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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To end this friendship now I know what she would really think of me….

498 replies

EmptyHouse0822 · 07/09/2022 11:55

I have a friend and we met because our children go to the same school. It started off as just chatting on the playground, then going out with the children and now we will also go out just the two of us.

We have been friends for about 2.5 years and I would say we are pretty close in that we talk to each other about our problems and we know we can trust each other.

Anyhow, this morning, completely out the blue she made some very negative and distasteful comments about lesbians and although she was trying to pass it off as a joke the undertone was clear that she thought the concept of two women together was quite unpleasant.

The problem is that even though she doesn’t know it, I am bisexual and so her comments made me really uncomfortable. Obviously I’m married with children so she would have no reason at all to suspect I can be attracted to women and so wouldn’t see any reason why her comments would upset me on a personal level.

Even if I wasn’t bisexual I wouldn’t have found her comments acceptable at all.

But now I don’t know what to do. I don’t feel like I can carry on this friendship knowing how disapproving she is of an aspect of my life but as we’ve been friends for so long and out children are good friends it wouldn’t make sense to anyone if I just pulled away from her.

I don’t know how to navigate this and I’m already dreading seeing her on the school run this afternoon.

AIBU to just pull back from the friendship and tell her why?

OP posts:
Teenagehorrorbag · 09/09/2022 00:17

Sorry - just saw you have spoken to her. Nothing to add - her response does seem as though she has fairly entrenched views.

That said - perhaps being friends with you and realising you're perfectly normal, might help her move her head into the 21st century and help her bring her DCs up in a supportive manner? If you valued her friendship before, maybe you could rebuild on a new level. Only you know if that's possible, or even something you'd want to try.....

sue20 · 09/09/2022 00:18

exaltedwombat · 08/09/2022 18:01

She's picked up the vibes, feels strangely attracted to you and finds it frightening. Be kind.

I had this thought as well. But she shouldn’t project her fear we all need to take responsibility for our inner emotional world

CountessWindyBottom · 09/09/2022 00:33

I think if it was a genuine friendship then you need to give it more respect than a couple of morning drop-offs and a text or two.Arrange to meet up and hash it out over a bottle of wine. If you still think that there is a deeply entrenched bigotry there then so be it but at least have the decency to sit down and talk about it together.

ChellyT · 09/09/2022 00:51

Tierne · 07/09/2022 12:02

the undertone was clear that she thought the concept of two women together was quite unpleasant

Shes allowed to feel that way for herself

For herself? Do you keep that same energy when someone is being racist or misogynistic? Being openly homophobic is not the flex you think it is.

ELLAMAR00 · 09/09/2022 01:19

Have a talk and in good news we have lesbian pandas on peppa pig.xx

Myshitisreal · 09/09/2022 01:59

Op for what is worth I think you've done the right thing. She hasn't actually apologised for anything, she's simply sorry you're upset. Trying to get you to Bury the conversation because you're married to a man and its not relevant now (paraphrasing) is disgusting.

Think to yourself - what do you need her to say to repair things and make up for her homohobic comments? Is she going to say those things? Is there actually anything she could say to fix it? If she does, what will it take and where will these sentiments come from? You talking her into it?

I wouldn't want to further discuss it with her. It's not up to me to persuade her to come round to my way of thinking.

From another bisexual woman married to a man. ♥

a1poshpaws · 09/09/2022 02:42

It's a tricky one. I'm 1000% anti fox hunting, but have a friend who only stopped hunting because she became disabled. I always felt that as she had so many qualities I valued or admired, that I should continue to be as close as ever, as none of us are perfect, and it's for God to judge, not me. Similarly I have a couple who are good, kind, caring friends - but whose motto is "if it ain't white, it ain't right". I still count them as friends and just try to insert points of view that illustrate why that's a really foolish thing to believe.

I guess if I'd learned to be more assertive, I might be more forceful about challenging their point of view - my hunting friend and I used to debate fiercely on the subject and still stay close - but I'm afraid I find the thought of being really direct too overwhelming.

Basically, only you know how much you value this friend; whether or not you feel able to discuss the issue with her; whether you no longer respect her enough to stay friends.

stacyvaron · 09/09/2022 04:57

Tierne · 07/09/2022 12:02

the undertone was clear that she thought the concept of two women together was quite unpleasant

Shes allowed to feel that way for herself

Yes, this exactly

LastWordsOfALiar · 09/09/2022 06:20

I would, and have, ended friendships over them having homophobic and/or racist views.

