Holding off potty training a 3y9m old

[AmySma1i]

Hi, my DD is 3y9m old and isn't showing many signs of being potty trained yet after successful earlier attempts, we've taken a break after a long spell where we've been able to have no pants but to no avail, she recognises far too late with nothing on, and never notices until patterns change in the nappy.

We've got a trip to visit grandparents in Australia in 2 months time and I don't think we'll reliably crack potty training by then if at all. I've decided to go back to just nappies for the trip and the month away and try again when we get back. However she's going to turn 4 years old whilst away and i never thought I'd still have a 4 year old in nappies day and night. Am I making the correct decision holding off or should I give one big final push despite there not being many signs? Any advice as well as general thoughts would be amazing ❤

Onwards and upwards OP. Hope things work out. 👍🏻

Good luck hope she gets there.

Any progress over the weekend?

Sadly not, we tried all weekend but didn't get anywhere, we've got a GP appointment in 2 weeks and will see if anything comes from that

Definitely read the Oh Crap book and forget the ‘signs of readiness’ - they are largely outdated and meaningless. You can’t expect her to potty train or notice she has done a wee while she has a nappy on. Wearing a nappy interferes with their unconscious reflexes, hence why going naked, bare bottomed or commando is strongly recommended during the potty training period - anything that has the feel of nappy or underwear will interfere with her awareness that she’s weeing. I would also forget taking her to the toilet/potty at intervals - this interferes with their ability to recognise the urge to ‘go’. I’d also ditch the rewards if you can - going to the toilet is a basic human function and shouldn’t be connected with a reward. Lastly, but importantly, you need to pull her from nursery and keep her at home until you’ve made decent progress. Sending her to nursery in a nappy will derail any progress made and just make the process longer and harder.

It’s a really stressful time. Wishing you much strength!

That's nightmare that you got now progress over the weekend.
Hopefully the GP can rule out any physical issues.

She is nearly 4 OP. Barring any other recognised healthy difficulties, she should really be potty trained by now.
Why would you delay it further?
This is what you hear about re kids showing up a lot schools in nappies - parents like you. Just train her already.

@Quincythequince please at least read through Ops posts. Op has tried with no progress.

2 month's is loads of time. Get half a dozen Terry nappies and use those. She will feel wet if she wees in those. Put her on potty ever 20 mins. Give her a couple of smarties if she produces anything on potty, even a dribble. She will be starting school soon and other children will laugh at her if still in nappies. I'm not even sure if children can go to school in a nappy. Who would change it? It not a teacher or teaching assistant job to change wet and shitty nappies.

@caringcarer changing nappies in school is certainly an issue.

I know one child with bowel issues, who's now mid teens, who wasn't allowed into mainstream school due to nappies, they ended up in a special school.

Thsc mainstream school said mum would need to arrange someone to change them, not a teacher or assistant job. Arranging that is easier said than done, esp as kids don't poo to the clock.

sounds so hard for you all.
I’m no expert but if I where you (and you are 100% sure no additional needs)
bin the nappies in the day, it’s confusing to them to have them on and off I would just get rid.
stay at home for 3/4 days with no bottoms on, put a potty in the middle of the room/ wherever she can get to it asap. You need to remove all physical barriers and make it as easy as possible. Good luck 🤞

I have read them.

How is trying for a weekend (this time) considered long enough?
It simply isn’t.
You just need to make the decision for no more nappies, and that’s it, keep going until you get it. You don’t give up after two days.

Might have escaped your notice it was 3 day weekend. You'd expect to see some progress in that time. If your not getting progress then it is worth checking stuff out with GP as Op is doing.

That child won't be in a special school because they had bowel issues which meant they were in nappies for longer 🙄
I have a disabled child who is at a special school, he toilet trained at 9 or 10 but there was far more going on then just bowel issues ,a child has to meet a certain criteria for a place in a special school, bowel issues wouldn't meet the criteria
Also mainstream school, s are not allowed to discriminate against a child who is still in nappies for whatever reason ,nor can they insist a parent has to come in ( although many might try this ) as leaving a child wet and or soiled can be considered neglect .

