To wonder why men hate women so much?

[YouAreNotBatman]

Violence againt women, sexual harrasment.

Controlling women bodies.

Women’s sexuality: frigid prude if you don’t want sex, slut if you.

Porn, sex ”work”.

All the MRA’s, mgtow, incels etc.

Even historically speaking they have no reason to be angry at women, women never had any power, mostly tried to accommodate to men’s demand/ wants, I think it still goes on.

Many women still tip toe the line to placate men.

What reason do they have to be so angry at women?

This is just a load of 'whataboutery'.
Why can't we discuss this issue without someone going 'but women are mean too!!!'.?

That could be the question, but it isn't the subject of this thread and your post is basically 'whataboutery'. Women's faults don't cancel out men's and they certainly don't save the many, many women harmed and killed, by men.

Women hold the power because men want sex more than they want anything else.

And sex in itself has huge power over men. If you put a sexy woman in front of a man, he will begin to lose power and control over himself.

I only really realised this when i happened to get talking to a man in New York once. He said to me "women have a lot of power, even if you don't realise it".

Men are absolutely so hungry for sex, and will lose all self control and power around a woman.

Men are so hungry for sex, and I think it is not just the physical act of sex in itself, it is how they feel like a man , it is for their self esteem, it is how they feel connected.

They want sex more than they want anything else, and we have that power over them.

Show me all the women killing, raping and abusing women and then this post will have any relevance at on on this thread

Besides your stuff is anecdotal. I can easily counter your working career with mine.

I have spent much of my life in female only/female dominated teams and without a double they have been some of the most supportive friendliest teams I have worked on. I have also worked in nearly all male environments and some of those men have been very bitchy.

I have had fabulous female bosses, some I count as really close friends now. I have also had terrible male bosses.

I was bullied by a boy in primary school.

So what? Show some data that any of what you are talking about is as bad as the women being killed raped and abused. Because that is what you are saying, that 'bitchy women' are as bad as rapists, murderers and abusers. Wow!

@Sheepreallylikerichteabiscuits

However, what I see complained about a lot on here, with men who earn less/nothing is actually more along the lines of cocklodgers. Men who move in with higher earning women and don't contribute and crucially also don't do any of the things a traditional house wife would have done either.

This is a really important qualification.

For @Lunar270's benefit: I should have spelled this out in my earlier post: I think there is an added concern when you're a high (or higher) earning woman which is that there is a growing breed of men who take advantage of this (whether deliberately or not).

A woman who desperately wants to remain at home with her children is one thing. I happen not to think its a particularly healthy long-term model for a relationship but it is at least a fair exchange of labour and has some benefits for the family in the short term. So in your scenario I can see it makes some sense.

But there's a growing phenomenon of men who think a high earning partner is a cash cow and who are content to fly under the radar of presenting themselves as "progressive" or "feminist" but who actually don't pull their weight either financially or in terms of domestic commitment, and are content to have the woman do both all the earning and all or most of the domestic labour. I've seen this happen a lot. It's insidious as well as usually men like this don't show their true colours until they have their feet well and truly under the table.

This can happen to men too of course, particularly with women who believe they have the right to be supported by a man indefinitely and long after the children have gone into FT education. I don't think its any fairer for a man to have to pull all the earning in perpetuity than it is for a woman to have to do it. But at least in these situations the SAH wife usually tends to do most or all of the domestic labour (mainly because of historical conditioning).

A man who won't get off his arse to earn and doesn't do anything in the home either is to be avoided at any cost. And it may be social conditioning which makes me think this is more contemptible than a woman who does the same, but there you have it. No self-respecting man should expect to live off a woman.

It’s hugely accepted that the vast majority of men watch porn, to the point where women saying this crosses a line for them are often ridiculed.

I think a lot of people,particularly women are blind to the evolution of porn. They remember some dirty magazines that they giggled or ewwwed over, or maybe some erotic Emanuelle movies shown after 12 am. More importantly, that it involved some form of effort or payment.

Nowadays there is unlimited access to free porn and even the more extreme categories are not only easily a available,but becoming mainstream.

We also underestimate the male capacity for more,more ,more and the escalation in viewing behaviours.