But I do find it strange you only really were upset because you're bisexual. I'm straight and white and it still is a no brainer to me to end a friendship if they're homophobic or racist.

I get it adds another layer of insult when it's personal, but I couldn't be friends with someone I don't respect. And I don't respect homophobes.

I would also worry about your daughter being best friends with someone growing up in a bigoted household. What does your friend think about other minority groups? Is she otherwise judgemental?

LastWordsOfALiar · 09/09/2022 06:22

a1poshpaws · 09/09/2022 02:42

It's a tricky one. I'm 1000% anti fox hunting, but have a friend who only stopped hunting because she became disabled. I always felt that as she had so many qualities I valued or admired, that I should continue to be as close as ever, as none of us are perfect, and it's for God to judge, not me. Similarly I have a couple who are good, kind, caring friends - but whose motto is "if it ain't white, it ain't right". I still count them as friends and just try to insert points of view that illustrate why that's a really foolish thing to believe.

I guess if I'd learned to be more assertive, I might be more forceful about challenging their point of view - my hunting friend and I used to debate fiercely on the subject and still stay close - but I'm afraid I find the thought of being really direct too overwhelming.

Basically, only you know how much you value this friend; whether or not you feel able to discuss the issue with her; whether you no longer respect her enough to stay friends.

Wow you are friends with racists? I can only take from that, that your moral compass is weak, I'm sorry. How you think that is acceptable is beyond me.

Forgottenmypasswordagain · 09/09/2022 07:22

I would probably buy a copy of en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/If_These_Walls_Could_Talk_2. Anazon carries it now. The story of the 2 women who had a secret relation for decades would break the heart of anyone with a drop of compassion and maybe start her to quit thinking more open mindedly.

Forgottenmypasswordagain · 09/09/2022 07:25

*Amazon, sorry.

1994girl · 09/09/2022 07:48

EmptyHouse0822 · 07/09/2022 11:55

I have a friend and we met because our children go to the same school. It started off as just chatting on the playground, then going out with the children and now we will also go out just the two of us.

We have been friends for about 2.5 years and I would say we are pretty close in that we talk to each other about our problems and we know we can trust each other.

Anyhow, this morning, completely out the blue she made some very negative and distasteful comments about lesbians and although she was trying to pass it off as a joke the undertone was clear that she thought the concept of two women together was quite unpleasant.

The problem is that even though she doesn’t know it, I am bisexual and so her comments made me really uncomfortable. Obviously I’m married with children so she would have no reason at all to suspect I can be attracted to women and so wouldn’t see any reason why her comments would upset me on a personal level.

Even if I wasn’t bisexual I wouldn’t have found her comments acceptable at all.

But now I don’t know what to do. I don’t feel like I can carry on this friendship knowing how disapproving she is of an aspect of my life but as we’ve been friends for so long and out children are good friends it wouldn’t make sense to anyone if I just pulled away from her.

I don’t know how to navigate this and I’m already dreading seeing her on the school run this afternoon.

AIBU to just pull back from the friendship and tell her why?

Just get over it

Mxyzptlk · 09/09/2022 08:02

CountessWindyBottom · 09/09/2022 00:33

I think if it was a genuine friendship then you need to give it more respect than a couple of morning drop-offs and a text or two.Arrange to meet up and hash it out over a bottle of wine. If you still think that there is a deeply entrenched bigotry there then so be it but at least have the decency to sit down and talk about it together.

^^ This.

I'm astonished at all the posts saying dump her immediately.
How is anyone going to learn & change if they are just left alone with their prejudice?
Please think about helping your friend and saving your friendship.

Thisgroupneverceasestoamazeme · 09/09/2022 08:06

Why is it the OPs responsibility to educate this person? It’s completely their choice. Friendships are supposed to be safe and trusting

ThreeRingCircus · 09/09/2022 08:28

I was giving her the benefit of the doubt at first because I thought it was just a poorly worded statement that she doesn't like gay sex but she's doubled down on it in your subsequent conversation. I'm glad you said something and I hope she reflects on this and learns something from it.

latetothefisting · 09/09/2022 08:58

Mxyzptlk · 09/09/2022 08:02

^^ This.

I'm astonished at all the posts saying dump her immediately.
How is anyone going to learn & change if they are just left alone with their prejudice?
Please think about helping your friend and saving your friendship.

