To be shocked at how many of today's children behave?

[PlutoCritter]

Let me start by saying i'm in my early 30s and I definitely don't come from a "children are seen and not heard"/military-family type background where children weren't allowed to speak. my parents were quite laid back in some ways. however:

we've had our first child and this year i've started to make my first mum friends. (no dads, it's very traditional around here, all either SAHMs or part-time working mums as the primary carer, in a new fairly middle class area which we've only been living in for the last year or so, so don't have strong social networks yet.)

I've only really started to host "play dates" in the last few months and very often the baby's parents bring older DC along,which I thought was great!

So it's 2x babies plus (say) a 4 year old and a 5 year old. or a couple of 3 year olds plus a 7 year old. most recently, a 5 and a 6 year old with 2 babies visited.

and JESUS CHRIST, the average bahaviour is feral!

Most have been jumping on the sofa (to the point I thought it was going to break springs and had to tell them to calm it down myself eventually), one child going into our bedroom and looking through the wardrobe (!!) when going to the bathroom, one was repeatedly sneaking into the kitchen where i was making lunch and stealing stuff from the fridge 10 minutes before i was due to serve it, lunch just smashed up into a ball of mess and not eaten by older kids (5-7 years) regularly. Getting up halfway through a meal to run off and play with toys at age 8. Constant whining for snacks and sugar drinks. One refused to drink anything at all during a 2hr visit because we only had milk or water (i literally had no juice in the house to offer). Stealing food from other people's plates. Constantly interrupting adults having a chat - not while being ignored, just as the normal way of communicating. Ramming metal car toys into the wall so the wallpaper is scratched and the plaster has dents in it in the living room.

A few days ago, one little "darling" decided it would be funny to remove all the sofa cushions and drag them into the dining room so no one could sit down until it was all fixed as we helped the littler DC take shoes and coats off, then the %/6 (ish) child stood giggling while the adults just sorted it. if i'd done that as a kid as a guest my mum would have brought the wrath of god down on me there and then!

I genuinely don't believe a lot of this would have been accepted when I was a kid, and the first couple of play dates, i thought we'd just met a couple of bad apples, but it's now 5-6 visits with 3 different families. i'm not happy to accept further playdates at home if it's going to be like this and people think it's normal. DH is the same, he's been shocked at the state of the house when people have left and on the times he's been here, he's sick of people not telling their kids how to behave as a guest and feels similarly uncomfortable at e.g. having to intervene when a child has been doing something dangerous or damaing while the parent sits and ignores it.

please tell me this isn't normal????

(let me be clear, the kids seem perfectly NICE as children, and they play nicely, e.g. sharing toys, it's just the general disrespect for adults or breaking things that i am finding absolutely shocking.)

@ddl1 😁.

Children have always misbehaved and adults have always considered that modern youth is dangerously out-of-control. If you look at the public school revolts that used to occur frequently in the 17th and 18th century and the frequent descriptions of poor behaviour by indulged children in the work of Jane Austin and the Bronte sisters, it becomes obvious that this is not a new phenomenon.

But all is not lost as there is some evidence that the current generation of teenagers and young adults is more responsible and risk averse than previous generations. They don't drink to excess, smoke and are usually health and socially-conscious. They're not interested in rebelling and instead are more focused on achieving academically. So things seem to be getting better in some ways.

I have a 6yo and almost 2yo and wouldn't allow the vast majority of that behaviour. The not eating or drinking wouldn't be an issue for me as long as they weren't rude.
Why don't have you organise play dates when the older children are at nursery or school?

A mutually accepted standard of behaviour has become impossible due to the multifarious standards from multifarious sources. It might be possible to square that circle but it will require brave souls to raise their heads above the parapet.

I used to look after a neighbour's two boys on a regular basis. Delightful little souls, but omg they were savages. No manners, no volume control, no respect for property. On their first visit, they went to my husband's study at the top of the house and started throwing his books down the stairs. To my credit I didn't scream "wtf are you doing at them". But we had a long talk about other people's houses and belongings. They got it, but it was clear from the conversation that no one had ever talked this through with them before. Ditto not touching anything electrical, not going into our bedroom and opening drawers and so on. The parents practiced "attachment parenting" so the kids slept with them, and were never told off, even gently. The older boy (then aged 6) told me that he liked coming to our house because "he liked the rules" and made a little chart with pictures of some of the things I had said they weren't to do - he was desperate for some kind of order. His own house was a chaotic mess.
I honestly worry about the number of feral "nice" kids I see/know. They're parents are benignly neglectful under the guise of being easygoing. It can't be good in the long run.

