To be shocked at how many of today's children behave?

[PlutoCritter]

Let me start by saying i'm in my early 30s and I definitely don't come from a "children are seen and not heard"/military-family type background where children weren't allowed to speak. my parents were quite laid back in some ways. however:

we've had our first child and this year i've started to make my first mum friends. (no dads, it's very traditional around here, all either SAHMs or part-time working mums as the primary carer, in a new fairly middle class area which we've only been living in for the last year or so, so don't have strong social networks yet.)

I've only really started to host "play dates" in the last few months and very often the baby's parents bring older DC along,which I thought was great!

So it's 2x babies plus (say) a 4 year old and a 5 year old. or a couple of 3 year olds plus a 7 year old. most recently, a 5 and a 6 year old with 2 babies visited.

and JESUS CHRIST, the average bahaviour is feral!

Most have been jumping on the sofa (to the point I thought it was going to break springs and had to tell them to calm it down myself eventually), one child going into our bedroom and looking through the wardrobe (!!) when going to the bathroom, one was repeatedly sneaking into the kitchen where i was making lunch and stealing stuff from the fridge 10 minutes before i was due to serve it, lunch just smashed up into a ball of mess and not eaten by older kids (5-7 years) regularly. Getting up halfway through a meal to run off and play with toys at age 8. Constant whining for snacks and sugar drinks. One refused to drink anything at all during a 2hr visit because we only had milk or water (i literally had no juice in the house to offer). Stealing food from other people's plates. Constantly interrupting adults having a chat - not while being ignored, just as the normal way of communicating. Ramming metal car toys into the wall so the wallpaper is scratched and the plaster has dents in it in the living room.

A few days ago, one little "darling" decided it would be funny to remove all the sofa cushions and drag them into the dining room so no one could sit down until it was all fixed as we helped the littler DC take shoes and coats off, then the %/6 (ish) child stood giggling while the adults just sorted it. if i'd done that as a kid as a guest my mum would have brought the wrath of god down on me there and then!

I genuinely don't believe a lot of this would have been accepted when I was a kid, and the first couple of play dates, i thought we'd just met a couple of bad apples, but it's now 5-6 visits with 3 different families. i'm not happy to accept further playdates at home if it's going to be like this and people think it's normal. DH is the same, he's been shocked at the state of the house when people have left and on the times he's been here, he's sick of people not telling their kids how to behave as a guest and feels similarly uncomfortable at e.g. having to intervene when a child has been doing something dangerous or damaing while the parent sits and ignores it.

please tell me this isn't normal????

(let me be clear, the kids seem perfectly NICE as children, and they play nicely, e.g. sharing toys, it's just the general disrespect for adults or breaking things that i am finding absolutely shocking.)

I definitely think kids have less respect than they used to for adults.

I include my own kids in this observation.

The main thing that gets me is the lack of parent intervention. Kids do misbehave, what I loathe are the excuses, if a parent does what they can to resolved it then I am fine. It’s when they barely acknowledge their kids behaving like this I get wound up, more so if they use excuses and im
sorry the covid excuses wind me up the most. Yep 2 years at home, lack of socialisation was seriously crap but don’t let your child hit someone or wreck something and then look at me and say it’s cos of covid and do sweet FA, just attempt to parent, have a conversation or consequence but don’t blame the world around you.

Last year I had a stall at the local church Christmas Fayre, which is in a posh area of London. There were lots of children there running around hysterically in and out of the various stalls, whilst there parents just stood there ignoring them and chatting. I had some handmade xmas decs, which were glittery Pinecones, cinammon sticks, orange slices, all on sticks which I had arranged in a vase like a large bouquet. I saw a boy of around eight eyeing it up from a distance. He then ran towards it, jumped on it and knocked it over sending it all flying every where. The boy then proceeded to jump around with his younger brother looking very pleased with himself whilst I looked on in horror. His father who was quite posh, then came over, apologised profusely whilst never saying a word to his son, then turned around and said in a jolly voice, come on you two, lets go and get your face painted! I was also selling hand blown glass baubles a woman came over with her baby and allowed her to pick up a bauble and squeeze it hard in her hand, after around a minute of watching this I then said I really don't think that's a good idea, they're very delicate and could shatter in her hand - she just looked at me and walked off! I found the whole experience with these children absoulutely frustrating, and put me off from ever doing another fayre there.

Yeah, in practice this kind of parenting = fat kid addicted to minecraft. Because guess what? Pushing boundaries (barf) means trying to get candy and screens when you are 9.

