My feed
Premium

Please
or
to access all these features

AIBU?

AIBU to join street protests to demand a general election

163 replies

Heyyebskeikwbevg · 24/09/2022 10:11

Lots of people horrified by KK’s mini budget and vision for our country, myself included.

Will you protest out on the streets and demand a general election?

YANBU - Yes I will be out on the streets as soon (as someone else organises it!)

YABU - No, they have been elected and we have no right to demand a general election

OP posts:
Report

Am I being unreasonable?

417 votes. Final results.

POLL
You are being unreasonable
39%
You are NOT being unreasonable
61%
ImNotGreta · 24/09/2022 14:15

CurseOfBigness · 24/09/2022 14:13

@ImNotGretaShe is PM, she was appointed as such by the queen.

The Queen who has since sadly died (like a day or two after appointing Truss).

We have a King now. She wasn’t appointed by the King. Or was she?

Again, why is someone so ignorant of how it works so upset? Why not educate yourself rather than whining on about how unfair you find it all?

Report
LimitIsUp · 24/09/2022 14:18

I would also like to see @ImNotGreta respond to the point about Kwarteng not allowing the publication of the report from the Office of Budget Responsibility

Report
CurseOfBigness · 24/09/2022 14:22

DuckBilledFattypus · 24/09/2022 14:07

If her economic policy has never worked before (there are studies to support that it works in theory but not in practice) then she is being irresponsible and does not deserve the power she seems to wield.

Whether she deserves it or not is just an opinion. She was backed by the tory MPs and finally the Tory members, who decided that out of the final candidates available, she would be the one to win. So clearly, by the people who voted her in, she does deserve to win. Whether she does a good job or not, just like any other prime minister, remains to be seen. One thing is true though, she is (these days) a proper true blue Tory. Unlike the recent Tory prime minister's. So there will be a huge amount of change to move the party back to actual Tory values.

But the majority she enjoys was won through the red wall votes. Not true blue Conservative votes.

As upthread, both Boris and David Cameron recognised where their victory came from and the need to cement trust.

I don’t mind a true blue Conservative who has won their place through a general election. But Truss hasn’t done this. That’s the issue.

Report
mewkins · 24/09/2022 14:23

DuckBilledFattypus · 24/09/2022 13:25

A few of the normal suspects banging on about how unfair it is is neither here nor there, and the normal lefty threat about how if they don’t get their way there’ll be riots is just pathetic.

The lefty believe in democracy, until it doesn't go their way. Then they will wage war, until their version of 'democracy' that should suit them, and not people that don't agree with them. Firm but fair it is not. Not that it matters, as labour are rarely in power, and they're so far down the rabbit hole that they're unelectable. And the reduction of taxes, NI, new grammar schools etc will likely be a Tory vote winner.

I don't think it will be the vote winner she thinks it will be.... she would have been better off leaving the top tier tax stuff alone and just meddling with the stuff that affects the majority. It's like she's forgotten that even the billionaires only have one vote each.

Report
ImNotGreta · 24/09/2022 14:25

CurseOfBigness · 24/09/2022 14:22

But the majority she enjoys was won through the red wall votes. Not true blue Conservative votes.

As upthread, both Boris and David Cameron recognised where their victory came from and the need to cement trust.

I don’t mind a true blue Conservative who has won their place through a general election. But Truss hasn’t done this. That’s the issue.

You are simply being ridiculous now, trying to imply that somehow some of the votes count for less.

She has been correctly appointed as prime minister. You hate this, but no-one has to take any notice of this, and certainly not the government.

Yog’ll get an election when the PM calls one.

Report
SummaLuvin · 24/09/2022 14:25

CurseOfBigness · 24/09/2022 14:13

@ImNotGretaShe is PM, she was appointed as such by the queen.

The Queen who has since sadly died (like a day or two after appointing Truss).

We have a King now. She wasn’t appointed by the King. Or was she?

