London and don’t regret it. We visit the countryside lots during school holidays.
Depending on where you go, the reality of living outside London can often mean lots of time spent in the car driving places and not necessarily availing of the extra space on a day to day basis. During the week we’re all super busy with work, school and hobbies so having everything close by that the kids can get to independently is great.

And much the same way that the people who moved out travel in to avail of what London has to offer, we do the reverse and travel out when we need a countryside fix. We’re quite lucky here as there are lots of great parks close by so we don’t feel hemmed in day to day - but sometimes it is nice to get away for a few days.

Not UK based… but we lived just right on the outskirts of Dublin for a very long time. Great transport system, lots of shops etc near by. We moved further out a while back for additional space, bigger garden and nicer house. We haven’t much of a life here tbh. Our dd loves it but we have no friends, there aren’t many options nearby for food/ drinks etc and when dd gets older it’ll be likely she’ll need to be ferried around. Anytime we want to go out one of us needs to drive as the public transport is terrible.

I would stay put if I were you. Nothing wrong with kids sharing a room. Sure didn’t we all when we were younger. 🤷‍♀️

Zone 3 and no bus route? I would be very interested to know where that is.

I didn't say no bus route just no bus route from the station to their house. One was the back of Wimbledon & one was Streatham Common/Norbury way.

I am not saying everyone has to think the same things are important but it's disingenuous to say that there is nothing different about living in London.

I never said that though. I simply made the point that my journey in z3 London is very similar to my friends in Kent. I'm not sure why you having taking umbrage with that 🤷🏻‍♀️

I live in South London, zone 3. 10-15 mins walk from 2 train stations on different lines

Is this South East?

Stay put. Snaresbrook and places nearby like Wanstead, Walthamstow Village, Highams park, Woodford etc are lovely and have plenty of green space.

We live not too far from you, had friends move to the countryside ‘for the kids’. A few years on and they regularly ask to stay at ours in London during school holidays, weekends. Mind you, we get to stay at theirs in return which is nice for a change of scene.

I never said that though. I simply made the point that my journey in z3 London is very similar to my friends in Kent. I'm not sure why you having taking umbrage with that

Because it's two separate points:

If you're talking about meeting in St Pancras and that's where her trains get into, I can well believe that her journey is the same.

But by and large if you're in zone 3, you will be able to get to a variety of different bits of London on average much faster, much cheaper and with more transport options.

I don't really want to put my location on the internet but I am not SE London

Why are people so convinced that a countryside childhood is better than a city one?

I had a mixture. Loved growing up in London until I was 10. Bored to tears in the countryside as a teenager (and also experienced a lot more racism and small-minded prejudice). Got back to London as soon as humanly possible and will never live anywhere other than a big city.

If you think drugs and violence don't exist in the countryside you're very naive.

And tbh after my countryside years I felt at a significant disadvantage when it came to life experience and being streetwise when I got to university, and nearly fucked it up completely because of that. The kids who'd grown up in cities had much more of their shit together at that point.

I just can't think of anywhere in SW that's 10-15 mins walk to two stations but a bus ride to tubes hence why I was curious.

If you're talking about meeting in St Pancras and that's where her trains get into, I can well believe that her journey is the same.

No I said because her journey to St Pancreas is so quick her journey time to meet is usually the same as mine.

But by and large if you're in zone 3, you will be able to get to a variety of different bits of London on average much faster, much cheaper and with more transport options.

I haven't disagreed that travelling from z3 wouldn't be cheaper with more options. I just made the point that some people in Kent have similar journey times to people in London. I also never said all journeys from Kent & Essex are the same as the journeys from z3. I referred to London in general because of course not everyone lives in z3, the op herself lives in z4.

These threads airways descend into a London Vs the provinces battle but of course both have their plus and minus points and there isn't an answer. On any given day I could write easily agree with every one of these posts depending on my mood (except the one about the utopia in Surrey which I kind of don't buy).

The fact is you're happy in London, you grew up in London, and your house is big enough. I wouldn't change that for some fictional notion of what moving out might look like because everyone else is doing it.

If you think drugs and violence don't exist in the countryside you're very naive.

Quite! County lines, anyone?

This sounds more like primary aged activities though. The OP is asking regarding her teens, who I assume are past the den building stage.

Me & DH very glad we didn’t move. We are looking at eventually downsizing in London, and being merry middle aged/oldies who take full advantage of this wonderful city and use our Freedom passes a lot .

This really appeals to me! In my case I feel like the primary years fly by (we are part way through them already) and thereafter London comes into its own once your kids start being more independent and you get more time by yourself / with your partner. (Less taxi service more fun)!

Having said that we are lucky enough to live by one of the best parks in London with some excellent free museums and there have been a wealth of things to do on our doorstep for young DC too.

Horses for courses.

I hated growing up in the countryside however it was racist AF where I grew up and I’m mixed race. I will say there were plenty of drug issues and people knew what everyone was doing. I do not miss that side at all.

You can have an interesting life with lots to do on your doorstep plus countryside in the southern half of the country if you can in my opinion afford to live in places like Bath, Norwich, oxford, Guildford, Canterbury winchester etc

I've lived all over including nicer bits of outer London and the Home Counties can be a shock that it really isn't 24/7 and bus services are often totally rubbish etc .

If you have a decent ish house in a leafy pleasant area but only want to go as far out as Kent or Essex I would stay put. I can't see apart from maybe a slightly bigger house you would gain anything , certainly I don't think your kids would relish it- but by all means ask them

Yes this for me too. Is there a mystical place which is both pretty with a nice town centre and social activities and not full of tories or brexit voters?

asking for retirement!

@Tiredalwaystired Bath! (Lib Dem) Hebden Bridge, Lewes, Norwich , Totnes, Tunbridge Wells(more mixed than you might think, same with Winchester.

Anywhere that's relatively pretty and has a more liberal vibe is inevitably pricey-due to demand!

Read this with interest as we too are in East London (zone 2). DH is keen to move somewhere more rural, but he grew up in London from age 12 onwards (and before that in another big city) so I think his views are a bit idealised. we have a small child who would love country rambling but I think in ten years she'd be bored to death. So we longingly look at huge 5-bed houses with enormous gardens thinking we could swap our narrow 3-bed terrace for one.. and then think, what on earth would we do with extra two bedrooms and a second living room? We'd just have more to clean and more crap!

Why do people regard Kent as countryside and this aspirational place to live? There are a few nice parts but in the main it's a bloody awful county. The UK is an amazing country with so many beautiful and vibrant places to live, there are hundreds of better options!