I would say most children don't behave like this. Did their parents stop them? I notice a lot of indiscipline from parents. They don't want to control them. My pet hate was parents allowing their children to interrupt adult conversation.

I must admit I’ve had similar - once had a some friends round with their DC, same age as my DC (then aged 6 and 3). I knew them from the eldest kids being at nursery together and we’d hung out a few times at soft play/museums etc.

The friends’ kids had every single toy out dumped on the floor. Throwing jigsaw bits round and tipping game pieces everywhere. Running upstairs and throwing stuff down. Parents just sat and chatted and did nothing! I was shocked - I obviously don’t expect perfect behaviour and immaculate tidy rooms when kids are over, but it was ridiculous, they didn’t get another invite.

Obviously no repeat playdates at your home. Did you call out the behaviour at the time, ask the respective parent to prevent their child's misbehaviour? Your home, your rules, so you needed to lead the way, we don't open the fridge, take food without asking, etc.

I’ve never experienced any behaviour like this at play dates. Not even close! All the kids we’ve had over - and there have been dozens and dozens over the years - have been sweet, kind and respectful.

@cherish123 thats my pet hate too. My mother in law is the WORST for allowing this to happen. My kids interrupt her ALL the time because they know she’ll allow it. I’ve said to her before to stop it because it’s rude of both the kids and her.

Not normal at all. But there’s a certain type of parent who thinks any boundaries for kids is bad, they’re just expressing themselves (the translation for this is shit parent, can’t be arsed but try and gloss over it be claiming to be free thinkers).

just tell the kids off. Kids need boundaries, right and wrong, black and white, they haven’t the mental capacity for nuance. Once they have a framework they can explore it.

these people are lazy parents

stay away from the woke parents, it’s always them. It’s why I tend to mix with Tory voting parents who think Mermaids should be banned snd the leaders in jail. It’s usually a good way of weeding out parents.

So you have 3 DIFFERENT families at your house where ALL the kids are ferrel?

That's very unusual. In all my 8 years of been a mum I've never had this but to be honest I wouldn't host random people so quickly into my home. Your post is not normal.

I haven't RTFT so sorry if its been said before but I think this age group missed out on a lot of early socialisation during lockdown, which could explain it in the 3-5 age group a bit? Less so the older ones. My DS is 7 and knows exactly how to behave nicely.

Ive had the same experience and have cut back on playdates as a result. Lots of children have zero boundaries imposed at home - parents still using toddler techniques like distraction with 5 & 6 year olds, never telling them off or imposing consequences.

My biggest grumble is school aged children who are totally disobedient! You ask them to do something (eg tidy up) or stop doing something (jumping on the sofa) and they either ignore you or answer back. My kids know full well I'm in charge and if i ask them to do it, they do it!!

I do think as well there's a breed of parent now who won't do anything that results in their child crying. These are the kids who are terrible at going to bed, have no boundaries etc. Because actually often when you properly impose consequences, they aren't happy about it! So yes they cry! And learn not to repeat that behaviour. If they are never upset about the consequences you probably aren't imposing the right ones to deter bad behaviour.

Yes exactly milkyyay, I’ve known parents who’ve openly said this, that they don’t want to make their child cry so they sit around trying to beg, persuade or bribe them even when the child needs to be stopped immediately e,g, is hitting or destroying stuff. It’s as if they’ve got mixed up and think the fact that we’ve generally moved on from smacking children means any kind of upsetting a child at all is abuse. But small kids cry when they get told no or get something removed, that’s what they do!

To be fair I think some of these parents are not lazy, they’re actually terrified that any kind of strictness or upsetting their child at all will mean they’re an abusive, bad parent. I’ve actually stood in a play park and had a conversation with a mum who was terrified to tell her 3yo to stop pushing mine off all the equipment. She looked like a rabbit in the headlights when I (politely and friendly not aggressively) asked her to step in. I said “you’re her mum, you can tell her that’s not ok” and she said “I can’t… she’ll cry”. I said in that case I would tell her and the mum nodded and actually wanted me to. That way she wasn’t being “mean” to her child and could be the good guy.