To say this to people who complain about vaping?

[GeriSignfeld]

You do realise that if we weren't vaping, we'd be smoking cigarettes, right?

In light of this, why should vapes be banned?

#teamvape

Vaping products are often portrayed in a negative way, and this has led to confusion and a common misperception that vaping is as harmful as smoking tobacco.
We answer your questions about vaping, its safety compared to smoking, and how it works as a stop smoking aid.

I’ve read that vaping is just as dangerous as smoking. Is this true?

Vaping is significantly less harmful than smoking. Switching completely from smoking to vaping is likely to have substantial health benefits over continued smoking.
Yorkshire Cancer Research supports the use of vaping products as a tool to quit smoking and this position is supported by Public Health England (PHE) who, in February 2015, published an independent review which estimated that vaping is at least 95% less harmful than smoking.
Since then, PHE has published a further six independent e-cigarette reports, the last one being last month. All of them have consistently reinforced the finding from previous reports that vaping is significantly less harmful compared to smoking.

The NHS also reflects this position in its guidance for smokers, stating that ‘In recent years, e-cigarettes have become a very popular stop smoking aid in the UK. Also known as vapes or e-cigs, they're far less harmful than cigarettes and can help you quit smoking for good.’
Almost all the harm from smoking comes from the thousands of chemicals (such as tar and carbon monoxide) contained in tobacco smoke. As vaping products do not contain or burn tobacco, these chemicals are either not present or are present at significantly lower levels.

Although smoking rates are declining, the proportion of smokers in Yorkshire (15.4%) is higher than the average for England (13.9%). There are more than 622 000 adult smokers in Yorkshire - half will die of a smoking-related disease if they do not quit. If all these smokers switched to vaping products, thousands of lives could be saved.
By spreading the message that vaping and smoking are not the same, and outlining vaping’s value as a tool to quit, we can reduce the number of people in the region who are needlessly dying through smoking-related cancers.

But don’t vaping products contain nicotine? Isn’t that bad for you?

Vaping products do contain nicotine, which is inhaled through a vapour. While it is nicotine that causes tobacco cigarettes to be so addictive, on its own it is relatively harmless.
At low doses, nicotine is a stimulant, which in the short term increases heart rate and may improve attention, memory and fine motor skills. If you have, or have had, any serious heart problems, it’s a good idea to talk to your doctor before using vaping products or nicotine replacement therapy.
Nicotine is not the cause of death from smoking. Nicotine is not a carcinogen; there is no evidence that sustained use of nicotine alone increases the risk of cancer. Of the three main causes of death from smoking (lung cancer, Chronic Obstructive Pulmonary Disease and cardiovascular disease), none are caused by nicotine. The harm from smoking comes from the thousands of other chemicals in tobacco smoke.

There are lots of other methods that can help people stop smoking, like patches or stop smoking medicines. Why do we need vaping as well?

Vaping products are the most popular stop smoking aid. It has been estimated that there are up to 57,000 additional quitters a year in England and 5,000 a year in Yorkshire because of them. They have gained popularity because they feel similar to smoking a cigarette.
Research also suggests that vaping products are more effective at supporting people to stop smoking than other stop smoking aids such as Nicotine Replacement Therapy (NRT). One trial of English stop smoking services found that smokers using vaping products were nearly twice as likely to stop smoking as those using NRT.

Vaping products are not available on prescription through the NHS. Does that mean they’re not regulated? How do we know what they contain?

The UK has some of the tightest regulations on vaping products in the world under the Tobacco and Related Products Regulations 2016.
These regulations ensure that vaping products are subject to maximum standards of quality and safety, as well as packaging and labelling requirements to provide consumers with the information they need to make informed choices. They cover nicotine strength, health warnings, advertising, childproof packaging, and a ban on certain ingredients.
Vaping product manufacturers must provide the UK Medicines and Healthcare Products Regulatory Agency (MHRA), with detailed information about their product, including a list of all ingredients.

I’ve heard that vaping products can cause harm to your lungs. Is this true?

There have been stories in the media about an outbreak of lung injury called EVALI in the USA. These cases of EVALI were caused by people using vaping products with homemade or illicit e-liquids that contained cannabis products and a chemical called vitamin E acetate.
The use of cannabis is illegal in the UK under the Misuse of Drugs Act 2010 and vitamin E acetate is a prohibited ingredient under the Tobacco and Related Products Regulations 2016. Therefore, the risk of getting EVALI by using a UK-regulated vaping product is low and so far, there has been one case in this country compared to 2600 cases in the US.
There have also been stories that vaping products cause a disease called ‘popcorn lung’. This was caused by a chemical flavouring called diacetyl, which had been used in e-liquids. Again, diacetyl is banned in e-liquids in the UK under the Tobacco and Related Products Regulations 2016. Therefore, using a UK-regulated vaping product and e-liquids will not cause ‘popcorn lung’.
It took a long time for the dangers of smoking to be fully realised.

How do we really know if vaping products are safe? Shouldn’t there be more research before people are encouraged to use them?

