To ask for your quotes from narcissistic mothers

[itsgoodtobehome]

Slightly tongue in cheek. My DM is a total narcissist which I'm mostly used to now, but every now and then she comes out with a new classic which makes even me wince.

So, next weekend, DM has invited me and DSis and our families for lunch to mark a family birthday. 9 of us in total, including kids. DM was telling me the other day what she was planning to serve for lunch. She mentioned a particular thing as a starter, which is quite an acquired taste. I know for a fact that my DDad and DH don't like it, and the 3 kids won't eat it. So basically 5 out of 9 guests don't like this dish. I told her this was a bit of a waste.
Her response: 'but I have planned this menu to look a certain way, and it won't look right if I don't make this dish'

So she is quite prepared to have most of her guests not eat something just so her menu 'looks good'. I give up. Has anyone else got batshit mothers who only think of themselves and nobody else?

Yes it's called DARVO. My ex and parents are experts. It really messed with my sanity.
(Deny, Attack, reverse victim and offender)

A therapist said to me.. 'do you realise you quite often ask people if they understood you when you're really a very clear speaker.

It was then that I realised my ex had been gaslighting me by saying I mumbled and was confusing for 20 years. It was their problem. Not even sure if was a technique to silence me. I think perhaps it was.

My DF also like to 'start a debate' usually by saying something 'controversial' then will argue until everyone is upset. Then will walk away from the smouldering wreckage. But if you dare to do similar then its victim all the way. He also made me question my own thoughts.

This is one of the most upsetting things for me. I hadn't realised how much their insecurity had dented my self esteem and then by default my success.

“Smouldering wreckage” - what totally apt description. It’s exactly that. A narcissist enjoys lighting the touch paper, standing back and watching the distress their little bonfire causes. Even better if it can be done during a previously happy occasion or get together.

The real victims end up feeling emotionally wrung out, guilty and often apologising for something that wasn’t their fault in order to resolve/retrieve the situation. The perpetrators maintain control by either blanking the apology or saying they will “consider and think” about it in order to extract and extend maximum emotion time.

I absolutely hate confrontation of any type, even the mildest, because of her - even when it is completely justified. I feel physically sick, shake and then spend hours replaying and overanalysing my own responses.

No - my mother was unable to handle human interaction.
She would create fallout, then blame anyone but herself for her own behaviour.
The only people she could be around without either a massive row or some deeply uncomfortable & inappropriate behaviour were her sisters & their husbands.

It took a long time to wise up.
In my late 20's, I exercised her boss's daughter's horse for a couple of weeks while they were on holiday. I used to take her to the yard for the outing (horses were our 'thing' in my childhood). On driving her back home on day, she told me that "Mavis has really upset me, I need to to tell her how wrong she is .." etc etc
The penny finally dropped.
My mother fell out with people as a way of life, & co-opted others into the row as a way to prolong it & ramp up the melodrama.I had not heard of "flying monkeys" then but told her that if she had a problem with Mavis, she needed to address it directly, because I wasn't interested in manufacturing a row for her.
Oh, the haughty silence, all the way home!

She now lives in her granny flat, being taken out once a week to a cafe, & having a a kind old colleague duty-visit her once a fortnight. That's the extent of her social life. She simply cannot cope without conflict - so people eventually just faded from her life.

i was a very mature student and eventually got an MSc around age 55. I mentioned in conversation I wouldn't be attending the graduation ceremony (too expensive, not close to my cohort, I hate being the centre of attention even for the 10 seconds it takes to cross a stage). My mum was pushing me to attend because she wanted a photo of me in the cap and gown. I just kept repeating that it wouldn't happen. Eventually she burst out 'you know, it's not all about you'. I burst out laughing at that point!

When DD was a teenager recovering from severe anorexia she wrote to my mum saying she wanted to see her but could Mum not talk to her about food or weight when they met. Mum would honour that while I was in the room but as soon as they were on their own Mum would interrogate her about her eating habits and how Mum could lose weight like DD had. That was nearly 20 years ago and DD still refuses to be alone with Mum.

Aaaw,@Womblingforfree

Yes I recognise your experience. Feeling a bit suffocated just reading it!
You make such a good point re: the DARVO'ing.

A therapist said to me.. 'do you realise you quite often ask people if they understood you when you're really a very clear speaker.
My lovely cousin came to stay with me a couple of years back. He is the sole family member who ever witnessed how my mother could behave, especially to children, without the ameliorating presence of her sisters to reign in her cruelty.
He gently observed "you do a lot of explaining, don't you Kettricken?"
A lovely way of drawing me out of the insecurity you described so accurately Wombling - when your own parent has made you doubt the veracity of your own words or experience.

This is why I heart Out Of The Fog's JADE advice! -
outofthefog.website/what-not-to-do-1/2015/12/3/jade-dont-justify-argue-defend-explain
I imagine you're already aware of it Wombling, but there it is for any PP who might find it helpful.