That's without the fact that porn often shows women in degrading , harmful and painful positions/situations and sets up completely unrealistic expectations of how women's bodies look like,how they react, how much it can take,what an orgasm is and looks like etc.

I have asked myself this question and from what I have read misogyny began as early as the ancient Greeks (if not earlier) who believed that women were flawed versions of men. The theory of why misogyny started and spread is that men as a whole resent women because they rely on us for sex and children, they exploite their increased physical strength to dominate, control and abuse us.

I overheard a conversation between 3 male colleagues who were also friends outside of work in my last place. They were discussing how one of their friends had been accused of rape by their ex but 'it couldn't be rape because she liked rough sex'.

When I pulled them up on it I was subjected to a long rant about how this woman slept around so she couldn't be raped.

Those men knew full well that they knew a rapist. They just wouldn't admit it. Possibly because they would have had to call either their own behaviour or that of their friends into question.

*exploit

And sex in itself has huge power over men. If you put a sexy woman in front of a man, he will begin to lose power and control over himself.

Men are absolutely so hungry for sex, and will lose all self control and power around a woman.

Men are so hungry for sex, and I think it is not just the physical act of sex in itself, it is how they feel like a man , it is for their self esteem, it is how they feel connected.

They want sex more than they want anything else, and we have that power over them.

What absolute rubbish.
You can't genuinely be serious?
Isn't it funny how some men can control themselves around women? They manage not to rape or sexually assault them. How do those men fit with your theory that men have no control over their sexual urges.

95% of those in prisons are men.
Almost all those in prisons for violent offending are men.
98% of those in prisons for sex offending are men.
36% of women prosecuted for crimes are licence fee non-payers.
Half of all women in prison are there for an offence aimed at paying for someone else's drug habit.

And in case you're about to argue that it's just that men are caught more? US stats on those caught accessing child sexual torture imagery ('child porn') - where, by definition, those caught are found via online behaviour, so nobody knows what their sex is until the knock on the door - show it's a 99.3% male perpetration level.

Pretending that women are as prone to violence and criminality is simply wrong. We aren't. Women can certainly be cruel and some women are arseholes, but there's a gulf between men and women in how extreme the rates of violence and criminality are.

We live in a society that takes this so for granted, most people don't even know it's the case. You constantly see women insisting that "women are just as bad!" But it isn't true. We aren't.

@Sheepreallylikerichteabiscuits a few years ago I was marginally involved with a marital rape trial. The judge said "it can't be sex monday and Tuesday, rape on Friday and then sex again Saturday. It's either all sex or all rape." Yup, he was found not guilty with the "rough sex lover" defence as an excuse for the injuries and bruises.

@Sheepreallylikerichteabiscuits

Thanks for the clarification and definitely, no-one likes a freeloader.

I feel for your cousin as her husband sounds like a real keeper. Perhaps if he did all the housework and childcare he could redeem himself but he needs to have more self respect.

Anecdotally I know three of my wife's friends who have been cheated on. Whether there's any correlation between the infidelity and SAH mums I don't know but sadly it's all too common. They're typical gammon faced fat cats too, which makes it all the more gross. I look at my wife's friends and think these guys are lucky as they're Prince Andrew levels of repulsive but clearly this is attractive to some women.

Have you forgotten the many many cases about women murdering children? I can show you many stories of women murdering children if you want.

Humans are like animals, we pick on the ones weaker than us.

Men are stronger than women so they often abuse women.

The only humans physically weaker on earth than women are children. So you hear a lot of stories of women abusing children.

@Mooshamoo have you forgotten about the two women a week who are killed by their male partner or male previous partner?? I can show you many stories about them too.

Enough with your whataboutery - it's insulting

Love these threads, womanspalining how men think and act.

It is a fact a lot of men fear other men, this is proven in a lot of scientific research.

www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpsyg.2011.00003/full

What women need to realise, a lot of men are afraid to stand upto other men, specifically because they afraid of the consequences and they have their own battles to fight against other men and are putting just as much effort in to not being attacked themselves. Fact a hugely higher percentage of murders and injuries occur from men on men.

How times when women will get right up in between men who are about to fight knowing that the men won't hurt them. A man doing the same would most likely be attacked or injured. As men they definitely have to be careful about not inciting violence in others, and this is part of daily life.