Show quote history

Seriously? It shouldn't be on the OP

Friend has already upset OP by saying a key part of her personality and history is grim and disgusting....but you are suggesting OP goes to her house and has a drink while the friend presumably insults her more as she explains why she thinks something perfectly natural is so disgusting, with the onus on OP to try and justify her own existence and history as something that isn't revolting! How can you seriously think thats a good suggestion?

Not to mention the friend has already pretty much she's willing to be friends because OP has put that part of her life behind her now!

If OP was mixed race but white passing, and friend said the idea of a white person having sex with a black one was grim and disgusting you'd think the onus should be on OP to go meet up and have a drink with her to "explain" why OP isn't a second class citizen and why her parents should be allowed to have a relationship? Or if friend had said that she made her husband turn off a tv show about people with downs syndrome or missing limbs falling in love because the idea of people with disabilities having sex is grim and disgusting?

For all of those saying friend is allowed to think this way - well yes there's currently no law against what you think in your own head. Luckily there is a law about discriminating against others out loud, which is what she did. If I said to a colleague who was gay/a different race/disabled etc "the idea of you and your partner having sex together is grim and disgusting," I would rightfully be disciplined.

anon666 · 09/09/2022 09:59

Some people blurt stuff out without giving it a lot of thought. I'd give her the chance to reflect on it before you wrote her off. It might not be a strongly held view, it might be something she's heard other people say.

AgnestaVipers · 09/09/2022 10:42

It's alright to not fill the silence (between the texts). Let her think about what she has done. You are clear about what you expect of your friends - at least, more tact, at best, a bigotry-free zone. Not filling the space with drama and flouncings allows the whole thing to percolate, and offers her a Golden Bridge.
the-conflictexpert.com/2019/03/03/giving-your-opponent-a-golden-bridge/

She will either want to distance herself from you because she is homophobic or she will want to address her ignorance on this issue. You can choose whether to be gracious enough to allow this to happen. You are not obliged to - especially if you feel too vulnerable in doing so.

The sense that people are irredeemably bigoted and must be punished (banished, silenced, shamed) is so 2022, isn't it?

The ability to change one's mind is the highest form of self development, or critical thinking. I think everyone can change. Except, probably, narcissists and sociopaths.

EnterFunnyNameHere · 09/09/2022 11:04

My mind is boggled by PP saying its just a difference of opinion. I'm Caucasian, but if I had a friend who I found out was racist, they would not be my friend anymore. I'm straight, but I wouldn't be friends with a homophobe.

It's not about simply not agreeing on every facet of life, it's having diametrically opposed opinions to me. Even if their veiws didnt directly reflect on me (which in this cae they do for the OP).

pikiwop54 · 09/09/2022 11:23

"Similarly I have a couple who are good, kind, caring friends - but whose motto is "if it ain't white, it ain't right"."

Yeah they are not good kind or caring.

Calphurnia88 · 09/09/2022 11:31

pikiwop54 · 09/09/2022 11:23

"Similarly I have a couple who are good, kind, caring friends - but whose motto is "if it ain't white, it ain't right"."

Yeah they are not good kind or caring.

What she said ☝🏻

Gwlondon · 09/09/2022 11:53

Give her a bit of time. Thinking about other people having sex is weird. She might never have thought of it before that program. I think it’s right that you told her so she can think quicker about how it would feel to hear her express her views. I think you have handled it well.

Also you know she married young and with one partner so her view of the world has started in a different place.

TedMullins · 09/09/2022 12:02

Mxyzptlk · 09/09/2022 08:02

^^ This.

I'm astonished at all the posts saying dump her immediately.
How is anyone going to learn & change if they are just left alone with their prejudice?
Please think about helping your friend and saving your friendship.

Show quote history

er, no. I’m astonished at all the posts saying give her a chance. No matter the history of the friendship or strength of it, any bigoted views would immediately make me lose all respect for the person. They may be perfectly capable of being nice and friendly and fun but a core part of them as a person is holding objectionable prejudices. If you don’t think that’s a dealbreaker then you’re tacitly condoning it and that’s how prejudice continues.

AgnestaVipers · 09/09/2022 12:41

any bigoted views would immediately make me lose all respect for the person. They may be perfectly capable of being nice and friendly and fun but a core part of them as a person is holding objectionable prejudices.

Honestly, I find this approach utterly childish. How on earth do you think people stopped their lazy stereotyping and bigotry over the years? By being avoided as irredeemably evil, or by meeting LGB/PoC over the years and realising they are ok actually?

All the bravery of those interacting with those bigots is utterly disregarded by this purist nonsense.