To think £6,000 a year energy bills are completely unsustainable

[Butterflyfluff]

Following on from this thread but quite unbelievably the projected figure has gone from £4,200 to £6,000 now.

www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4607670-to-think-that-very-few-people-can-manage-ps4200-energy-bills?page=40

Where will this all end?

I could almost cope with these bills if there was an end in sight. If it was just get through till March and it'll all come back to reasonable levels..

But its not. We're being told that this is the long haul and we have years of high inflation, high fuel and high energy costs. No pay rise though.

My company is a not for profit, no chance I'm getting an 18% payrise to match inflation. DH is police, he has been on a pay freeze for years and then just got 1.75%.

That middle income, earn too much for benefits, maybe even just tipped into 40% tax brackets households will struggle with little to no help from any subsidies or schemes out there. Those are probably going to be looking long and hard at which they vote for in the GE.

I lay a lot of the fault for this shitstorm at the people who voted for Brexit and supported lockdowns and furlough. Lockdown 1, fine anything after that was ridiculous and costing us now. Furlough shouldn't have been paid after July 2020 and Brexit can take credit for inflation!

If this actually happens the uk economy will crash.

The actual cost of producing goods (all needs power) will increase, increasing the final cost of items.

So Business and shops have more expensive items to sell on top of their energy bills - further putting up costs of ALL goods so everything will be more expensive, however the consumer will have no money to spend in the shops so business will go bust.

People will freeze in their homes (and cut down on food) increasing hospital admissions on top of the usual winter admissions especially for elderly, those with respiratory and other medical conditions. I suspect seasonal Flu will be worse and of course covid will probably raise up its head again will everyone packed into hospitals and crowding together wherever it’s warm.

Debt will increase leading to mental health issues, suicides

There will be so many knock on aspects it’s totally mind blowing

This government needs to seriously sort this out, cap - as it actually limit the standing charge and unit costs of gas and electricity, and recover extra charges from the huge power companies

The self employed small businesses wont survive. People will stop spending.

No nail bars, kids club memberships will drop, hairdressers, builders, little boutiques, businesses that rely on tourists, beauty treatments etc etc.

Any talk of fixing the cap would exclude business as it is iirc businesses do not get the cap rate only us consumers

I agree the onslaught facing SME etc is highly concerning - esp after all the help during pandemic to keep them going and the to lose many now would be awful

Tourism might be aided by lower pound but swings and roundabouts as not good for inflation. Same was mentioned wrt weaker Euro against US dollar this morning and Germany exporting more, in context of possible recession across EU

I don't see how the UK's pandemic response, which was a lot less extreme than other countries in Europe, explains why we are seeing rises of 136% and the French Government ( who also mandated lockdowns ) have managed to impose a cap of 4%.

As we see here, what this will also do is further divide an already divided nation: as we all try to find people to blame. Furlough supporters, middle class Tory voters, Brexit voters.

I didn't get furlough, didn't vote Tory and voted Remain but I am trying very hard not to lay blame on the public for doing whatever they thought was best at the time. I blame the governments of the last decade or so.

They have known about climate change and yet have been complacent about water and energy care. Allowing new homes to be built that still rely on fossil fuels. Allowing private companies to close reservoirs and not open new ones. Allowing literal shit to be pumped by the millions of gallons into our rivers and seas every day. Allowing the energy industry to run like a giant ponzi scheme.

They have known about worsening relations with China and Russia and yet have not priorised the development of UK energy production and allowed the encouragment of diesel cars (that one's on Labour).

They have wasted billions of pounds on things that never worked, because of vanity and/or because the people they were paying were donors, mates and family (Test and Trace, Garden Bridges, defaulted loans, PPE contracts to brand new 1-man companies that never existed until govenrment money was up for grabs).

They encouraged Brexit, declared it was their top priority and then have systematically failed to do anything constructive to prepare for it or to progress us once it was done. Instead choosing to use it as their chance to cut away human, animal and environemtnal protections.

They have used culture and populism to cut deep into the country in order to bring themsleves power. Never caring for the damage they do, so long as they feel special.

God damn I am angry as hell at the government. Proper, enraged to the point of barely being able to see straight. But I am going to try very bloody hard not to let that rage turn on other people - because I think that would drive us all properly insane.

Perhaps folk will think I am mad, but I really don't think they will go as high as being predicted in the media - certain newspapers and news outlets are upping the "predicted" price by around £100 per day in their bulletins. If they go up to the amount the media are predicting, no-one, simply no-one will be able to afford it, which really does not make sense. Maybe I am on planet optimistic but I cannot see how they (the utility companies) will benefit if no-one can pay - their revenue will be reduced even more than it is now. What I will do is pay whatever I can afford. I will only increase my payments by the percentage it goes up i.e. in April they tried to put ours up 105% when it had only gone up 54% - called them and told them we were not paying 105% increase - and there was no argument - and even now, we are now £300 in credit. I know a lot of you won't agree with me, but I really do think the scare factor being spewed out by the media is causing more anxiety than the bills will. Okay, back off to planet optimistic now :)

The prices are going up to the levels predicted.

There's a set formula for the price of a unit, based on the wholesale price over the last few months, and this is going to be announced tomorrow.
The cost of the unit price translates into the price cap for a standard usage of 2900 kWh electricity and 12000 kWh gas.
Those are not huge amounts and will be exceeded by many.

