My son’s nursery are being ridiculous, right?

[FoxyLoxSox]

Has anyone else experienced this?

So DS is 1, and has been attending the nursery since June. Goes four days a week. Had a week off in July for conjunctivitis, totally expected a bout of an illness or two when he started, normal I know. Duly juggled with work to keep him home.

On the 26th August I got a call to say he’d got diarrhoea, please come get him and keep him off for 48 hours after the last instance, as per policy, fair enough- he did indeed turn out to have a d&v bug. Duly juggled work to keep him home, even though he was right as rain within 24 hours, we kept him off for four nursery days to let it totally clear his system and let him get his appetite back etc. Totally clear of any symptoms.

Returned him to nursery happy as Larry. I get a call the next day to day he’d done one loose poo and to come and collect and keep him off for 48 hours at least. Was pretty pissed off as he was bouncing around and did no concerning poos whatsoever but again, kept him off. This was really tricky this time as we both had deadlines to meet, I can’t work from home at all, DH can to an extent but needs to do calls etc and WFH is definitely not encouraged by his office. Neither of us have other adults to help, no family nearby etc. we can’t take annual leave without notice. We keep him off for the 48 hours, he does a couple of loose teething poos, absolutely no diarrhoea whatsoever.

The next Wednesday at roughly the same time, I get a call to say again, one incident of ‘wet poo’ and can I pick up. Now I work compressed full time hours which is pretty horrible really but it means I get Mondays off to be with my baby plus I finish at lunchtime on a Wednesday. Since we have to pay for the full day anyway I use that time to do all the shit I don’t have time for the rest of the week but usually pick DS up early to spend some time with him. They know I finish early on a Wednesday because I explained it when he did his settling sessions.

That time I pushed back a bit but they insisted I’d be putting their staff at risk if I didn’t collect him forthwith and keep him off. That meant he didn’t return until the following Tuesday as obviously no point putting him in at 4pm on a Friday afternoon. DH went out of his mind a bit for the next two days trying to work with DS at home who was his absolute lively normal self and tearing around like Crash Bandicoot.

At this point we seek medical advice to ask why there are random incidents of this loose nappy to be told it’s all totally within the normal spectrum of baby poo and teething, diet and milk consumption can all very easily cause a loose bowel movement and she agreed that one instance of this every few days is a ridiculous reason to kick DS out of nursery.

Thursday last week I happened to have a day of annual leave (which nursery didn’t know) but was at an eye appointment when they called and said, another loose poo, really wet with little substance, please collect. I said no. DH wasn’t even in the country at this time either. I explained to them about the GP visit, they said ok provide a doctors note to confirm. The manager even said ‘we know it’s not norovirus and this is getting silly every week’ I agreed. I rang the GP and she very kindly fired me an email to say not infectious, normal for a baby etc etc.

Picked him up at 5, they say he had ‘just’ done another very loose poo and therefore can’t come in the next day. He was again fine all bloody weekend with no conceding poo whatsoever.

I mean I don’t know what to do at this point. Surely they can’t keep doing this for loose baby poo ?!!

I know they are having a major staffing issue right now with a couple of long term ones leaving and not being replaced, they regularly have bank staff in or workers doing extra shifts, I feel for them I do but this is a completely untenable situation for us and I’m getting worried about my job, as is DH.

I asked today for why concerning nappies to be photographed so I can see but they’ve mumbled something about ‘safeguarding’

Its really upsetting me as I didn’t want to put DS in nursery yet at all, but financially staying at home with him is just not an option 😩

But seriously you need to kick ass with these individuals, you are paying a ton of money to them for childcare and receiving a shoddy service or no service. Get angry and get it sorted. Squeaky wheels get oiled quickly!!

If they are doing this because they are short staffed do you really want him there anyway? Low supervision isn't very safe surely.

I had a similar problem with child coming out in a rash. It was the orange juice they were giving him - it had artificial colour in it, despite being labelled as additive free.
Now that squash and juice is all full of artificial sweeteners, loose stools can be a real problem. Maybe you need a food and drink diary from them.

Someone who has previously worked in a nursery, there are the most selfish staff who will send children home by saying they have diarrhoea so they can go home on time (staff to children ratio) or because a child is being 'difficult' due to behaviour or emotional needs. It's not fair and it's not right but unfortunately people do this. If you have a note from GP like you said then this is acceptable for him to stay put in the nursery. Nursery practitioners should know teething troubles can cause Diarrhoea and will not need to send home unless accompanied by a temperature

I believe having diarrhoea is considered after having 3 loose stools in a period of time. So the nursery sending him home for one loose poo here and there is ridiculous. 1 year olds can get loose stools due to teething like you say!

I can only stress that we chose this nursery really carefully, they’ve been going for 25 years and seemed very ‘on it’ in terms of organisation etc. But I’m so fucked off with them over this. There’s already a guilt factor at play as I didn’t really want to send him at this age but I feel like i’m forever going to be labelled as ‘that’ parent who refuses to come and get a poorly child or sends them in unwell.

