To think that JK Rowling is a lioness of epic proportions?

[WandaWomblesaurus]

I don't think I'm being unreasonable. She's put everything out there to safeguard children in the face of vile misogyny and cowardice from many of her fellow writers.

She also always has beautiful hair.

NYANBU

YYABUTQ+

From what I understand, it is common for ftm transitioners to use the disabled toilets anyway.

Of course, it would not be appropriate for ftm transitioners to be placed on male hospital wards or in male prisons. It would be very dangerous for an ftm transitioner to be put in such a prison.

Do you think it would be appropriate for a female-bodied person to be put in an all-male prison? Because this discussion is not solely about toilets, although I know a lot of TRAs like to pretend it is.

Oh true, I forgot about Sharron Davies. I also follow her on twitter.

So what rights do transpeople want that they currently do not have and everyone else has?

@Winecrispschocolatecats
Birth sex not gender. How could there be a man in the women's loos if they are segregated by sex? It is not possible to change sex. I don't care how someone dresses- enforcing gender stereotyped clothing is regressive bullshit that limits self-expression.

I don't think you understand the issues.

The feminism board could certainly help you out with that, if you wished to have a discussion.

Bloomin amazing woman.

She advocates for womens rights, for spaces for women and also protections and spaces for trans people. What is there to disagree with?

What rights do you think people are advocating for trans people to lose? Nobody, not JKR, not posters on MN, not the many people who have had to bring court cases have advocated taking rights away from trans people.

This is why you need to read what JKR actually said rather than sound bites and memes.

JKR is a courageous and intelligent woman and people would do well to listen to her instead of the hysterical hate filled ramblings of a minority group.

Her views that women need our spaces and protections, that our foresister feminists fought for, so womens rights is considered to be 'dreadful'? I trust that's in the UK, and not Afghanistan? She also believes trans people deserve protections and safe spaces.

Really not sure what is so 'dreadful' about that. It's just human rights, isn't it?

Trans Men are Women.

No problem at all.

Well, I believe trans men are indeed men. But that's beside the point. If someone who looks, dresses and sounds like a man is in the women's bathroom, how would you feel? Would you be uncomfortable? Because they're only doing what you want - using the bathroom assigned to their biological sex. Would you ask for physical evidence they're not actually a man (in your view) before carrying out your business?

You can't have it both ways - if you want trans women to use the men's bathroom (because they're men) then trans men would be using women's bathrooms, because you say they're women.

Transphobia is based on ignorance and fear. Like homophobia and racism.

@Winecrispschocolatecats A trans man is a woman, and not a physical threat to us.

Why do you think we women fought to have these spaces, in the first place? Because any man, no matter how he 'identifies', can pose a threat to women. Women escape from men in the ladies, we have period issues, we can cry and/or sober up there, we can change there. Free from the eyes of men.

Why do you think that is such a bad thing? Honestly, for the gender identity supporters out there, why is women being vulnerable and needing safe spaces such a 'bad' thing?

She is a goddamn legend and exactly who i wanted to be when i grew up.

Charitable, kind, resilient and champion of free speech as well as being unafraid of telling the truth and sticking up for women and childrens rights defined by law.

Theres a kurt Cobain quote that works well here:
"I'd rather be hated for who I am then loved for who i'm not."

She is fantastic, I love her.

I dislike her. I won't get into the gender critical stuff because I feel that trans people can explain better than I can why her rhetoric is so harmful. But as a fat person, I absolutely despise the fatphobia present in her writing, as well as the tokenistic approach to characters of colour and LGBT characters.

Further to that, her ongoing silence on Johnny Depp is deafening. Whatever Amber Heard did or didn't do to him, we know for a fact now that Johnny has used absolutely vile misogynistic language to describe her and that JK Rowling has never apologised for her decision to defend his casting. The only 'abusive' men she's interested in exposing are those she has no skin in the game with. She's a hypocrite.

But are you saying that being a man is defined by regressive sexist stereotypes? I thought the trans ideology was progressive and breaking gender barriers? How can that ge if you are saying there is only one way to be a man and that is to follow stereotypes? What about Menlo wear makeup, have long hair, paint their nails, follow what toy would regressibely call “feminine” pursuits? According to you they would be women no?

Transmen are female. Spaces and services are separated by sex, so of course transmen can use female spaces.
The issue is males accessing female spaces and services.
If transmen choose to use male spaces the only people they're putting at risk is themselves. If men want to campaign against females in male spaces they can do.

Thanks for your reply. I understand the issues just fine.

She's fantastic. My neighbour once sat next to her at a charity dinner and said she was the most wonderful company - funny, insightful, interested, modest.

I think the women of Iran burning their hijabs for freedom despite being killed for it are ‘lionesses of epic proportions’. But ‘feminists’ these days don’t seem to care about that. They care about what toilet a transwoman uses.

@Winecrispschocolatecats Wrong.

Gay people took nothing away from women. A gay man still uses men's facilities. A lesbian woman still uses women's facilities. Your argument is a logical fallacy and does not hold water. And you must know that on some level.

We have these facilities because women are vulnerable. You are supporting the removal of safeguarding, and womens human rights to privacy, dignity, safety. Evidence clearly proves it is you that is on the wrong side of history. You're a Mens Rights Activist who wants to strip women of our humanity and human rights. You are wrong, and you are on the wrong side of history. And more and more and more, each and every week, gender identity ideologues are waking to the fact that they were brainwashed and were and are on the wrong side of history.

What does dressing like a man mean? It only has meaning if you agree that certain types of behaviour and clothing are masculine or feminine. I am wearing trousers - am I a man? but I like crochet so maybe I am a women. On the other hand I am pretty nifty at taking the laptop apart and repairing it so maybe I am a bloke after all but what if I am wearing a skirt whilst I am doing it? When I was in Uni some of the blokes had longer hair than me - which one of us looked like a man then?

The only thing that makes me a woman is my biology - the rest is irrelevant.

OK well first of all, no one is assigned a gender, at birth or any other time. The whole thing is nonsense.

As for trans men, well the starting point for me is that they are women, so I have no issue with them in women's spaces. The only caveat to that is that if they have gone so far with their physical transition that they actually pass as men, I think they should use men's spaces. Their presence in women's spaces could be just as traumatising to women as the presence of an actual man, and they represent no threat to men.

So, yes to Elliot Page in the women's toilets, no to Buck Angel.

The obvious solution, of course, is to have single sex spaces for biological women, and unisex spaces for everyone else, i.e. men, trans men, male non binary people and trans women.

@Youg it's perfectly easy to care about more than one thing at a time.