You clearly don't like Liz Truss, I don't either. But ask yourself if you would question the validity of the PM if the leader of your chosen party had been appointed in the same circumstances instead of Liz.

Unless we have a reason to believe the Queen was not sound of mind at the time, I have seen no evidence of this, the appointment stands. Furthermore, even if we do believe the Queen was not of sound mind and require Charles to swear in Liz do you really think he would refuse? Technically he has the power to do so, but I think it would be dangerous for the Royal family to intercept our democratic process - from my understanding they can do so to prevent dictatorship or someone claiming the post wrongly, not because the PM is unpopular with some people.

Report
CurseOfBigness · 24/09/2022 14:28

ImNotGreta · 24/09/2022 14:15

Again, why is someone so ignorant of how it works so upset? Why not educate yourself rather than whining on about how unfair you find it all?

It’s a formality. I get it.

And I’m not upset at all. Funny you think I am. I’m enjoying a discussion.

Now… how about you

Report
CurseOfBigness · 24/09/2022 14:29

@ImNotGreta

Now… how about you address the point about Truss’ government not allowing the publication of the report from the Office of Budget Responsibility?!

Irresponsible use of power, isn’t it?!

Or is that something you don’t like because it’s likely to be true and therefore you won’t engage with it. And you branded me “childish”. Hehe!

Report
ShirtingForkBalls · 24/09/2022 14:29

Yes I will protest this sodding government! Bastards!

Report
CurseOfBigness · 24/09/2022 14:32

@SummaLuvinYou clearly don't like Liz Truss, I don't either. But ask yourself if you would question the validity of the PM if the leader of your chosen party had been appointed in the same circumstances instead of Liz.

Yep. The principle stands. I think it’s in the leader’s own interests to have the credibility and integrity that comes with winning a general election as the PM.

Report
LimitIsUp · 24/09/2022 14:36

CurseOfBigness · 24/09/2022 14:29

@ImNotGreta

Now… how about you address the point about Truss’ government not allowing the publication of the report from the Office of Budget Responsibility?!

Irresponsible use of power, isn’t it?!

Or is that something you don’t like because it’s likely to be true and therefore you won’t engage with it. And you branded me “childish”. Hehe!

She can't defend this point so is determinedly ignoring it

Report
SummaLuvin · 24/09/2022 14:39

CurseOfBigness · 24/09/2022 14:32

@SummaLuvinYou clearly don't like Liz Truss, I don't either. But ask yourself if you would question the validity of the PM if the leader of your chosen party had been appointed in the same circumstances instead of Liz.

Yep. The principle stands. I think it’s in the leader’s own interests to have the credibility and integrity that comes with winning a general election as the PM.

I was talking specifically about the inference you made in the post I quoted that her appointment by the Queen shouldn't be considered valid since she died so soon after. Which I think is quite baffling.

The point you make on Liz not being elected via GE has more weight, but I still don't buy into it. Our democracy process makes clear we are electing a party, who is represented primarily and led by their candidate. Most people I know don't thoroughly research their local MP options, voting records, personal beliefs and motivations... and vote on that information. They vote based on which party they feel most accurately represents their beliefs, regardless of the MPs. We are all well aware that the leaders can change, and this is not at all unusual. So I don't see why the action of a GE would be an appropriate response to this situation.

Report
thecatsthecats · 24/09/2022 14:43

wb3 · 24/09/2022 10:55

Here's my proposal. Let's get tough. The time for talking is over. Call me extreme if you like but I propose we it them and and hit them fast with a major and I mean major leaflet campaign. The follow up with a whist drive and car boot sale. Then maybe some benefit concerts. It that's not enough, then I'm sorry it's time for the t-shirts.

We could be the Council Looking Into Tory Obligatory Removal In September.

;)

Report
CurseOfBigness · 24/09/2022 14:50

@SummaLuvin I was responding to another poster, admittedly being pedantic in pointing out that Truss hasn’t actually been appointed by the current Head of State. I don’t think it changes anything, no. But we also don’t know what kind of King Charles III will be like. He seems more outspoken than his mother.