Vaping products have been available in the UK since 2007. They are currently one of the most widely researched scientific topics. There is substantial evidence on the short-term impact of their use, which has shown that they are far less harmful than smoking and an effective and popular stop smoking aid.
What we know for certain is that smoking is Yorkshire’s leading cause of preventable cancer and is responsible for over 4500 new cancer cases each year. 1 in 2 long-term smokers will die prematurely if they do not quit – so action needs to be taken now.

It’s true that there are some things about vaping that need more research, like for example, what might happen to someone’s health if they vaped for many years. However, through extensive evidence reviews, Public Health England has repeatedly found that vaping is significantly less harmful than smoking. We can’t afford to wait for 10 or 20 years for the long-term impact to be reviewed, while in the meantime the health of hundreds of thousands of people across Yorkshire continues to be harmed by tobacco smoke.

Can vapour cause harm to other people?

There is no evidence that vapour causes harm to bystanders. People with asthma and other respiratory conditions might be sensitive to very large clouds of vapour, in the same way that they can be sensitive to a range of environmental irritants.
This is in stark contrast to the known health risks of secondhand smoke that underpin UK smokefree laws. We know that non-smokers who live with a smoker have a 20-30% higher chance of getting lung cancer as a consequence. Secondhand smoke also increases the risk of breast and cervical cancer as well as heart disease and stroke.

Do vaping products encourage young people to start smoking?

There is no evidence that the rise in popularity of vaping has led to increased rates of smoking in adults or young people in the UK – in fact, smoking rates are continuing to fall in both groups.
The latest studies show that most vaping product experimentation does not turn into regular use, and levels of regular use in young people who have never smoked remain very low. It is also illegal to sell vaping products to people under 18 in the UK.

I have heard that vaping products can explode and cause fires. Is this true?

Fires caused by vaping products are rare and about as likely as fires caused by mobile phones. Where they do occur, it is likely the battery has malfunctioned, so those who vape should always use the charger supplied with the vaping product and avoid charging it for extended periods of time, such as overnight.
The risk of fire from vaping products is considerably lower than the risk of fire caused by cigarettes, which are the leading cause of death in domestic households, causing around 2000 house fires a year.

Should employees be able to vape at work?

UK smokefree laws prohibit smoking in enclosed public places and workplaces. However, these laws do not include vaping and so it is left to organisations to determine their own policy on vaping in the workplace.
Vaping and smoking are not the same activity - vaping products have significant potential to help reduce the harm from tobacco caused to smokers, those around them and the wider society. Recognition of this should be at the centre of any smokefree policy.
Imposing a blanket ban on workplace vaping may not be the best way forward. Treating vaping and smoking as the same thing may force vapers and smokers to share the same designated space - which may jeopardise a smoker’s attempt to quit.
Public Health England has developed guidance on how to create a new vaping policy or incorporate a vaping policy into an existing smokefree policy, which can be found here. These recommendations are supported by Yorkshire Cancer Research.
Find out more about vaping here, including the key facts and findings from experts and leading researchers.
For information and advice about quitting smoking, read our Q&A or contact your local stop smoking service.

yorkshirecancerresearch.org.uk/news/the-truth-about-vaping

Crikey Tiger the hadn't come across that one before. Thanks. I thought I had most of the UK research sites. I'll have to do some updating,

Is it possible that the vast majority of those who are rabidly anti vape drive a car/4x4/etc.?

I suppose they don't because the emissions from their exhaust pipes are awful for those who have no choice but to breathe it in all day every day. They just would not spread that kind of "smoke" for everyone to breathe in would they? No of course not, they would make sure to bring the car on a tow rope attached to a mule to a deserted location and emit exhaust fumes away from everyone else who detests it. That's good to know.

That's a bit like saying

"Don't complain about the smell of my farts. You realise I could actually be shitting next to you instead?!"

Ridiculous.

Vape if you like but don't expect people to be happy that you're doing it next to them.

@WeSent500Ravens It's not a case of 'Get over it' when people are blowing it in the direction of others. Some people don't like the smell of perfume? Shall I just go around spraying perfume around them? It's the same principal.

If vaping was intended only to be used as a smoking cessation aid, then it should never have been left in the hands of tobacco companies to take over the marketing. Of course it is not remotely in commercial interests to limit vaping to (former) cigarette smokers. Far more lucrative to encourage a new generation of vapers and keep them on the hook by making them addicted to nicotine (it’s the nicotine that makes vaping particularly appealing, as it does create pleasurable effects - it would rapidly lose appeal if it really were just flavoured glycerol, unless it was found, eg, to help reduce cravings for food and sweets even without nicotine in, and thus help with weight loss, or something, which would create another appeal to vulnerable people…). And nicotine is harmful, precisely because it is addictive - to argue that something highly addictive is not harmful is just crass. Besides, nicotine can increase risk of blood clots, stomach upsets, headaches, irregular or fast heartbeat, high blood pressure, etc.