I have been with my DH since school, for over 25 years I have seen him attacked unprovoked numerous times in the past by other men. He even spent weeks in hospital after being jumped unprovoked buy a group of teenage lads, who were drunk.

By constantly complaining about men does not help, many men are ware of how women feel but many also feel powerless to defend themselves from other men. white washing men serves zero purpose.

What?
You totally misread what I said.

I didn't say that all men will lose self control and power to the extent where they will rape a woman. I didn't say that at all.

I meant if you put a good looking woman in front of a man, he will become flustered, all of his attention will begin to go on her, she will have a LOT of power over how he acts.

Sexual desire has a LOT of power over men.

My male friend was talking to me about another male friend recently. He said that if he is just out with the lads, this guy is really easy to talk to. He said, if there is a woman around, this guy becomes totally different, because he is so anxious for the woman to like him

Dear God. That poor woman.

And fewer than 2% of reported - REPORTED - rapes see charges at all.

Hilarious.

Although whilst that post is largely bonkers, there may be an element of truth behind it.

I take Sara Pascoe with a pinch of salt (although do like her a lot) but I read her book, Money, Sex and Power and she discusses research done where men do actually lose their grip on sense and sensibility when on the cusp of sex or sexual gratification. To the point where they will overlook what is morally correct.

Obviously this in no way excuses men for anything but might partially explain why men, who are dubious to begin with, do what they do without any thought of the consequences.

I worked in a male dominated environment for a few years. Conversations that took place there certainly seemed like they were discussing rape, but it was joked about and dismissed when I complained about it.

I remember some revolting comments from so-called decent family men. They certainly weren’t shy about discussing past sexual exploits.

Amongst the discussions were comments about “she can’t say no if she’s asleep”, “ it’s not rape if she can’t remember it” “no means maybe, maybe means yes” and far, far worse. Prosecution rates of rape mean that most rapes can be dismissed as her fault, or a misunderstanding. The conversations I heard were about rape, whether convicted or not.

As for women watching porn, when women are raping men and killing men at the same rate men are women, when boys are assaulted and harassed in school by girls at the rate girls currently are, then your comment stands up. Right now it’s no more than whataboutery and designed to dismiss many women’s negative experiences at the hands of men and boys.

What?
You totally misread what I said.

I didn't misread what you said. You specifically said men lose all self control and power around attractive women.
You're now countering that by suggesting that means men will just get a little flustered around attractive women.
Getting flustered is not losing all self control and power.

I take Sara Pascoe with a pinch of salt (although do like her a lot) but I read her book, Money, Sex and Power and she discusses research done where men do actually lose their grip on sense and sensibility when on the cusp of sex or sexual gratification. To the point where they will overlook what is morally correct.

I think there's a point before a man gets to this point though where sensible decisions can be made.
The pp was suggesting that just seeing an attractive woman makes men lose all self control... I'm not buying that!

Kansas State University, eh? And the "father" of attachment research? This is extremely funny. Whoever cobbled together that little biased summary of scrapings of academic research wouldn't even pass an undergraduate first year level exam. Very, very amusing.

I find the problem with a lot of men is that they are simply not intelligent enough for what they are trying to do. They want to walk into a well paid job - they aren't competent enough. They want a beautiful wife/girlfriend - they aren't good enough. This makes them angry and they think they are entitled to all of that. And the really dumb ones like to classify women to make themselves feel safe, because the world is a scary place when no-one wants you or admires you. They also don't generally mix with high earning women, so they have to come out with nonsense like the above about maternity and how all women are after men for their 50kpa salary.

Recent psychological research (and no, I'm not going to cite my favourite writers on an internet discussion group) indicates that a lot of psychopath type behaviour has a genetic component due to a lack of neural connections from the amygdala and the rest of the brain. Not all psychopaths become criminals but they are generally all dysfunctional because they have a personality disorder.

Rather than telling themselves that women should do this and that, these men who are coming out with these statements would be better advised to consider whether they are in fact suffering from machiavellianism, narcissism or ASPD and how wise their future actions are. One of the prime indicators of psychopathy is a failure to take responsibility for their own actions and to learn from their mistakes.