Yes children can still go into school in nappies ,thankfully times have changed and we don't discriminate against children who have toileting issues anymore ,somebody would have to change the child as its neglectful to leave them wet and or solid, schools should read the ERIC Guidelines.

Don't worry. She will get it in the end. Keep trying and hopefully the doctor can give some insight.

It is not the job of a teacher, or a TA in mainstream school to change nappies and anyone with an NT child who hasn’t tried their hardest and persevered with this, should be embarrassed for themselves and their kids if they rock up to school rising 5, with no underlying issues and just sit there and go I. A nappy. They will also get picked on too - even that young, kids will have the ick factor.

With perseverance and effort in most children, they should be dry by age 4.

Three days (yes noted it was a long weekend) it not long enough to have tried and then given up.

Pants off, a few potties everywhere and simple reminders to go regularly can take a while. Even if there’s the odd accident, lots spare clothes and pull up pants will help.

Regardless of what you think in your mind ,schools are not allowed to discriminate against children in nappies nor can they insist that parents should come in and change their child ,as it is considered neglect to allow a child to remain wet and or soiled
The vast majority of children are toilet trained by the time they start school ,and those that are not usually have some kind of disabillity/ medical issue either diagnosed or undiagnosed, I can assure that it is not easier to not toilet train a child just because...

Nowhere have I said it’s ok to discriminate against a a child.
So please don’t post as if I’m doubling down on a point I never made.

More and more children are showing up to school unable to hold a knife and fork, who cannot scribble and who are not toilet trained so it is becoming more and more of a problem.

Parents should be doing the hard work - not leaving it to teachers to manage which whilst not taking long of an in itself. can take away five mins for the other 29 kids in a class, multiple times a day. How many teaching/learning minutes collectively are lost because of that?!

That is not ok.

And you think reception kids won’t work out really quickly who is still ‘in nappies’

Why would anybody subject their kid to that, rather than persevere with it simply and clean up for as long as it takes at home.

Who in a mainstream school should change a child?
And how many schools actually have changing facilities suitable for children (and I don't mean I tiny baby change)

My DC potty trained at 3y3m and I honestly think if we hadn't pressed it then he would have been in nappies by 4. He never did get to the point of wanting to do it, but I didn't want him to be at pre-school in nappies and actually once we did it he was done in 2 weeks, day and night.

Again it's neglect to leave a child wet and or soiled ,so somebody would have to change them
I really dont think there are hordes of children going to school in nappies, it makes no sense assuming ,the child has no medical / disabilities, that they would prefer to be in nappies at 5+

OP I think you're going to have to commit it a good couple of weeks if you want to make progress. IMO all this "they can do it in a day or two if they're ready" is absolutely bullshit. You've just got to prepared to clean up a lot to w couple of months or more. It's part of the process

Well in my child’s class there were two in nappies in reception, one still was a couple of years later. No one laughed at him or “got the ick”, anymore than they laughed/were allowed to laugh at the child with spectacles or the one with a walking frame. A TA helped that (neurotypical but with other medical issues) child change his pull up at lunchtime in the disabled toilet. That toilet also has a child - not toddler - changing bench that I know has been used for other children in the past. Not every school will have that obviously but it’s not unheard of!

The answer to who in mainstream school should change a child is a member of staff - teachers can’t be compelled to do it but it’s not uncommon to have it in a TA job description. I’m not arguing it’s easy to accommodate for schools, but it is necessary.

It’s not acceptable to not toilet train your child out of laziness, but it is very possible to have a child age 3 with as yet unknown/undiagnosed medical or disability issues that mean they still need nappies. There’s no need to try and scare/shame the OP about something her child is 11 months away from and in any case the school should accommodate. There is absolutely no way her child is going to get a special school place on continence issues alone, even if OP wanted it, much less if she didn’t. Neither can her child be refused a school place.