To tell you why the title ‘Prince of Wales’ is an historical insult to the Welsh and shouldn’t exist anymore

[Upthebracket22]

I am Welsh. I was enraged yesterday when the new king decided to ‘bestow’ the title on Prince William, an English Prince without asking the Welsh if they wanted another English Prince of Wales.

here is some historical context from a petition going around at the moment:

The "Prince of Wales" title (Welsh: Tywysog Cymru) is a title historically used by native, Welsh princes since the 14th century. The last native Prince of Wales was Llywelyn the Last, killed by English soldiers in 1282 and his head was then paraded through the streets of London and placed on a Tower of London spike. Llywelyn's brother Dafydd was the first person of note to be hung, drawn and quartered and his head was placed next to Llywelyn's. Both their daughters were taken as infants and children and imprisoned.

But this happened centuries ago you might say. The truth is, that since the days of Llywelyn the Last and the "rebel" Prince of Wales, Owain Glyndwr, the title has been held exclusively by Englishmen as a symbol of dominance over Wales. To this day, the English "Princes of Wales" have no genuine connection to our country.

The title remains an insult to Wales and is a symbol of historical oppression. The title also implies that Wales is still a principality, undermining Wales' status as a nation and a country. In addition, the title has absolutely no constitutional role for Wales, which is now a devolved country with a national Parliament.

As Welsh actor, Michael Sheen put it;

"Make a break there. Put some things that have been the wrongs of the past right. There's an opportunity to do that at that point. Don't necessarily just because of habit and without thinking just carry on that tradition that was started as a humiliation to our country. Why not change that as we come to this moment where things will inevitably change."

I don’t think many people have any concept of Welsh history. I find it offensive and think now would have been a good moment to right a historical wrong.

Agree. We’re all just people. Good ones, bad ones. Being Welsh, or Scottish, or Irish or English doesn’t make you any better than anyone else.

Those kind of replies really get on my tits. Especially when they say that and then bang on about people coming to the UK because they didn't like an aspect of where they were (whether that be socially, economically etc). At least be consistent!

Are you having a laugh? Look at the historical issues in Ireland, problems we are still having to this day. Telling someone to 'stop whining' about something that signifies oppression to them is really fucking insulting.

Your attitude is why so many Irish/Scottish/Welsh people dislike the English.

I'm Scottish (well half) my husband is Scottish, we were only talking less than half an hour ago about how annoying whinging about the past is.

And my dragon eggs flew back to hatch their own eggs 😂😂

I do love the flag but am a fan of myth and magic anyway.

You should go to a university that provides the best education for your particular course.

It's fine to be proud of your home land. Wherever is

But the blind nodding donkeys who lap up some of the nonsense pouring from politicians, media and even actors mouths need to give their head a wobble

I just don’t understand how people feel oppressed now by something that happened centuries before you were born. The Ukrainians are being oppressed by the Russians just now. That’s what oppression looks like.

They're glass 3/4 empty types. Yes we have poverty but it's not like poverty in a city in the main. I don't think our climate helps. Our education is a mixed bag. We're very fatalistic in a gloomy way.

Well said, as well as the women and girls in Afghanistan, the Uyghurs in China, and everyone under Boko Haram rule.

It seems some people just live in the past and can't move forward. I'm all for knowledge: knowing about the past and understanding historical conflicts is hugely important, but you can't hold people in the present day accountable for actions by other people hundreds of years ago

Well done on showing your own bigotry towards the English. Dividers are toxic people.

The devolved nations really are stuck in an abusive relationship with the English, we tell them we want our own voice they scorn us for it, they isolate us from our friends (the EU), they control our money and don't give us enough to make any meaningful difference yet berate us when we don't priorities what they think we should and when we tell them we want to leave were told that we'll never make it on our own or in the case of Scotland they're told they're not even allowed to ask themselves if they want to, the devolved nations really need to do the Freedom Program

scotland gets to spend £2k moreper person a year for being in the union: I don’t see oppressive policies. Yes the Tories are utterly diabolical but they’ll be voted out at the next election. As Jo Cox said, we are far more united and have far more in common with each other than things that divide us

And the reason why Scotland isn’t having a second vote is surveys say the majority of Scot’s don’t want one! We just want to live our lives without the constant threat of another ‘civic and joyous’ (bitter and aggressive) referendum experience.

There’s a lot of ‘why can’t we all just get along’ comments on here.

Yes, we can all get along just as independent nations. Independence is normal. There are something like 75 countries smaller than Wales who are independent and manage just fine thanks.

Could you give us 75 examples of comparable countries, in terms of their resources and economy?

👏 👏

True, but the problem is lots of people don't know much about the past and have little understanding of historical conflicts, and thus they have no frame of reference for modern days situations. The problems Brexit caused for NI is an example - even (especially!) the politicians, who should have done their research, made cringeworthy comments on subjects they clearly knew very little about.
So I can understand why people get annoyed. It's not that they hold someone responsible for the past, but that they expect them to at least know about the past and to have some understanding as a result. Context is everything.

This. It’s only in Victorian times that Welsh school children were being punished for speaking Welsh in school.

"By the way Mark, you know that thing we've done for every heir apparent for the last 700 years? Well we're doing it again this time too. Just in case it wasn't blatantly obvious."

Yeah, not much point in telling him something he already knew.

And yet France is considered to be measurably less democratic than the UK. Go figure.

COFIWCH DRYWERYN!

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cofiwch_Dryweryn

Im surprised that people are surprised about the Welsh being oppressed in history. A little fact for you. England has oppressed every single country/tribe/ethnicity that they have ever had contact with and the ones they haven’t were simply too strong for them to do so.

While we are on the subject of centuries old grievances, can the English have reparations from the Welsh for Henry VIII? the biggest (in all senses of the word) iconoclast and political, religious and cultural vandal who has ever sat on the English throne.

No , it happened to a family member in the 20th century.

But we are living in the present not the past. How are the present English oppressing the present Welsh? We can’t do anything about the past, but we can do something about the present.