“The point you make on Liz not being elected via GE has more weight, but I still don't buy into it. Our democracy process makes clear we are electing a party, who is represented primarily and led by their candidate. Most people I know don't thoroughly research their local MP options, voting records, personal beliefs and motivations... and vote on that information. They vote based on which party they feel most accurately represents their beliefs, regardless of the MPs. We are all well aware that the leaders can change, and this is not at all unusual. So I don't see why the action of a GE would be an appropriate response to this situation.”

Because Truss is being irresponsible with the power that has been entrusted to her.

Truss seems to be in desperate need of humility before the electorate.

Refusing to publish the OBR report is a red flag.

Report
ImNotGreta · 24/09/2022 14:59

CurseOfBigness · 24/09/2022 14:32

@SummaLuvinYou clearly don't like Liz Truss, I don't either. But ask yourself if you would question the validity of the PM if the leader of your chosen party had been appointed in the same circumstances instead of Liz.

Yep. The principle stands. I think it’s in the leader’s own interests to have the credibility and integrity that comes with winning a general election as the PM.

Oh, so this is all about your concern for Liz Truss?

How very altruistic of you.

Report
ImNotGreta · 24/09/2022 15:00

LimitIsUp · 24/09/2022 14:36

She can't defend this point so is determinedly ignoring it

I’ve got no need to defend it, I have no strong opinion either way.

Report
DownNative · 24/09/2022 15:01

CurseOfBigness · 24/09/2022 14:13

@ImNotGretaShe is PM, she was appointed as such by the queen.

The Queen who has since sadly died (like a day or two after appointing Truss).

We have a King now. She wasn’t appointed by the King. Or was she?

Such appointments stand even in the event of the Demise Of The Crown and a process exists whereby appointed PMs can be removed from power.

But the Sovereign never dies which is why the Royal Standard never flies half mast. We had two Sovereign Monarchs until the Crown, Orb and Sceptre were removed from the coffin.

This is constitutional and democratic.

Report
LimitIsUp · 24/09/2022 15:08

You do need to defend it because it shows that your party of choice is fiscally irresponsible and arrogantly dismissive of experts

Report
LeatherBasket · 24/09/2022 15:22

I would advise you to rather write letter of your concern to your local MP, though they're likely a Tory. Stinks of corruption, so you may as well protest...

Report
wb3 · 24/09/2022 15:55

thecatsthecats · 24/09/2022 14:43

We could be the Council Looking Into Tory Obligatory Removal In September.

;)

Men would never be able to us.

Report
wb3 · 24/09/2022 15:57

...find us...

Report
DuckBilledFattypus · 24/09/2022 16:12

LimitIsUp · 24/09/2022 15:08

You do need to defend it because it shows that your party of choice is fiscally irresponsible and arrogantly dismissive of experts

I don't think you can demand a random user of Mumsnet defend anything if they don't want to. Writing to Liz Truss or your MP and making your demands to them would probably be more helpful

Report

Don’t want to miss threads like this?

Weekly

Sign up to our weekly round up and get all the best threads sent straight to your inbox!

Log in to update your newsletter preferences.

You've subscribed!

ImNotGreta · 24/09/2022 16:25

LimitIsUp · 24/09/2022 15:08

You do need to defend it because it shows that your party of choice is fiscally irresponsible and arrogantly dismissive of experts

Don’t be stupid. It’s not my party of choice, and no-one needs to defend something that another person does.

Is there anyone on the left here who actually understands the structure of a valid argument?

Why would I possibly “need” to do what you demand?

Report
Mangogogogo · 24/09/2022 16:28

Do you know how much a general election costs?!

Report
roarfeckingroarr · 24/09/2022 16:33

I won't but you do what you like. Don't do any looting though, that's a bit far.

Report
Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.