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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

my boyfriend likes Andrew Tate....emotional support please?

320 replies

PinkStarAtNight · 06/09/2022 22:12

so I only really came to know of Andrew Tate a few weeks ago when he got banned from the internet and it was on LBC. The way they described comments that he said reminded me of a guy I had overheard my boyfriend laughing at when he was watching TikTok. I had raised an eyebrow at what I heard and my boyfriend had laughed and said 'he's saying everything tongue in cheek, but to be honest a lot of what he says is true.'

I didn't think too much of it until I heard the show on LBC saying he had been banned for his misogynistic comments and harmful influences on young people and they quoted some of what he said...I went to my boyfriend and asked him if this was the guy he sometimes watches clips of. He said yes, it was. We then had a conversation about him being banned and boyfriend said he didn't think he should have been banned, because its cancel culture and all Andrew Tate did was express his opinions. I said that he was spouting misogynistic comments and it was awful/could have a negative impact on young men/as a society we can't allow those sorts of comments etc so of course he should have been banned.

In the last couple of weeks we have had numerous conversations about it, where we have both been tried to be calm and listen to each other's opinions. His argument is that Andrew Tate is standing up for men everywhere who feel oppressed by society and feel that their mental health issues are not recognised or taken seriously. He quoted how men are more likely to commit suicide and don't feel able to talk about their feelings, and women just want to try and 'fix' them by using methods that help women, like talking...but men don't like talking, it doesn't work for them, the thing that works for them is to 'go into' their masculinity.

Recently boyfriend has started saying things like 'women take advange of men', 'women are like annoying children', 'women want to work less than men' etc etc etc...he never said these things before watching Andrew Tate. He's says that Andrew Tate has 'set men free' and made it so they can finally speak their minds. And the fact that he got cancelled as soon as he did that, shows that society isn't ready to listen to men's problems and we (the women, because apparently women have taken control of society) just want to "shut them down". He gets very angry and emotive about this.

After me trying to talk to him more about the problem with some of the things Andrew Tate says, Boyfriend said that when it came to the misogynistic comments the media have misquoted him. So - tonight I sat down and watched some of his interviews on YouTube. I could barely stand to sit through them. The stuff that comes out of his mouth is vile. I started to send boyfriend messages quoting what Andrew Tate was saying in the interview I was watching...

for example:
"a father who is around for his child is like a second mother...a mother is there to keep a child alive, a father is there to make an impact"

"if you're there all the time you're gonna lose to an degree you're mystery....

"the biggest mistake fathers make is that they let the woman convince them that to be a good father they have to be there all the time....a man used to be at war or down in the coal mines...now he's at home changing nappies like a punk"

"For a female to retain her attractiveness to a man she has to retain a air of mystery..."

"If we accept biology no man is completely a one woman man...the male evolutionary imperative is not to have just one female....now there are dudes out there who will disagree with me but those are dudes that have got low testosterone and they ain't got no money and they ain't nothing...'

'Women are essentially like children"

"Chicks don't pay for anything"

I sent these quotes to my boyfriend, and pointed out to him to that in fact his idol had just insulted him, because my boyfriend firmly believes in being faithful in a relationship and never cheating...and yet Andrew Tate says that my boyfriend thinks that way because he 'has low testosterone and is nothing'.

Boyfriend has now blocked me, after sending the above messages to him.

I feel so upset and confused. I wish I could talk to my girlfriends but tbh they already don't like him very much and if I'm overreacting I don't want to get them all riled up and make it a thing for them to bring up when we get together, but I need a bit of a hand hold so I'm coming here.

Be gentle please. I don't know if IABU or what to do, I just feel upset/angry/confused. Maybe I should be trying to understand his point of view more but I just can't get my head around it.

OP posts:
TheSmallAssassin · 07/09/2022 00:47

Set him free.

Skyvemind · 07/09/2022 00:57

OP I’m sorry that you’re so torn up by this. I don’t know how old you are, or how long you’ve been in the relationship. Both these things are relevant in terms of your life experience and experience of relationships. And I understand how bewildering and disappointing it is to see someone change (or embrace extremist ideas) so dramatically.
Achatavendre above is compassionate but nails it in terms of how and why this ideology is raking in men for whom life isn’t delivering. They don’t feel on top, they don’t feel like the dominant sex class, so they’re desperate to pin the blame on women and their movement for equality that has now ‘gone too far’ (what does that even mean, in terms of human rights 🙄).
So it’s like any relationship. It’s not always easy to extricate yourself because you want to give him the benefit of the doubt, believe that it’s a passing moment of madness completely uncharacteristic of him and he will come out of this deluded phase and revert to the nice caring chap you fell for. But do you really want to wait and see? And suffer his nonsense in the meantime?
Even if he is genuinely suffering from poor mental health, low self esteem, frustration, that doesn’t excuse his blind spot for AT and his harmful rhetoric.
The fact that he can’t work this out and has been so easily radicalised means that he ultimately lacks critical thinking skills and is easily influenced. He may mature out of this, but how long are you prepared to wait, and what if he doesn’t?
Even leaving your self esteem to one side and believing that he can be rescued from this z list celebrity hate guru’s pathetic grand standing, your boyfriend is not your job to fix! Knowing what angry men who swallow incel propaganda can do to their wives/girlfriends/partners, you really cannot stay with someone who isn’t totally against everything AH claims to stand for. If he is for AT, then he isn’t for you.
My teenage daughters are having to push back on this crap at school. For the girls coming behind you, 🙏🏼 stand up to it.

stevalnamechanger · 07/09/2022 01:05

He sounds awful . Lucky escape

urghnotthisagain · 07/09/2022 01:07

Why are you defending this prick?