As soon as you have made vaping a popular activity in and of itself, you have opened the door to the introduction of illegal modifications and products being added to it, because there is now profit to be made from addicts looking for cheaper hits than they can get legitimately, or more interesting combinations of addictive substances. No doubt, due to the marketing of vaping as being wholly safe, there are some idiots who think vaping illegal THC is actually safe compared to smoking a spliff.

Vaping produces air pollution. There are far worse types of air pollution which have been proven to cause definite health harms, including cigarette smoking, but that’s not really a great excuse to inflict it on others wherever and whenever you want, especially when innocent bystanders have no way of knowing if you are vaping a legitimately purchased product or an illegally modified one. It is only necessary pollution if you were silly enough to risk becoming addicted to nicotine in the first place. I therefore think it is perfectly acceptable to both complain about vaping and to expect there to be some controls over when and where you can do it. No point banning it, though.

And if people don't like the smell of car fumes, should people stop driving cars?

Look, the world is not a perfect place. There are pollutants all around us, many emanating from the judgmental anti everything gang. But hey ho, that's life.

Judge not and you shall not be judged etc......

But using that logic would also mean it would be perfectly reasonable to ban almost every food on the planet, tea, coffee, salt, alcohol, medication, herbs, spices, leaving the house unless covered from head to toe in robes and just a little net panel to allow vision (as UV can be harmful and people can't be relied upon to wear sunglasses) and all physical activity/playing. Because they are all known to have a potential for harm, many have potential for addiction and all can cause damage/injury.

Some religions ban some of these things. But not all. And most of us know people who weren't allowed things on the basis of 'what they don't know, they won't miss'. With inevitable results once they reach an age that they can choose.

Vaping may not be harmless. But it's better than prohibition altogether, as banning everything on the basis that it's harmful - or in your argument, because it might be harmful and even if it isn't - never, ever works with humans. It just gives a new market for people who want to make money.

I don't have anything against people complaining about it. I do object to disinformation, repeated posting of information that is irrelevant, discredited and scaremongering. Especially when there is so much gold standard, ongoing research to be found.

Complain by all means. But, please, don't join the ranks of those who use disinformation and hyperbole to gain traction.

vape as much as you want - but go do it out of the way without blowing clouds of malodorous crap over me or anyone else.
And that does not include stepping out of the pub across the road and standing outside my balcony. CFs even thought they were going to stand their drinks on my balcony

it would rapidly lose appeal if it really were just flavoured glycerol, unless it was found, eg, to help reduce cravings for food and sweets even without nicotine in, and thus help with weight loss

Actually, that's a good point, even though not in the way you might expect.

Nicotine reduces appetite. It binds to α3β4 receptors, which send a signal throughout the rest of the brain to signal satiety. It's indistinguishable from the signal the brain propagates after eating a large meal. It also increases metabolic rate, meaning more calories are burned. It's why smokers as a group tend to weigh less than non smokers and it is very common for people who give up smoking to crave sweet things.

Non smokers also experience lower cravings for sweet things if they smell or taste (which is largely smell based) sweet substances.

What's your opinion on providing a chemical which raises metabolism, reduces appetite and in a way that satisfies a desire for foods that might be less healthy, including satisfying a deep seated emotional need that mammals are predisposed to?

@NeverDropYourMooncup - I thought JS87 was talking about the harm of addiction, not possible harm of anything else. It’s very disingenuous to compare the risks of addiction to nicotine, which is highly physically addictive, to the risk of a tea “addiction.” By all means compare it to alcohol or heroin, but not all the other silly comparisons in your post.

It was a point made in exactly the way I expected. I raised it because I suspect some teenaged girls may very well be tempted by an addictive substance that suppresses their appetite if it is marketed to them as perfectly safe and which makes you look cool. My view is that mass addiction to nicotine is a bad thing and not to be encouraged.

Caffeine and sugar aren't potentially harmful and physically addictive?

That Cancer Research article is an excellent summary of vapes, and hopefully would calm the fears/anxieties of those who think vaping poses a health risk to them.

Some people seem to jump up and become enraged for no valid reason. Command and control.

There are good reasons why people drive cars. There is no good reason why people need to smoke around others.

It is, isn't it? Last year my brother had breathing issues, he was treated for asthma and he took every medication on the planet. Nothing worked. He got a lung function test and he told the doctor he vaped. Doctor said no worries about that carry on, better than smoking and it won't affect your lung function. It didn't. He had a severe allergy in the end, not asthma or any lung issue and that was sorted with prescription anti histamines.

If Cancer Research is positive regarding vaping, the strident know it alls should take a break.

Vape you mean? That harmless activity according to NHS and Cancer Research?

I can avoid smokers/vapers but I cannot avoid car fumes unless I'm at the top of Ben Nevis!

it won't affect your lung function

LOL.

Both are disgusting & both impact others.

It didn't in my brother's case. Smoking tobacco will, but vaping won't.

Allowing 20mg nicsalt disposables to ever be a thing was madness

I used to smoke, then vaped then quit entirely. Couldn't never get free of fags. I credit vaping to being smoke free

So, given that this information is repeated in many studies, as shown here, where are you getting your information from?

I'd like to compare and contrast the data.