Also the entire Out Of The Fog website - an amazing resource for my fellow-afflicted! Anyone who is unfamiliar might find comfort & advice here -
outofthefog.website/toolbox-intro

I absolutely hate confrontation of any type, even the mildest, because of her - even when it is completely justified. I feel physically sick, shake and then spend hours replaying and overanalysing my own responses.

@JohnPrescottsPyjamas - have you ever been offered CBT?
It can really, really help with this horrible reaction & the rumination & self-recrimination that comes from it

Eventually she burst out 'you know, it's not all about you'. I burst out laughing at that point!

Aaaw @FeelingwearyFeeelingsmall so did I just now!
It takes us years - decades - to get past the worst of this stuff.
I'm around your age, & discovering the ability to laugh at the hyper-ridiculousness of some of the behaviours has been so healing.

Congratulations on your MSC, & your laughter

I'm another one whose mother used to tell me when I was a child that she loved me but she didn't like me. I believed that it must be because I was a really horrible child.
Another one was 'you count for nothing'. Cue a lifetime of not expecting people to notice me. I am still a bit surprised if someone acknowledges me at work or in a crowd.
Also, I was told that I was bad luck and that I caused bad things to happen around me. Cheers for that one.

I’ve got loads but a big one in my memory is this.

My biological dad had a son before he and my mother had me. I was close to my half brother but my bio dad left when I was 2, I have no contact with him but still saw my nan a lot. My half brother moved away with his mum when I was small and we only met a few times after that and then lost touch.

Fast forward about 15 years and I got a message on social media from my brother! So we were chatting for a bit over messages. When I told my mum he’s made contact with me, her first words were ‘oh did he ask about me?!’ SO self absorbed.

Yes (sort of) and yes.

She makes superficial friendships very easily but these friendships last maybe 3-4 years before cooling off. Sometimes she breaks them off or does the withdrawing but mostly I just stop hearing about XYZ any more and realise they have gone off the scene. I expect they have either sussed her out or at the very least realised there is something off. She will often complain of a friend doing something with the sole purpose of annoying her, which I am sure is just projection, or she will complain that the friend has not taken her advice.

It bothers me for two reasons. The first is that she is very good at taking over someone else's relationships. She has taken over several of my friends and she took my sister's boyfriend for an affair some years back. The second is that if she has met any of my friends briefly (I generally try to avoid this happening) they all gush over her to me afterwards every time the subject of her comes up. "Oooh, Cranarc, your mum is just SO lovely. SO amusing. SUCH fun. You are SO lucky." It makes me want to vomit.

@Cranarc
Your sister's boyfriend? Omg..

Yes, my mum was (superficially?) very popular, went on so many holidays etc, people would say to me, 'Oh, she does right!!'
(I was struggling to make ends meet, of course..) :-(

If I knew my friend's mam was a narc I'd be so cool with her at best. I take it you haven't told them? Or about dsis bf?

No, I’ve never had any kind of therapy and again, I think that’s because it was always drummed into me that people who suffered from MH or anxiety were either, in her words, ‘weak’ or even feared by her as though any form of mental illness was catching. She loved talking in a very sanctimonious and morbid way about others breakdowns, struggles or even suicides!

Your link about JADE was really useful, thank you. It explains so much about her and her perspectives. Events I saw, or experienced first hand with her, were embellished and exaggerated to others until they became almost unrecognisable from fact, but without fail, she was always the hero of the situation or the one who suffered the most etc etc. She repeated some of these tales so often that I truly think in her mind they became hard fact.

She would have liked him, he created an entire religion!

Not my DM, but my dad, who I'm no contact with now. Should have done it a long time ago tbh

After my DM died in hospital suddenly (was only in for a 2 weeks and spiralled quickly) My dad came to see me the next day. Looked me up and down and said "You've put on weight" ...Thanks for that. Just one of the many gems he's come out with over the years

No, I’ve never had any kind of therapy and again, I think that’s because it was always drummed into me that people who suffered from MH or anxiety were either, in her words, ‘weak’ or even feared by her as though any form of mental illness was catching. She loved talking in a very sanctimonious and morbid way about others breakdowns, struggles or even suicides

This is so familiar. Growing up depression was for bored housewives or rich people with too much time and money on their hands. A fad,an indulgence.

as a child the spiel was "what do you have to be depressed about? You have clothes,food,a home. You don't have to work or pay any bills . Wait till you grow up and then you'll have something to be depressed about".

There were also the proper crazies. The ones taken away, institutionalised, did I want to end up like that?

I self harmed for years and did my best to hide it. The few times she found me.. I was stupid,I was weak,I was attention seeking. One time it was quite bad and I asked if I should go to the hospital. She told me that I'd be committed. The nurses will tie me up and laugh at me and be horrible to me. They'll call the police and I would be a laughing stock and a nutter. Is that what I want? No... then wipe your mouth,drink some milk (I had drank laundry detergent-stupid I know) and go to bed.

