Liz Truss - why didn't we realise?

[ARoyalSubject]

Turn the clock back a month, and we knew she was stupid, and that more than likely she was the wrong choice for a sensible, responsible prime minister - but did people join the dots and realise that she was such an ideologue / so in thrall to ideologues?

AIBU to say that the media didn't spell out exactly what a Truss premiership meant?

She and Kwazi have written a book on exactly what's happening now for god's sake! Why wasn't the possibility they would act on it examined in more detail?

I'm not a member of the Tory party - did they realise what they were voting for?

Well, Tory members, who chose her, are likely to be more ideological than most people, including most Tory voters; that's why they bothered to become members. (Same goes, on the left, for Labour members.) So most of them probably wanted her to be an ideologue.

I think she's probably even more of a 'Vicar of Bray' than her predecessor, and not an ideologue herself; but, as you say, in thrall to ideologues.

I think one could have guessed it from a look at that loony book that she co-authored about 10 years ago, with other then up-and-coming politicians including Kwarteng, Raab and Patel, called 'Britannia Unchained'. In their view, the British are among the laziest in the world, and the country would be improved by instituting Chinese-style (lack of) workers' rights. Etc.

YABVVU to say 'why didn't WE realise?' I never f*cking voted her in!

So do you think it's only Liz who's stupid? What about the rest of the party? what about those in Labour? What about those who run the media? Or the WEF?

www.amazon.co.uk/Britannia-Unchained-Global-Lessons-Prosperity/dp/1137032235 It's all set out here and has been for years. None of this stuff is a surprise. The error was assuming that they wouldn't actually act on it and would just trundle along being vaguely centre right.

There are two lines that people on here and in the wider world bring out regularly- Tories are all the same and they're all in it for the money. Neither is true and both are harmful. There is more difference between Truss and Cameron (say) than there is between Cameron and Blair. And many MPs are motivated by a desire for power and by ideology, not personal financial gain (there are far easier ways to make a fortune than going into politics). I think these sort of easy and dismissive lines (and I'd add just dismissing Truss as "stupid") actually blind people to what's going on.

I think the 81k conservative party members that voted for her did realise, and got what they wanted.

I don't think she's stupid - she just has different policy proposals that she said would help. You, I and Rishi Sunak all saw flaws in her proposals, but the Conservative electorate clearly liked what she was saying.

What's Labour got to do with it?

Many of us did realise but it wasn't a question of having a say! And to my mind the scary thing is these people are not stupid, they have a plan and are utterly ruthless in implementing it.

We shouldn't ignore the fact that Tory voters (think old and rich) are getting exactly what they wanted. Tax cuts and higher interest rates on their savings. It's the rest of us getting stuffed.

I'm not sure about that. I don't think anyone will have predicted what's happened in the last couple of days. If the UK becomes an economic pariah pensions will plummet and old people can't avoid the price rises. The only people who will benefit are the hedge fund bankers who make money every time the pound sinks.

Robert Peston
17m
Tory minister: "Kwasi is toast"

What's labour got to do with politics? Good point, they're finished.

Seriously though, just wondering if she thinks anyone in labour is also thick given the PM can be thick. I think Tony Blair was crazy, not thick though. I don't actually think anyone in politics is thick, I just think they lie about what they're trying to do.

Those who voted her in knew exactly what she was going to do. She didn't hide it. She laid it out bare for them and they lapped it up.

I thought Sunak was the least worse choice out of the 2 at the time and subsequent events confirm that...

She was fronting up a Thatcher ancestor cult, of course the membership and much of the right-wing press fell for her. Even when it was consistently pointed out that, given where we are today, Thatcher wouldn’t do (insert policy here).

Tory minister: "Kwasi is toast"

Finally some good news. I wonder who would be mad enough to take his place?

Robert Peston
10m
Kwasi Kwarteng was of course only implementing the tax cuts promised by Truss, plus a chunk on top. So she is irrevocably implicated in the financial and economic mess. Tory MPs, including ministers, say her ability to survive this mess depends on her moving swiftly...
to appoint a new chancellor, one with credibility in markets. They can think of three: Michael Gove, Sajid Javid and - whisper it softly - Rishi Sunak. This would be the climbdown of all climbdowns by a PM, especially after so few days in office. And maybe...
Kwarteng and Truss will be given the time and space to tough this out. But that their colleagues should be talking about replacing one or both of them so soon is extraordinary (in the true mean of the word)

@vera99 wow - that's really unfair on Kwasi! He delivered what Truss promised - the fact that no one likes it except the Conservative members that voted for her is neither here nor there, you could argue that if he DIDN'T deliver what she promised that she would be letting her electorate of 81k down.

This should bring down the whole government and lead to a general election. That's what should happen when you elect an ideologue in a leadership election who doesn't have a mandate to do those things from the country.

Whether it does or not...who knows. I hope the 81k tory electors realise belatedly that they should have elected someone with more centrist policies if they wanted to hang on in government. It's momentum and labour and corbyn but from the opposite side of the aisle.

It was only about half of the Conservative Party members, to be fair, taking into account the turnout.

“The foreign secretary received 81,326 votes to Rishi Sunak’s 60,399, gaining the support of 57.4 per cent and 42.6 per cent of the membership respectively. The turnout was 83 per cent.”

Rishi would never come back as chancellor surely?!

And you’d describe members of other parties, Labour for example, as intellectual giants?

I think we can all agree that anyone who wants is able to join a political party, but most people who do have a political agenda to pursue. Many of them will have given their agenda considerable thought, whether we agree with their objectives or not, and to be honest I think you’d want to see as broad a mix of membership as possible. If they were all intellectuals you’d be saying they are disconnected from the real world and didn’t understand what life was like for the person on the street.

Rishi knew www.indy100.com/politics/rishi-sunak-borrowing-plan-warning
I don't know why more party members voted for Liz- MSM gave an impression it was punishment for Rishi's "betrayal" but Truss economics would obviously be popular with donors.
I think most people didn't follow the leadership election closely because they couldn't vote in it but both Boris and Truss are both terrible choices. The only way that the Tories could get my vote now is if someone moderate like Rory Stewart became leader but that's never going to happen.

I knew it’d shift right so in that sense I’m not surprised. I also thought it would have real impact on those booting out Johnson so be prepared for that

But to this extent I didn’t really think about

Sorry - that was to @TiredButAlive !

Rishi would never come back as chancellor surely?!

I very much doubt it. He was completely opposed to the tax cuts.

Can Truss be charged with deliberately trying to crash UK PLC, so her and her friends and make billions?

If so, anyone up for a crowd funder?

I would guess that lots of Tory voters are not known for critically considering or caring what effect their actions have on people who are less fortunate - else they would not vote Tory. A tiny core majority still get cultural hard-ons for Maggie T, of whom Truss reminds them.