My kids wouldn't do that but ALL of their cousins would.
Their behaviour is largely ignored by their parents (three different sets) for an easy life. Which ultimately leads to a much harder life, really.

Sounds like a cult!

Sounds terrible overall, but I think the age of the children needs to be taken into account. Some of the behaviour you've described is perfectly normal in a 3 year old, for example. At this age they typically haven't properly learnt correct social strategies such as not interrupting, and they will innocently wander into bedrooms (to explore) if allowed. This is normal behaviour for that age group. Parents should be keeping an eye on them, of course.

It felt like one!

The Chokey from Matilda!

🤣🤣🤣

That’s really not normal. We had loads of kids over here and only one misbehaved to that extent, most were lovely. The misbehaving child was not invited back.

I agree with this. Friend's DC when young (now 24) wouldn't eat e.g. tomatoes - but it was almost like, she can't/won't eat them so don't force them. Okaaayyy...

As a child I didn't like chicken but only because of where it came from but ate most other things and wasn't given the choice to be fussy!

I actually had this the other week with DNephew. Very rude and then told me he didn't like me (he's 4 but very advanced). Apparently he's said this to his grandmother (his DM's mum). I told him I'd take away a toy I'd bought him.

His DM does some form of gentle parenting I think. His DF (my brother) does do this too a bit but is firmer.

So he was left to think and apologise for upsetting me... my DM (we were visiting her) did explain to him why he shouldn't say this.

I mean generally we get on well but his DM doesn't like to say if he's been naughty etc. He did used to get tantrums but she ends up e.g. carrying him a lot - he can walk and is tall and active. It's almost like anything for a quiet life with her.

SIL's parenting is in complete contrast to her own DB's and his DW's parenting with kids - they're firm but boundaries, not gentle parenting really at all but nice but the DW there definitely wouldn't be carrying her children and likes prompt bedtimes etc!

As a child, I was taught that it was polite to clear your plate and would essentially force down food even if I wasn't hungry or was almost retching because that was what being "good" required at that time. Not eating food provided by your host was unacceptable. As an adult, I will eat almost anything but there are still some foods I have incredibly unpleasant associations with from my childhood and I am terrible at recognising when I'm full because I'm so used to clearing my plate however much food is on it.

It is absolutely none of my business what my children's friends or friends' children eat nor am I responsible for providing them with a healthy diet. If they don't eat tomatoes, they don't eat tomatoes - why should that bother me? If I know that they will eat pizza or spaghetti, then that is what I will usually serve because it's no skin off my nose to make them feel at home by providing an option which is safe and uncontroversial. If they refuse food and are hungry, we only have limited junk food in the house, but there's usually fruit, toast and crackers kicking about.

As for my own DC, just like me they go through stages of eating everything and stages of being off their food and I really don't see it as the end of the world or as them being "fussy". I haven't felt much like eating in the hot weather recently and have preferred to snack on picnic food rather than eat hot food, so it doesn't strike me as a big deal if my DC refuses curries, burgers and roast meals and prefers just to have a plate of some cheese, bread and carrot sticks, or a slice of toast and peanut butter. I think people can get too focused on what children eat, in a way we don't do to adults.

I think this so subjective …

This was me:

“Because children who are too well-behaved and who are never allowed to push the boundaries tend not to do so well later on in life.”

Result=

I am in my 40s and still afraid of lots of people and situations. I often stay silent when something shit happens to me or my family. I lose opportunities. i am certainly not the most successful person.

I try to mitigate the above to get through life but it’s hard to work against the strict reflexes you’ve been brought up with.

The fear of doing things wrong never fucking goes away and it’s exhausting.

So I think it’s fine to have children that are polite for them to know boundaries but also for kids to know the world won’t implode if they cross them…

I wouldn't put up with that kind of behaviour in someone else's house from my DC but I can see how it can happen with younger children, especially when they're in a new environment and around other children. We recently had a friend round with her baby (younger than my DC) and I found my eldest (4) starting to act up (trying to talk over us, whining for snacks, snatching toys off the babies) and I think it's an attention thing. I didn't put up with that behaviour however. I've noticed when we've gone round to a friend's house that my DC wants to go explore and see what's in other rooms/cupboards etc but I don't let her and make sure I follow her if she disappears off or is too quiet. I do think it needs to be kept in hand so kids don't think it's acceptable.