I remember her reading my diary and finding out I drank medicinal alcohol several times after being sexually assaulted by 6 classmates. Her only concern was that I drank that, that I'm stupid, do I want to be an alcoholic,what kind of behaviour is that etc. Not a word about why I'm doing it. Never once an acknowledgment that I did have something to be upset or depressed about.

I blew up at her a while ago when she came up with "your teen years traumatised ME" and went into a rant about all the things that happened to me (that she knew about anyways) because once again what reasons did i have to act out and be traumatised. Her response "well, I can't get my head around that. I can't understand it because it never happened to me. I was a good girl,I was respected no one ever laid a hand on me or looked at me wrong. I just don't get it."

Understanding trauma is NOT fucking rocket science!

No, I’ve never had any kind of therapy and again, I think that’s because it was always drummed into me that people who suffered from MH or anxiety were either, in her words, ‘weak’ or even feared by her as though any form of mental illness was catching.

Arrrgh I get it @JohnPrescottsPyjamas ! Ditto 😡

Have a chat with your GP.
You can access CBT via the NHS - I'm doing an online version right now.
It's supported with fortnightly review calls from an experienced counsellor.
Do it!
You know you deserve some support, right?

"well, I can't get my head around that. I can't understand it because it never happened to me. I was a good girl,I was respected no one ever laid a hand on me or looked at me wrong. I just don't get it."

@IdontWanna
Arrgh. Victim blamed by your own mother. She is a revolting specimen.
I am so, so sorry what you went through, & more so that you were not validated, supported & soothed after such a brutally traumatic event in your young life.

DB split up with his girlfriend when he was 18 and was distraught. They had been together four years and they grew apart as they grew up. (They did end up back together)
All Dm kept saying was 'I'm devastated, she is like a daughter to me'
Each time I pointed out that he was her son and needed her but she couldn't help him as she was just so heartbroken about it. I wouldn't understand.

This reminds me of when I asked dm if she wanted to be at the birth of our third baby.
No idea why I suggested it but whatever. It never happened as she had a complete meltdown when she realised that when I went into labour Dh wouldn't be driving the almost two hour round trip to collect her. (She can drive!)

My DM read my diary, searched my room with the thoroughness of an MI6 Agent. When GP put me on the pill partly for medical reasons although I was engaged I very carefully unstitched the seam on a big teddy I kept on top of my wardrobe and inserted my pills . Took her a week to find them. She marched off to my GP tore him off a strip threatened him with the police. I was told all this when I got home from work. I was upset when she told me until she said he had told her to get lost.

The first person to stand up to her

She had her first child at 16, but constantly told me throughout my childhood that I was a disgrace and would be pregnant by the time I turned 13 - I didn't even lose my virginity until I was 17

'you're pretty, but you'll never be beautiful. Now I was beautiful'

'you'll never amount to anything'

'So and so told me I had a smaller bum than you. ' I was a size 10 she was an 18

Sending lots of love and support to those who have contributed to this thread. I’ve always felt so alone in how my mother has impacted my life and it’s really quite shocking to hear from others how they have felt.

A few of my mothers corkers:

1. It’s not my fault I cheated on your father and lied for 2 years whilst sleeping with another man. Your dad was never around as he was working (9-5 / 5 days a week…), looking after you kids and playing tennis once a week. No one cared about me

1. I can’t cope with you feeling stressed. I know you’ve been bullied at work, just suffered a miscarriage that’s causing your marriage to breakdown. But frankly it’s far too much stress for me to cope with

1. I know you’ve lived abroad for 10 years and never get to spend any quality time with your close family, but I’ve just invited a random friend of mine you’ve never met to our family dinner which is the only chance this year you get to see your relatives. You won’t mind? Oh you can’t say no as she will just be sat at the table when you get here.

I have never had an apology. Never been heard. And always been told I’m selfish and spent years worrying what I’ve done wrong. I am totally over it

Does anyone else struggle with having a female boss? I've had both male and female bosses during my working life, and I definitely feel on edge with the female ones when it comes to appraisal time. I end up gabbling, ruminating on any negatives, and dreading the next review. With male bosses I'm way more relaxed and open to constructive criticism.

My mother was convinced she had lots of friends and she also tried to befriend my friends by butting in on conversations and even once coming out with us. She often said she got on better with the younger generation. I never saw it. When I left home my friends didnt keep in touch with her.

The few friends she had were either much older or from school. She criticised them to their faces and behind their backs. I found out that she didnt go to an old friends funeral (this lady was so lovely). Of course she didnt. It wasnt about her.

For all her thinking she had friends not one came to her funeral.

She constantly picked arguments. Then when my DF or I snapped she would wail about how awful her life was. She did deliberately spiteful things to get a reaction.

She was never thankful for anything. According to her no one had a worse life. No doubt because she felt entitled to more. Always more.