MrsTerryPratchett · 07/09/2022 01:22

I've worked in men's and women's support services. You know who 90% of the support staff in both are? Women. If MH services are shit it's because men don't do their share. Invariably when men talk about how bad MH care for men is, they mentally picture women doing the actual work. Well we already are.

You aren't your BF's designated support human. If he wants the world to be better, he can help make it that way. But not by supporting and agreeing with a misogynist arsehole.

JestersTear · 07/09/2022 01:58

Oh, this must be so difficult for you.

You've been with this guy for 4 years, I think you said and has he shown any hint of this attitude before he started watching AT? There is clearly just enough of what AT's saying to resonate with your BF's views deep down, might only be a tiny amount of stuff (yes, I DO feel like that, so he's right about other stuff... sort of thing) and, he seems to be taking your disagreements with his new views as proof that 'women are shutting men down' even though what you're trying to do is have an intelligent conversation with the man you love, the man who's changed.
I can't see him coming back from this, to be honest. He's following the pied piper here and being led away and it sounds like there's very little you're going to be able to do about it without being accused of 'shutting him down' or 'not allowing him to be himself' or whatever. The fact that he's blocked you is speaking volumes, unfortunately.

I feel that he's only going to get worse and as others have said, this may start to impact on you in more ways than just heavy discussions. Hell, he's blocked you over it, because you disagree...

I'm afraid you might have to prepare yourself for the fact that this is who he is now and for your own sake, you may want to have a serious think about what you want to do going forward.

CatsandFish · 07/09/2022 01:59

I've stopped talking to my friends about him now because I have to sit through them trying to convince me to leave him

This says it all. You'd rather stay with a hateful misogynist who thinks you are worthless as a woman, just in order so your friends aren't right. Your friends are trying to make you see reason. Listen to them. Have some self respect. No feminist with any self respect would stay with the, er, specimen that is your boyfriend. He has shown you who he is. When someone shows you who they are, believe them. Don't stay with him for another minute. You are worth so much more.

EdgeOfACoin · 07/09/2022 06:00

OP, read back what you have written. Now pretend a friend had written it. Would you encourage a friend to stay with a man like the one you have described?

He's confusing you because in many ways I assume he's still the nice guy you fell in love with. I imagine you probably still have fun together. But I've seen it said on here before: imagine someone makes you a beautiful cup of tea. The best tea you'll ever taste. And then this person finishes off by putting a turd in the tea and giving it to you to drink.

Would you drink an otherwise perfect cup of tea with a turd in it? Furthermore, if you fished out the turd would you still want to drink the tea?

This incel nonsense is your boyfriend's turd.

Noonoo88 · 07/09/2022 06:19

BobMortimersPocketMeat · 06/09/2022 23:46

Thank you for all the replies. I don't really know what to do but typing everything out helps.

If you really don’t know what to do then you need to work on your self esteem. You should value yourself more than you do if you think this is a suitable person to be your partner in life. Partners are equal and respect each other. This person isn’t fit to be any woman’s partner.

Couldn't have said it any better! 🙌🏻

Shoxfordian · 07/09/2022 06:24

He’s blocked you so treat that as the end of the relationship and be happy you’re no longer dating a misogynist

pippinsleftleg · 07/09/2022 06:28

What are the other problems in your relationship that you have discussed with your friends?

Boreded · 07/09/2022 06:32

PinkStarAtNight · 06/09/2022 22:52

My boyfriend honestly isn't usually a misogynist! We've been together four years now and its only in the last few months that he's started to talk like this

He does have issues with anxiety and the fact he keeps saying that men are more likely to take their own lives/be depressed and not reach out and then saying that AT has 'given him a voice' makes me think that this must be driven by some sort of misguided way to try and fix his issues, or talk about the issues in general. Thats why I'm trying to listen to him and understand, because in other ways he is a kind person and a decent man

Its just this that we keep disagreeing on...he keeps saying that men should be able to talk about their issues but society keeps shutting them down....I then say that AT was only shut down because of the misogynistic things he says and the way to talk about men's problems is by calmly and respectfully putting your opinion across and having a civilised conversation. He then says 'women don't do that. Women have attacked men, women now have more power than men, women get to talk about their problems as much as they want and call men 'dicks' and 'bastards' and they get away with it, so now men are fighting back. Get used to it.'

I love this person but he's changed in the last few months. I feel like tearing my hair out and screaming. My mum's advice was 'wait for him to grow up a bit'. But how long do I wait???