The handbook we’ve got is crap, but online their policy is ‘In cases of diarrhoea and vomiting The parent must be informed and they must be clear of the last episode of the above for a full 48 hours before returning. They should also be on their normal diet. In cases of ongoing diarrhoea the manager will insist the child is taken to the GP with a letter from the setting to confirm that they are not infectious’

We didn’t ‘get sent’ to the GP as I took him of my own volition, but we have a note nonetheless.

Putting two and two together is making me come to the assumption they can charge but not provide the child care; as you have said they have a staffing issue and potentially not the ratios.

Next time I would pick up. Take note of the number of staff/children. And then pop back an hour or so later uninvited to collect something forgotten/lost and see if the same no of staff are still there.

I would personally change nurseries, you child is at a young enough age to adapt quick enough. I would look at other nurseries and start enquiries and ask lots of questions even with the doctors note, give it a few weeks and see if theres any improvement. It is mad they seem to do this every week almost. It is frustrating they will still charge for the days your child isnt in, if they are booked for those days and are sick they will charge as they are paying for staff to cover the amount of children they have booked in. My old nursery didnt always charge if it was evident my DD would be of for the week or following week.

They are being completely ridiculous, either change nurseries or get a childminder.

You might have won the record for longest op ever OP!

This is absolutely absurd! With myself being a fully qualified child care worker/ early years teacher/ parent/ rather knowledgeable and understanding… I would most certainly take the very same steps as the nursery in question have carried out, definitely for strike 1, most likely for strike 2 but then strike 3 I would have already hit doubts about this issue being some sort of contagious problem and would happily welcome the advice of a GP’s note as reassurance for the safety of myself, fellow colleagues and other children attending the nursery. Going on what you have said about the staffing shortage at the nursery, I would say that they are using the smallest of things, that most if not every baby faces at some point, to their own advantage. I also picked up on the fact that you had picked up on a pattern of certain days that you were faced with problem 💩 call for collection. This makes me wonder, is this just a problem for you or are there other parents noticing the same issues alongside you? If I was in your shoes, I would 100% begin looking for another nursery placement or even a childminder to help you and I would try to communicate this to other parents that have children going to this nursery to see how personal this actually is. I’m sorry you are going through this unneeded and stressful time. I wish you all the best for the future whatever your outcome may be xxx

All childcare places I’ve worked at have had a policy of a number of loose poos within a period of time probably meant a bug e.g. 3 loose poos within 2 hours is not really normal.

This is actually a very good point!

We are 3 x loose poo within a 3 hr session. We also learn which children have a tendency for it and which it is unusual for. There is a wide range in the 0-2 Yr group.

Ridiculous from nursery! The fact that there are staffing issues us also a concern, seems ur child is the easy way out to resolve their staff:child ratio!
there are no safeguarding issues regarding photos of stools but would u trust them to send ur child’s? I’d be demanding a food/drink diary be kept as except for one occasion all this has been in nursery. Say u want it for a minimum of 6 weeks, gives time to cycle thru the meals a few times and identify a pattern. Make it clear that unless he is very unwell u will not be collecting him and that the doctor agrees. R they medically trained? If not then doctor trumps staff. Sounds like common sense gone and over reactions are norm! All else fails, change nursery!

A little different Op but this keeps happening to my Ds as well . I keep trying to say that a child can have diarrhoea for other reasons not just d&v and then they are off for 3 days and are completely fine . No advice but I feel your pain

Find a new nursery preferably one with staff who use their common sense

I think you just need to move nursery - at this point they're clearly not being sensible either for 'policy' or staffing reasons. One loose stool in a baby isn't a sign of anything at all, let alone something worth sending home for.

find a childminder! Honestly best thing we ever did. First kid went to a private nursery until 3 then we switched. Second kid went straight to childminder and we love it. It’s more like having a family member, very chilled with rules etc. yes a small risk when childminder is off sick there’s no cover. But hasn’t happened to us yet.

We had similar issues with our nursery so I looked for a childminder. Decided two days each in case it didn't work, then went 4 days childminder. The nursery just got more ridiculous with temperatures and administering calpol (no second dose within 48 hours). They cared more about keeping kids off than keeping them safe and well.

Btw Public health England do not recommend time off for conjunctivitis

www.publichealth.hscni.net/sites/default/files/Guidance_on_infection_control_in%20schools_poster.pdf

I work in an ASN school and it’s 3 loose stools in one day (like someone else said) unless accompanied by vomiting. There are some staff who get very anxious and annoyed about this, I feel more so since covid and will push to try and get them home. I would get them to clarify that it isn’t 3 instances as that to me has been normal procedure in all schools I have worked. A bit like loose stools being common for toddlers they are common for our children too due to reduced diets, some being peg fed formula and due to medications. This is all considered and normally we would also consider if the child was not quite themselves as this would be an indicator it is possibly a bug.

Nah fuck that, go elsewhere. Our nursery must have sent my girls home about once each in the four years they were there. They only did it as an absolute last resort after calpol etc.

i couldn’t have functioned in my job otherwise!

Then I think the 48 hour rule is crap without applying common sense. My daughter ate her body weight in chocolate at my mums one evening (😒) and spewed in the car on the way home. I did not keep her off nor disclose the incident to the nursery. Vomiting through overconsumption of chocolate is not contagious.