YANBU. I work in charity retail and the number of times we have to ask kids not to climb on shelves, run (full speed) up and down the aisles, not open boxes etc. is shocking. Parents seem content to stick their kids next to our toys while they do their shopping and then leave the toys all over the floor as a major trip hazard, they also get annoyed with me if I try to tidy up while the kids are "playing". I should also not have to tell your kid not to play on the exercise bike or with the DUMBELLS.

I was up at the shops earlier. Some event in the community centre had just finished and a lot of elderly people were coming out and having to side step a child flying aroind the path on her scooter. There was a near miss with a man using a walking support and when their mother drew near a woman said "could your little girl be a bit more careful. She nearly caused an accident".
The mother looked completely unconcerned and then said mildly "Lily, mind the ladies".

When I came out of the shop Lily was still flying around, and people were still digging out of her way while her mother stood chatting to someone and ignoring her.

How is a child with a mother like that supposed to learn manners?

Dodging out of her way, that should have said.

I hear what you say and agree with it.

However, I do know a few DC who won't or don't try certain foods, because they don't want to. Their parents don't encourage them or let them have beige foods as the PP says. Or the kids demand certain foods (e.g. snacks) and refuse mealtimes.

I know kids are fussy and you shouldn't force them to eat things - I didn't like fish much as a kid so wouldn't eat it, now eat it breaded or some seafood. DM was put off gooseberries by being forced to eat them as a child and being sick.

I just think quite a few children need the healthy balance which @CaptainBeakyandhisband says - so many kids these days snack and then aren't hungry when it comes to mealtimes or as @CaptainBeakyandhisband says would happily live on chocolate/sweets if allowed. Input into choosing and preparing food is great and is healthy.

Children are raised by adults ! It’s not the child’s behavior but the parents lack of, or unwillingness to say no to them.

Indeed @GonnaGetGoingReturns - as an adult I frequently have to choose less exciting but ultimately more nutritious food over the deliciousness of processed food engineered to be ultimately satisfying. Kids are no different, except they lack the maturity and knowledge to reinforce those choices. If a child knows they will not go hungry but will be allowed to fill up on delicious but nutritionally void foods later then why would they eat dinner?! So I’m quite adamant that my children will eat (at least some of) their dinner, despite complaints. I’m pretty sure that some children today do not have any idea what it’s like to be hungry, and that’s a problem.

Well said.

I'm sure (due to news coverage etc) that many children don't know what it's like to go hungry - we saw hungry children in different parts of the world on appeals on the news growing up, I don't think (and it shouldn't have to be necessary) many of today's children are aware of this. Maybe they've heard of Food Banks or see them in the supermarket but I don't know if they make the connection between no/less food and starvation.

My kids are now 11 and 12 and let me tell you, you are in for a shocking surprise as the years pass. We are also pretty laid back, we regularly host nerf wars in the garden, Easter, Christmas, Halloween, birthday parties with messy activities and bouncy castles etc, water fights and whatnot. But the behaviour we have seen over the years from kids with zero rules and boundaries enforced, and parents who will sit on their backsides and let their kids tornado through other people's homes, breaking toys, ripping books, taking others drinks and food, licking food and putting it back, discarding rubbish on the floor. I appreciate the gentle parenting attitude having not had the best childhood, but this is not gentle parenting. This is a complete lack of rules and boundaries and at some points a complete lack of parental awareness. As others have said take your play dates outdoors to parks, because then those children's parents are responsible for them, and you are less likely to have to step in when they are out of control. It's exhausting. You will try your best to organise fun days in/out for your child and their friends but you will end up feeling resentful because some parents will continue to allow their child to be rude and disrespectful in your home.

I thought of this thread today as I popped into the supermarket cafe for a cup of tea. There was a little girl jumping up and down on her seat squealing while Mum and Grandma (?) both scrolled their phones separately. Taking absolutely no notice of her whatsoever. That is surely as much of a problem as the misinterpretation of gentle parenting.

All very annoying, but I think not new. I gave a few examples from my childhood above. And Ogden Nash wrote a poem 'Children's Party', including the lines:

'Shunned are the games a parent proposes;
They prefer to squirt each other with hoses,
Their playmates are their natural foemen
And they like to poke each other’s abdomen.
Their joy needs another woe’s to cushion it,
Say a puddle, and someone littler to push in it.
They observe with glee the ballistic results
Of ice cream with spoons for catapults,
And inform the assembly with tears and glares
That everyone’s presents are better than theirs'

His children, and presumably their party guests, were born in the early 1930s - so could be the great-grandparents of the children misbehaving nowadays!