Don’t wait, bin him.

find another one

PrimarilyParented · 07/09/2022 06:46

Dump him and report him somehow as being at risk of being indoctrinated into the incel movement. Sounds extreme I know but we had prevent training from the police at work at this guys name was mentioned and the stuff your boyfriend is spouting suggests he’s reading into the movement quite significantly.

He won’t be incriminated but needs help.

Herejustforthisone · 07/09/2022 06:55

He’s done you a favour by blocking you:

Your friends don’t like him.

He’s chosen Andrew state over you.

He’s a misogynistic twat.

He’s chosen to block you rather than communicate with you.

Honestly, you’ll get over a gimp like him. Block him back so he can’t get hold of you when he decides to lift his block and get on with your life. Be thankful you’ve got no ties to him.

GreenGreenGrassBlue · 07/09/2022 06:56

He’s making you question yourself. You know what you’re talking about and you know he’s wrong. What is it about him your friends don’t like?

He’s only going to get worse. All you’ve written down is not a misrepresentation of him. It’s his beliefs.

leave him be in his own warped world.

Shortpoet · 07/09/2022 06:59

It’s a shame he didn’t seem out an organisation such as Men’s Sheds menssheds.org.uk to help with with his anxiety and loneliness rather than watching AT.

But anyone who says “feminism has gone too far” is not going to be a good partner. Too far for what?

Herejustforthisone · 07/09/2022 07:00

You’re not misrepresenting him @PinkStarAtNight. He’s just a nasty sexist prick.

Listen to your friends and find someone that doesn’t hate women and blame them (you) for all his problems.

Sunnyqueen · 07/09/2022 07:08

Let him know that ATs main fan base is incels 😂 the funny thing is all the sort of 'alpha' ish males I know (so go gym, drive range rovers, audis and bm's with massive watches, stay out all night from their partners and families every weekend that sort of thing) I bet none of them even know who Andrew tate is and would be bored in about 5 seconds by the whole conversation... Even if they did know most of them have daughters so I think even them would struggle with a lot of tates view of women.

Novum · 07/09/2022 07:10

I love this person but he's changed in the last few months. I feel like tearing my hair out and screaming. My mum's advice was 'wait for him to grow up a bit'. But how long do I wait???

I wouldn't bother, to be honest. I don't think this is a matter of being immature, I think it's a matter of being easily influenced and not using any sort of critical thinking. Yes, he may come to realise that Tate is wrong, but I would always be worrying about the next fad that he will fall for.

TwowaystoUrmston · 07/09/2022 07:17

OP I have been with my DH over 20 years, have DC and a whole life together and I would still be running for the hills if he started spouting this shit. You're 4 years in and it sounds like you could extricate yourself fairly easily so why on earth are you sticking around to watch this guy's descent into woman-hating madness? You are literally signing up to a relationship with someone who now hates you, along with all women, seriously what are you doing? He isn't the man you thought he was, whatever his 'reasons' for believing AT's nonsense he has been sucked down the rabbit hole and you can't bring him back.

IssaBaby · 07/09/2022 07:18

This, is what radicalisation looks like.

Please cut your losses. Not all men are like this. I cant name a single man in my life who doesn't think that AT is rotting gutter scum.

IssaBaby · 07/09/2022 07:20

Also. Just for a moment truly LISTEN to what he is saying.
You are a woman. Every single nasty thing he says, he is saying it ABOUT YOU.
This is personal. Take it personally. Kick this dumbass to the kerb.

dottiedodah · 07/09/2022 07:20

Well I haven't heard of him but it looks like I haven't missed much! I Always think friends are a good judge of boyfriends really.if they didn't like him ,seems like they have a point.do you really want to marry someone who doesn't want to change a nappy and belongs in the 50s! Even 1850s !

Goosygandy · 07/09/2022 07:24

wellhelloitsme · 06/09/2022 23:59

Men who think this way interpret any signs of reducing discrimination as overwhelming evidence that discrimination against women has gone and in facts its now the other way round.

Yep.

When you're accustomed to privilege, equality feels like oppression.

And what's scary is, we are nowhere close to true 'equality' in terms of how we are valued, protected and rewarded within society as a sex class.

But the progress that has been made so far already feels like oppression and 'unfair' to some men.

So true.

Can you imagine a female Jeffrey Epstein, Bill Cosby, Harvey Weinstein or even Noel Clarke? Are there any groups of women systematically exploiting young boys, like in Rotherham? Are men killed in honour killings? Are men deprived of sexual pleasure as women are through FGM?

Men have 2.24 more speaking roles in films than women according to the Geena Davies Institute. They're over represented in Parliament, the Judiciary and the Media. Women do far more domestic drudgery than men, even when they work full time.

There is by no means equality yet. However, some men want continued subjugation for women. They're trying to put the genie back in the bottle. I think that's in large part the drive against abortion and reproductive rights in the USA.

I feel for men with fragile mental health but I would argue this is often not caused by women but by toxic masculinity. If men were no longer encouraged to value themselves by the power they have over others and more for the personal qualities they have and the values they hold, there would be a lot fewer issues.