The only way to pay less will be to use less than this amount of power.
Although it will be reduced by whatever Government help is given, which is currently between £400 and £1300 depending on whether a household is on UC or TC.

The self employed small businesses wont survive. People will stop spending.
This is my worry. All non essential businesses will go to the wall.

I hate to burst your bubble but wholesale gas prices are 10 times higher than they were in May '21 and the direction of travel is still going up. This isn't a media conspiracy, it is a global market from which we are poorly insulated.

You can see it all here.
www.theice.com/products/910/UK-Natural-Gas-Futures/data

^^Sorry, that was a shit way for me to phrase it. I just mean that the price rises you see in the media these last few months are simply a reflection of the pace of increase and not simply to capture an audience with fear.

The unit price will increase but you are right, people will be forced to use less and, as a result, won't be subject to the headline figures if they can keep their usage under 12000kwh gas and 2900kwh electricity - although that doesn't touch the sides for some families who perhaps are still in the dark about their fuel bill because they don't understand what those figures mean.

If you are single and over 25 UC per year is £4354 often there is a shortfall in housing element if you are in private rented, water rates and contribution to council tax still need to be made
Its impossible to meet your job search commitments or do very little else without access to internet so that needs funding
its a struggle to eat never mind heat
The extra payments for fuel poverty are nowhere near enough - benefit rates are supposed to give someone ‘just’ enough to live on - they long since stopped doing that
This winter many extra people will die including suicide

The people of this country have been sold a lie, that lie being that it’s better to privatise everything eg transport , NHS ,housing etc and close down industries in this country or give them away as making profit is good.Let’s face it, it was only a few years ago that renationalising public services was suggested and that was ridiculed by media and the people.
Now the same papers are moaning about how France is cheaper because of this it’s crazy.
The Tories have a lot of power and not just in parliament but through media which is probably one of the most powerful thing you
can have. for example when they
wanted to change the benefit system they put programs out like benefit street, and newspaper stories of families with 10 kids who never worked etc this proved very effective and gave a false idea of the type of people who relied on the welfare state.
The trouble with benefit street is that they never gave the reason of why so many were on the dole , but if you take away their industries and don’t invest in those areas what do you expect will happen?
So the masses moaned about the benefit takers not realising that most of them too were one.voted tories in believing they were not those type of people the government were talking about, then shocked that their money and services were getting cut.because the reality is,if you get any money from the state eg,tax credits,in work benefits,child benefit, or your kids go to state schools or you rely on the NHS your a benefit scrounger in the eyes of the government who must be thinking how dumb there nation is to vote for this.
We need to learn to stop fighting amongst ourselves and look at the bigger picture. it’s not Brenda down the road that is out of work thats causing this.but so many will moan about someone they know getting something and how unfair it is but it’s nothing compared to what the government are taking from us it’s sad that we believed that privatisation was the way and yes I know that this is a global thing but it’s scary that our government has no control over this and all they can do now really is add more
financial support but that just means more debt and misery to come.

Ours is already £5000. Doubled and I’m absolutely stressed out of my tree for the next stage. No-don’t live in a mansion. 4 bed Victorian terrace

@Lieby is that mostly because of the cost of heating it? At that price it might be more cost-effective to sort insulation, draughts etc?

Is this Octopus? They have it set up so that a lot of customers are over-paying now so Octopus can build up the credit in their accounts.

@WhiteCatmas I completely agree. They are totally out of touch with reality let alone poverty. I'm extremely worried for some of my closest friends who will have no funds for hearing this winter, it's very very concerning

One thought I've had about this is if anyone got friends or family close by maybe do alternating days at each others houses to reduce energy costs on heating etc if all sharing and taking in turns, just an idea, wouldn't work for us but maybe could help someone.

This demonstrates the failed model of privatisation of our utilities. The market can’t produce fuel at an affordable cost to consumers. The government must not bail it out with tax payer money.

Effectively the energy companies are bankrupt and should be wound down, nationalising the utilities. Currently they are heavily invested in by other nations. These countries are offsetting their costs abroad because we sold it off.

Nationalise it and invest in renewable energy.

Energy companies are not bankrupt, they are making very large profits?

@carefullycourageous the companies who are extracting the commodities (oil, gas) are making massive profits. Actual energy suppliers (the people we buy from) are not.

As a newly single mum, I am terrified, that’s half the money I receive in benefits, I never thought I’d be in this position but I am now, my kids food and health will always come above mine though so while I may go without they won’t!

I just googled and read 'British Gas doubles profits to £948m' from Feb 2022.

I know the smaller energy companies are struggling but I thought the big six other than EDF were doing OK?

British Gas is part of the Centrica Group, which also has a stake in extraction of gas. So they're an odd one out.
EDF is doing fine because the French Government owns it.
Smaller suppliers are really struggling, especially ones who use green electricity, because of the way prices are set.

Well then take care to buy what you can from little home run businesses if you can

don't go to primark, if you want to buy a few stocking fillers for Christmas but the local businesses seem too expensive why not message them and say 'look I have the budget of £10 to fill 3 stockings is there anything you can offer me? old stock? make your own kits? I really want to shop local but I have to budget to pay xxx '
They might find something, you never know and you can only ask.

I know I would do what I could for extra business.